you know i dont get this. everyone says the d17 engine is bad with upgrades and mods such as exhaust, intake, and aftermarket pistons , etc.
but what other car would respond better to those? a sentra, accord, lancer, forestor, or what? i dont think any car would gain much horspower with those upgrades.. maybe with like a huge engine? im not talking about expensive cars, just small cars...

just wondering, cuz not everyone here is going to buy the k20 and put it in themselves, they'd pay for the labor and the motor and its just like buying a new car...

 

honda engines have responded fairly well to bolt ons in the past.

as far as other cars are concerned Trans AMs, Cameros, Mustangs, Corvettes, etc all respond to bolt ons pretty well

 

with the d17, i/e/h will prolly only give you 1-9 hp gain. 9 if you lucky. (doesn't work well with bolt on, gains are little)
not worth the money.

with the older d16, b series, and k series motors, i/e/h will give you 15+ hp. (works better with bolt on.)
more worth the money

 

You can realize really good gains with kpro, cam, and GOOD i/h/e.

 

Are you kidding me most other engines see gains by opening the stock air-box. Intake, down pipe, and exhuast in a lancer Evo net gains are problly equal to a d17's hp.

 

your comparing a 4g63 to a d17. it starts not only at 286hp and 289tq (on the evo ix) but its boosted too so thats not too fair of a comparison.

plus, the d17 is a small SOHC motor. bolt ons do almost nothing to it without proper tuning and EMS

 

I did a little research and found that the d17 is a case of old corporate tradition, having the engine on the right side as opposed to the left, and rotating the opposite direction to modern 4 bangers is an old honda design. The company did their homework when they developed the modern techy k but the d17 is based on an old design of honda engines apparently. Good for gas not for hp. also explains why k swaps, though the only one feasible for our cars, is more difficult than other honda chassis swaps. My opinion is one of the main points to owning a honda is reliability, so k swap or find another honda, because the d17 just wasnt originally designed for performance, and heavily moding it is like putting a mentally challenged kid on riods, mad waste of money.

 

to each his own. add FI to the d17 and its a totally different car.

 

I've seen decent gains on NA D17s. But that was with I/H/E, Intake manifold, cam, semi built head, and k-pro of course.

 

the D17 engine was engineered entirely for fuel efficiency, not power. In theory, all 4 stroke gasoline engines work the same, however, comparing a D17 to a 4G63 or K20a, etc. is like comparing apples to oranges. And of course domestics respond well to mods, the have twice the number of cylinders and not entirely engineered for efficiency.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by EvDog03 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I did a little research and found that the d17 is a case of old corporate tradition, having the engine on the right side as opposed to the left, and rotating the opposite direction to modern 4 bangers is an old honda design. The company did their homework when they developed the modern techy k but the d17 is based on an old design of honda engines apparently. Good for gas not for hp. also explains why k swaps, though the only one feasible for our cars, is more difficult than other honda chassis swaps. My opinion is one of the main points to owning a honda is reliability, so k swap or find another honda, because the d17 just wasnt originally designed for performance, and heavily moding it is like putting a mentally challenged kid on riods, mad waste of money.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Yeah, you're right.... d17's don't make power....

 

yah but doesn't fI cause a lot issues, with blown heads and all. I heard you could get it done right but it almost costs as a swap. One of the main reasons to owning a honda is the reliability, if you sacrifice that you coulda bought a shitty demestic muscle.

 

a lot people can build a turbo system run high psi and get nice power gains, but are on the constant verge of exploding.

 

There are three ways to blow a headgasket...
Detonation (good tuning and management will take care of that)
Headlift from too much power (headstuds with proper tq take care of that)
Overheating (I'm on stock cooling system with no issues)

I daily drive my car 20 miles each way in dc traffic and have no reliability issues. I've spent a little more than a swap would cost but I have way more power and better gas mileage. Reliability isn't an issue for me.

But what's reliability, when you have alot of power? If you run a high power boost setup (which for real gains, you pretty much have to run boost), you can explode at any time if you don't know what's going on and don't monitor the engine properly. Stupid things happen and your setup is only as reliable as you let it be....

 

wow, thats actually really impressive, I've just heard so many negative things about boosting, many were telling me there was no way to boost without constant problems, but im not retarded and i take extreme **** care of my car so maybe there is hope. I wish i could just have a sound 200whp, I spend so much time searching for ways to make this thing a little quicker and if there is a way to boost right then i take back what i said about only going swap if you have the money.

 

it would be cool to turbo my engine. but idk if its worth it; i mean it has about 109,000 miles on it.. but if your only boosting 9 psi you can get 200 hp? thats not bad!!

and i thought k pro did nothing for the car? i heard 1-2 hp. does it have to have turbo in order to be programmed with the kpro?

 

I hit 195 whp on 5.5 psi on my old turbo with no cam. I'm running a much more efficient turbo now, so I'm prolly making about 275-ish at 7-8 psi.

When hondata tuned a stock d17, they picked up about 25-30 whp just from tuning on kpro, no other mods...

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by hondalove323 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">it would be cool to turbo my engine. but idk if its worth it; i mean it has about 109,000 miles on it.. but if your only boosting 9 psi you can get 200 hp? thats not bad!!

and i thought k pro did nothing for the car? i heard 1-2 hp. does it have to have turbo in order to be programmed with the kpro?</TD></TR></TABLE>

where have you been getting your info from? depending on the size of your turbo, you can get 200whp with less than 10lbs of boost. as for kpro, its probably the best thing to happen to Honda's in the way of an EMS ever. Oh how i wish it worked with autos... and i think i already know what andys reply to this is

 

oh really wow. how many miles do you guys have with your turbos? well probably not a stock d17 huh?

 

with gas going out the roof. $6 expected next year [freak] getting a faster car lol.

 

my 01 only has 52k so im good for a turbo on low psi, but idk if i wanna lose mpg with the prices, but speed might be worth it.

 

i picked up a k24 out of an accord i think i might put it in my 01 4dr and spray the hell out of it!

 

I have a 03 civic lx and i wana turn in into a vtec with a head swap, how much of again would i get if any? and whats the difference between geting the head swap and lets say getting the entire motor from an 03 DX that already has vtec

 

go to faq it should be under there, but i believe its a 10hp gain and aprox. 4-5 hours labor

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by andyman97 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I hit 195 whp on 5.5 psi on my old turbo with no cam. I'm running a much more efficient turbo now, so I'm prolly making about 275-ish at 7-8 psi.

When hondata tuned a stock d17, they picked up about 25-30 whp just from tuning on kpro, no other mods...</TD></TR></TABLE>

So properly tuned on KPro you can go from ~108WHP to 130WHP+ on a stock D17? For the price of an EMS, it's almost worth it for those who need a little more but not a lot more.

If this is true, I guess the question becomes are there proficient "tuners" able to yield the same results with kpro that hondata's staff achieved.