lookin to make 310-320hp. no turbo tho. should i switch it out for f-series crank or what?


Modified by shawn270 at 12:59 AM 6/20/2008

 

f23 + deckplate

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by shawn270 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">lookin to make 310-320hp. no turbo tho. should i switch it out for f-series crank or what?


Modified by shawn270 at 12:59 AM 6/20/2008</TD></TR></TABLE>

Buy one of my H22s.

 

lol the other thread got locked.

 

not that it really matters because you are going to need a crank regardless of the route you choose? are you building your engine or going forced induction? Brian Crower makes a very nice crank but it's pricey. Perhaps an H23 crank might work for your situation at a fraction of the price.
Any other guys have some input on this?

 

either a h23 or stock h22, prolly be able to turn it just a little tighter w/h22 crank, but both pieces are amazing really. ive seen stock cranks after being run stock for well over 100k, then make 351whp boosted...every journal was +-.0006" so id prolly never really spend money on a crank after seeing that and a few other things.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by jeremiah87 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">either a h23 or stock h22, prolly be able to turn it just a little tighter w/h22 crank, but both pieces are amazing really. ive seen stock cranks after being run stock for well over 100k, then make 351whp boosted...every journal was +-.0006" so id prolly never really spend money on a crank after seeing that and a few other things.</TD></TR></TABLE>

you must have never seen a stock h23 crank break

they are actually known for breaking. to the op, if you really want to make 300+ whp n/a you are going to have to go w/ an aftermarket crank most likely in the form of a storker kit.

am i the only one here who realizes this guy wants to make 300whp+ all motor???

before you start this build i would suggest doing alot of reaserch and then some more research otherwise you are going to spend alot of money and come up way short of your goal.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by NAH2B &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

you must have never seen a stock h23 crank break

they are actually known for breaking. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Really? This is news to me... as I am sure it is to a lot of other engine builders who use them sucessfully as well.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">to the op, if you really want to make 300+ whp n/a you are going to have to go w/ an aftermarket crank most likely in the form of a storker kit.</TD></TR></TABLE>
So how many engines have you built that make 300whp? Seems like you are trying to speak from experience here... well at least what you have read rather than experienced.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">am i the only one here who realizes this guy wants to make 300whp+ all motor???</TD></TR></TABLE> This is exactly why I told him to buy ONE of my H22s.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">before you start this build i would suggest doing alot of reaserch and then some more research otherwise you are going to spend alot of money and come up way short of your goal.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I would suggest YOU do a lot of research.



Modified by 2point6 at 5:40 PM 6/21/2008

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 2point6 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Really? This is news to me... as I am sure it is to a lot of other engine builders who use them sucessfully as well.


So how many engines have you built that make 300whp? Seems like you are trying to speak from experience here... well at least what you have read rather than experienced.

This is exactly why I told him to buy ONE of my H22s.

I would suggest YOU do a lot of research.

Modified by 2point6 at 5:40 PM 6/21/2008</TD></TR></TABLE>

dude, whats your problem???

i would be willing to bet i have made more power n/a then you have

i know what it takes to make 300whp w/ an h and i also know what will and wont cut it, and trust me an h23 crank wont

you have no idea who i am or what i have done so dont be so quick to jump on someone who is just trying to give a hand.

and btw, why should he buy one of your h22s? do they make the 320whp he is looking for?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by NAH2B &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

dude, whats your problem???

i would be willing to bet i have made more power n/a then you have

i know what it takes to make 300whp w/ an h and i also know what will and wont cut it, and trust me an h23 crank wont

you have no idea who i am or what i have done so dont be so quick to jump on someone who is just trying to give a hand.

and btw, why should he buy one of your h22s? do they make the 320whp he is looking for?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Like I said... do some research. I don't care who you are. Currently my "street" motor is making very close to what he is looking for. My race engines are making more. Thankyou.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 2point6 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Like I said... do some research. I don't care who you are. Currently my "street motor is making very close to what he is looking for. My race engineas are making more. Thankyou. </TD></TR></TABLE>

rather than arguing w/ you i will agree to disagree.

to the op, if you have any questions about using an h23 crank to make alot of power just pm me and i can give you some contact numbers of some pro racers and builders who used to build/run h motors and who have made the most hp w/ h motors to date. they will be more than happy to point you in the right direction.

i for one will never use another h23 crank in a "big" power motor after experiencing first hand what can happen

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by NAH2B &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

rather than arguing w/ you i will agree to disagree.

to the op, if you have any questions about using an h23 crank to make alot of power just pm me and i can give you some contact numbers of some pro racers and builders who used to build/run h motors and who have made the most hp w/ h motors to date. they will be more than happy to point you in the right direction.

i for one will never use another h23 crank in a "big" power motor after experiencing first hand what can happen </TD></TR></TABLE>

A mature reponse.

post the contact info here so all can benifit.

