i just purchased a set of recaros for my eg and i want to upgrade my seat belts.
my question is how safe are harnesses for street driving? should i opt for a 4 over 5 point belt?
i use the car as a weekend warrior it sees the drag strip and weekend drives on the street, but always wanted to try a autocross at least once or twice.
i do not have a roll cage if that matters or not i dont know.

posted here because alot of you guys upgrade your seat belts and would be able to help me out.

 

sounds like stock belts would be best for you.

 

i had wanted to upgrade. the car had a 4 point before so i do not have the stock hardware.

 

Do this. Search for "harness" and then search for "street harness", both in the archives. When you're done reading through the 5 gillion pages that already exist answering your exact question in absurd amounts of detail, give yourself a pat on the back. I'm serious.

Edit: In case you need a simple answer, it's stupid to "upgrade" seatbelts for a street car, even if you'll autox it twice a year.

 

 

I really wanted to use Picard, but I was too lazy to find it

 

This will answer part of your question https://honda-tech.com/zerothread/2222804

 

again? Wow, talk about the same question being answered here everyday.

 

Welcome to Honda-Tech RR/AX in the winter.

 

Seriously though, to help you out. I had every question I raised answered by searching through the archives and finding the same question being asked. You'll be amazed. Anything from generlized "is it safe?" to something specific as to what size, thread pitch and bolt you need to plug that random hole.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Stinkycheezmonky &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I really wanted to use Picard, but I was too lazy to find it </TD></TR></TABLE>

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Lo-Buck EF &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

</TD></TR></TABLE>

I'll do you one better

http://youtube.com/watch?v=Bx3S5mqvvig

 

Glad to see this forums members come out in full force when its to flame someone in a thread. Way to stick together on the bandwagon

 

they are not flaming you, they are just saying to use the search function. the info lurks within the search function..

but to answer your question fast simple and to the point, wel no they arent safe for the street. the rest you can search for the reasons why also there are 2 other threads lurking in here as i speak about harnesses.

 

heres a good vid showing why u shouldnt
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rUv2iwFr-7A

no roll bar/cage with harness can equal crushed spine.

 

thanks. I did search and used link posted and found some info as mentioned. Saw a video that told of danger of submarine'ing in a harness then said if you use a slightly different harness its twists the body preventing the sliding under. So that's why I posted my question. I've seen many cars with and without a roll cage. are harnesses designed to only work properly when used with a roll cage??

 

rollBAR, a cage doesnt go in a street car. period.

and you are talking about a 5 point harness. the 5th belt is the anti submarine belt.

just use stock seatbelts dude. you dont need a harness. and you shouldnt use one unless you have a rollbar in the car.

 

seriously. you know how i know your not reading? this topic was covered throughly back in '01. archives are your friend.
short-properly installed harness used with rollbar. but only at autocross or hpde events. do not use them on the street.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by VtecnTurbo &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">are harnesses designed to only work properly when used with a roll cage??
</TD></TR></TABLE>

i think this is the key question.

i believe the seat, the 5/6 pt harness and roll bar/cage do work as a system. the harness needs to anchor itself to a solid part of the chassis and the rollbar with suitable harness bar is an extension of the chassis. theres really no other available anchor point in a stripped car. also, the appropriate holes need to be in the seat for not only the shoulder harnesses, but the submarine belt in the bottom. routing them any other way is not how they were designed and intended.

also, i think using stock 3 pt seat belts over a high bolster fixed back race seat is not suitable at all either. because the seat will interfere with the 3 pt seat belts and create space between the belt and body. so you cant use a race seat without a harness. and as i said above, you cant use a harness without a good rollbar, at least not without a fixed harness bar.

understanding this, you can make a few compromises i think. but you wont get the same level of performance i think. such as you can just weld in a harness bar into the B pillars of your car simply to have something sturdy to mount the shoulder harness to. however, its not ideal, and i wouldnt trust it in a roll over situation. if thats fine with you on an autocross course, then ok.

also you can use a more "street" (typically reclining) seat that has low bolsters so that its designed for a 4pt harness and stock seat belts. now this i would think is strictly used for autocross situations where its JUST supposed to help hold you into your seat. 4pt harness system is not ideal. and again, available mounting points for the shoulder harnesses probably means long lengths for the shoulder harness which further compromise the effectiveness (somewhat debatable) of the harness.

in general tho, if you dont have all 3 (race seat, 5/6 pt harness and rollbar) youre not any safer on the street.


Modified by Tyson at 11:55 AM 2/21/2008

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Tyson &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">in general tho, if you dont have all 3 (race seat, 5/6 pt harness and rollbar) youre not any safer on the street.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

So let's say you have all three. Driving on the street to a track event, I'm not sure if I would either wear the harness or the stock 3point. One of my thoughts for wearing the stock belt is most people know how to operate (buckle/unbuckle) this belt. So if you are involved in a bad accident and need to be extricated by a passing good samaritan, then they can unbuckle quickly instead of trying to figure out how to operate the mechanism on a 5/6 point harness. But you have to get in and through the accident first, so I think maybe I should wear the harness?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by VtecnTurbo &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Glad to see this forums members come out in full force when its to flame someone in a thread. Way to stick together on the bandwagon </TD></TR></TABLE>

Way to not search, toolbag Your question is valid, your method of questioning is the problem. And MY problem with you is that this has been answered SO MANY GODDAMN TIMES it isn't funny.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by JamesS &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

So let's say you have all three. Driving on the street to a track event, I'm not sure if I
would either wear the harness or the stock 3point. </TD></TR></TABLE>

There's no problem with using a stock 3-point with a race seat and rollbar if you have it mounted properly (that is, routed through the belt holes, not over the bolsters). I had my car setup to use both so I could drive it comfortably to the track.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Stinkycheezmonky &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

There's no problem with using a stock 3-point with a race seat and rollbar if you have it mounted properly (that is, routed through the belt holes, not over the bolsters). I had my car setup to use both so I could drive it comfortably to the track.</TD></TR></TABLE>

how do you get the lap belt of a stock 3 pt through the holes in the seat???

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by JamesS &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

So let's say you have all three. Driving on the street to a track event, I'm not sure if I would either wear the harness or the stock 3point. One of my thoughts for wearing the stock belt is most people know how to operate (buckle/unbuckle) this belt. So if you are involved in a bad accident and need to be extricated by a passing good samaritan, then they can unbuckle quickly instead of trying to figure out how to operate the mechanism on a 5/6 point harness. But you have to get in and through the accident first, so I think maybe I should wear the harness?</TD></TR></TABLE>

you dont have to be a professional racer to figure out how to unlock any cam or latch mechanism....

this is something so trivial its not worrying about.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Tyson &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

how do you get the lap belt of a stock 3 pt through the holes in the seat???</TD></TR></TABLE>

unbolt the bottom, put it through the outer lap belt hole and bolt it back to the car.