check out the ebay listing... im wondering if this is the real deal if its safe, i dont want to buy something that isnt safe for my motor... so im looking for some real answers on this before i buy anything

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors...h=014

 

I think you can use that on any B series motor. On my D, I took it to a machine shop to havee it reduced to only the alternator and then balanced.

 

It has to be machined in order to get a good fit.

 

Balance is the most important thing, not so much the weight of it.

 

examples of why i don't run a ctr n1 pulley..

https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=1354739
https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=2271058

 

okay but if its genuine ctr... which means honda made it and it was on the honda motor why would it still cause problems?

 

i have this same exact pulley...going on 2 years now. people will tell you that it will shatter your oil pump or something, but i personally think other factors have been involved on those motors. for every guy that says it does damage, there is another that has been using the pulley for years or 30,000 miles with no issues.

 

I was in this boat about 2 weeks ago and decided not to go with the CTR pulley. They are not harmonically balanced from the factory thus the reason they are known to destroy bearings and pumps. I was told this from Dave Blundell who created Crome, so I am guessing he knows a thing or 2.

I took my stock one to the machine shop, they told me they could not lathe it down to a single pulley but they did shave off some of the pulley.

 

i honestly don't know about the harmonics, but it seems ridiculous to me that honda would sell a performance part that was damaging to it's engines.
i'll be the first to post if my motor dies and i find metal shavings in the pan...but as of now i can only say great things about the pulley

btw, this pulley is 1/3 the weight of the stock one...1.5lbs vs 4.5
that alone makes it seem like a natural fit to me. these guys liked it too:
http://www.turbomagazine.com/f....html


Modified by zrickety at 4:56 PM 7/9/2008


Modified by zrickety at 4:58 PM 7/9/2008

 

I ran one for 5 years. then swapped to a aluminum copy of the ctr pulley which is almost half of the ctr weight(weighed less than 1 pound) and ran that for a couple years. still have the same motor.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by zrickety &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i honestly don't know about the harmonics, but it seems ridiculous to me that honda would sell a performance part that was damaging to it's engines.
i'll be the first to post if my motor dies and i find metal shavings in the pan...but as of now i can only say great things about the pulley

btw, this pulley is 1/3 the weight of the stock one...1.5lbs vs 4.5
that alone makes it seem like a natural fit to me. these guys liked it too:
http://www.turbomagazine.com/f....html


like he said why would honda make something that was harmful to the engine?...


Modified by zrickety at 4:56 PM 7/9/2008


Modified by zrickety at 4:58 PM 7/9/2008</TD></TR></TABLE>

 

ive ran the N1 pulley for about four months on an b18b1 with no issues. But there will be plenty of people tellin you not to. You gotta do what you wanna do. I went and purchased the pulley from honda for 75 bucks. I needed the pulley to clear my new traction bar and it did exactly that.

 

the n1 pulley was specifically made for the honda CTR n1 race car. Race cars have a lot different priority regarding engine longevity than those of us daily driving do. It is just a fluke that they sell them through the dealership.

My statement is this: If you were to ask what a Mechanical Engineer had to say about running an undamped crank pulley on a daily driver, what would they say?

My thought is that on a daily driver, or an engine for which longevity is valued, they would say: Don't do it. The harmonics involved in a running IC engine are bad, and cause metal and bearing fatigue.

For an engine who's sole purpose is to win races, or be as fast as possible, then undamped might be the way to go depending on number of cylinders and internal balance, metal fatigue be damned. If it breaks, you rebuild it or buy another one.

The choice at the end of the day is up to you. I can tell you, the day I consider my car a full out race car, I would consider putting an n1 pulley on. Right now though, I still drive my car every day to and from work, and I don't want to walk.

 

You sir win a cookie for giving the correct answer!

 

i realize this is a pointless argument, but aren't race cars subject to much more intense abuse than a daily driver ever sees? if this pulley is as bad as you make it out to be, they should be destroying those race motors in a number of laps, probably before the race or series is over. would a race team accept premature wear to save a few lbs? i doubt it. motors are expensive to replace.

also, i've seen a number of pulleys, unorthodox comes to mind, that don't have any dampening material.

and as far as honda selling this pulley as a fluke, c'mon. if it was that bad for our cars, people would be up in arms and honda would pull it off the shelf. they discontinue all kind of crx parts we want to buy, but they continue to sell this pulley. just doesn't make sense to me.

a lighter pulley should be less stressful on the engine, end of story.

 

My point in posting was just to explain that there are some cons to running an undamped pulley. People (like the OP, as well as people in this thread) should atleast be informed that there are 2 sides to the story. That is my point of posting. the only reason i chimed in is because no one really told the op the other side of the story until i posted. While i am sure the anecdotal evidence provided by several commenters is true, the evidence is only anecdotal. the physics behind an IC engine however dictate that another scenario besides this anecdotal evidence is going on. If anyone would like to read up on their own, feel free to hit up google book search with the keywords "engine harmonics".

Additionally, to be honest, i have no idea what racing teams commonly use for a pulley or harmonic damper system. I do know that most run dry sump oiling systems though, which means you arent going to be shattering a oil pump from undamped harmonics. Likewise, a lot of turbo guys run fluidamper or similar pulleys, or stock ones for harmonic damping reasons.

I am more than happy to continue the conversation in PM if anyone wants to hear some fire and brimstone physics preaching..

 

the more information on this subject the better. i understand your point on engine harmonics, i just think that the the motor is internally stable. what's going on at either end (flywheel or crank pulley) is changed by alot of people...pulleys, clutches, flywheels, all without issues. that thin layer of rubber on the stock pulley might absorb a few vibrations in the drivetrain and make the engine feel smoother to the driver, but that's probably the limit of it's usefulness. the only thing that felt different to me after changing to this pulley was a slight increase in power. if it was sending bad vibes, i'd probably have felt that by now and pulled it off

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by sanimalp &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">the n1 pulley was specifically made for the honda CTR n1 race car. Race cars have a lot different priority regarding engine longevity than those of us daily driving do. It is just a fluke that they sell them through the dealership.

My statement is this: If you were to ask what a Mechanical Engineer had to say about running an undamped crank pulley on a daily driver, what would they say?

My thought is that on a daily driver, or an engine for which longevity is valued, they would say: Don't do it. The harmonics involved in a running IC engine are bad, and cause metal and bearing fatigue.

For an engine who's sole purpose is to win races, or be as fast as possible, then undamped might be the way to go depending on number of cylinders and internal balance, metal fatigue be damned. If it breaks, you rebuild it or buy another one.

The choice at the end of the day is up to you. I can tell you, the day I consider my car a full out race car, I would consider putting an n1 pulley on. Right now though, I still drive my car every day to and from work, and I don't want to walk. </TD></TR></TABLE>





One reason this pulley might (I emphasize it might; this is a gray area) not be a problem for most people is the size of our motors number of cylinders and its rod stroke ratio or whatever, if it were a V8 with an undampened pulley it would be causing problems real quick.


You should look at it like this, it might in the long run damage the motor but all for a measly 1-5 WHP.




Modified by grog at 9:31 PM 7/10/2008