And... just for clarification, nowhere in this post did I say anything about the H23 crank being what it takes to make 300+ whp. I did say they weren't as prone to breaking as you might think. Look in the all motor section... there are new H series builds making close to what this guy needs with stock bore on a 95mm crank. Research is key.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 2point6 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

A mature reponse.

post the contact info here so all can benifit.</TD></TR></TABLE>

i doubt guys like the braunings and norris would want to be bothered all day w/ phone calls from everyone and their brother.

if someone is serious about making alot of power w/ an h series i would be more than happy to help point them in the right direction.

im not sying i know everything there is to know or that i have made the power these guys have made, but i have been around the block more than once and have been in the game and at the track for 10+ years now so im very confident w/ my knowledge and resources.

btw, for anyone interested i will soon be starting another build and will reach the 300whp mark. i will post a thread in the allmotor forum when the time comes.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 2point6 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Like I said... do some research. I don't care who you are. Currently my "street" motor is making very close to what he is looking for. My race engines are making more. Thankyou. </TD></TR></TABLE>

i really dont want to argue w/ you, but i am curious to ask....you have have made 320whp w/ an n/a h series?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by NAH2B &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

i doubt guys like the braunings and norris would want to be bothered all day w/ phone calls from everyone and their brother. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Sure namedropping is fine, but those guys went to K series right away... and for obvious reasons no doubt, but more and more people are digging into the H22 currently. Technology and support is increasing for this platform, so I feel your information is a little outdated.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">im not sying i know everything there is to know or that i have made the power these guys have made, but i have been around the block more than once and have been in the game and at the track for 10+ years now so im very confident w/ my knowledge and resources.

btw, for anyone interested i will soon be starting another build and will reach the 300whp mark. i will post a thread in the allmotor forum when the time comes.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I have been in this game for as long as you. I will look foreward to following the post you make towards 300whp. I think this fits right in with several others who are already close to those numbers currently.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 2point6 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Sure namedropping is fine, but those guys went to K series right away... and for obvious reasons no doubt, but more and more people are digging into the H22 currently. Technology and support is increasing for this platform, so I feel your information is a little outdated.

I have been in this game for as long as you. I will look foreward to following the post you make towards 300whp. I think this fits right in with several others who are already close to those numbers currently. </TD></TR></TABLE>

actually the braunings are still very much involved in h series motors. and as far as norris goes, he was very much on top of the h series game back in the day. i was there to see him and eric agular line up b series vs h series

and although these guys are old school that doesnt change the fact that an h23 crank will be just as weak today as it was 10 years ago so whats your point?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by NAH2B &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

actually the braunings are still very much involved in h series motors. and as far as norris goes, he was very much on top of the h series game back in the day. i was there to see him and eric agular line up b series vs h series

and although these guys are old school that doesnt change the fact that an h23 crank will be just as weak today as it was 10 years ago so whats your point?

</TD></TR></TABLE>

As I already posted... nowhere in this thread did I say a factory 95mm crank was what it would take to make 300 whp either. However there are a couple builders here who are really close. What is your point? lol.

"Back in the day"... is just that. Back in the day. Fast foreward to now.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by NAH2B &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

i really dont want to argue w/ you, but i am curious to ask....you have have made 320whp w/ an n/a h series?

</TD></TR></TABLE>

well?

and if so, what type of dyno was used to obtain these numbers?

i will admit, if you have made 320+ whp w/ an h then you are the man, especially since i have yet to see a 300whp dynograph from anything but a dynapack.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by NAH2B &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

well?

and if so, what type of dyno was used to obtain these numbers?

i will admit, if you have made 320+ whp w/ an h then you are the man, especially since i have yet to see a 300whp dynograph from anything but a dynapack.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Yes. and it has been done on a dyna pack as well... not a high reading one like Church's either. In fact I will be redynoing my "street" engine this tuesday and with that I should eclipse the 300whp mark in 100+ degree temps.

Here is my rundown on that motor so you can dispute:
90mm bore, 97.75mm stroke 12.8/1 comp, vance and Hines headwork, 50mm itbs, skunk pro 3 cams.

This engine previously made 289.8 whp and 214wtq on 12.5/1 and pro 2 cams.

These figures were also backed up on a dynojet as a comparison to a local dyno.

This is just my engine built for my Accord. All of this information has been posted here and on other sites.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 2point6 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

As I already posted... nowhere in this thread did I say a factory 95mm crank was what it would take to make 300 whp either. However there are a couple builders here who are really close. What is your point? lol.

"Back in the day"... is just that. Back in the day. Fast foreward to now.</TD></TR></TABLE>

my point is that you said my info was outdated. well the info i gave was that h23 cranks are weak. so what has changed from back then to now?????

i too was clos4e to making this power w/ a stock h23 crank on a dynojet and probably would have made it if my headwork didnt actually cause a power LOSS

yeah, i made about 280 on a stock crank AFTER losing power from a bad portting job. this was w/ s2 stg.2 cams, euro r im, and a stock tb

think of what i would have done w/ GOOD headwork among other things.....

this time i will make sure the head is done by someone who knows h heads and i will be going w/ pro3's. however i WILL NOT be going w/ another h23 crank due to the fact that it BROKE and mine is not the only one

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by NAH2B &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

my point is that you said my info was outdated. well the info i gave was that h23 cranks are weak. so what has changed from back then to now?????
</TD></TR></TABLE>
All I said to you was that a lot of builders are using them currently with exceptional results. NOT, like how you were making it seem.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i too was clos4e to making this power w/ a stock h23 crank on a dynojet and probably would have made it if my headwork didnt actually cause a power LOSS </TD></TR></TABLE>
That's a bummer. seriously.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">yeah, i made about 280 on a stock crank AFTER losing power from a bad portting job. this was w/ s2 stg.2 cams, euro r im, and a stock tb

think of what i would have done w/ GOOD headwork among other things.....

this time i will make sure the head is done by someone who knows h heads and i will be going w/ pro3's. however i WILL NOT be going w/ another h23 crank due to the fact that it BROKE and mine is not the only one </TD></TR></TABLE>

I hear you. I hope for the best for the new project you are taking on. The head is where all the Magic happens.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 2point6 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Yes. and it has been done on a dyna pack as well... not a high reading one like Church's either. In fact I will be redynoing my "street" engine this tuesday and with that I should eclipse the 300whp mark in 100+ degree temps.

Here is my rundown on that motor so you can dispute:
90mm bore, 97.75mm stroke 12.8/1 comp, vance and Hines headwork, 50mm itbs, skunk pro 3 cams.</TD></TR></TABLE>

so your "street engine" consists of 90mm bore and itb's? alrighty then.

i have only seen one dynapack that reads lower than any dynojet and it was setup that way on purpose. w/ your setup you should see well over 300 on a dynapack. put it on the a dynojet and see what it does i still think it will make 300 as long as you have done your part w/ proper assembly but it will be a much more respectable number coming from a dynojet to me atleast. just my .02

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by NAH2B &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

so your "street engine" consists of 90mm bore and itb's? alrighty then.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

Yeah... why not? Ok, maybe the ITBs you feel is too much, but I only gained 8whp up top with them. These are only 50mm also... not 54mm like others run. I will be changing those, but I am trying to minimize my expenses with this engine that I have docummented all over the net. This IMO, is a very easily duplicated build up.
I feel that my headwork is what has set this particular engine apart from other "like" engines. My new portwork is being done in-house and has so far proven to make more power than my current Vance and hines work. I will be posting my new pojects soon, as I am currently working with Web Cam on their extended H22 rocker arm set up... which currently I am the first and only to have at this time.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i have only seen one dynapack that reads lower than any dynojet and it was setup that way on purpose. w/ your setup you should see well over 300 on a dynapack. put it on the a dynojet and see what it does i still think it will make 300 as long as you have done your part w/ proper assembly but it will be a much more respectable number coming from a dynojet to me atleast. just my .02</TD></TR></TABLE>

I understand how you feel about the dynojet, but all of my testing has been done on the same dyno for consistancy. The Locash racing Dynapak is known for reading low.

 

well goodluck w/ your setup, hope you meet your goal

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by NAH2B &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">well goodluck w/ your setup, hope you meet your goal </TD></TR></TABLE>

Well... with this "street" engine anyway. My new "race" set-up has become far more interesting...

Good luck with your build as well. I hope you surpass your goal.

I am sorry we got started on a bad foot. It was the way I worded my first post. I appologize. I am sure with your soon to come contributions to this site we will learn from each other.


Modified by 2point6 at 8:00 PM 6/21/2008