I have a 00 GSR w/ around 130k miles on it and I'm going through about a quart of oil every 250-300 miles... and I barely ever hit VTEC. I did a compression test and it was even and strong across. I haven't noticed any smoke at all (it even passed NJ inspection for visible smoke), and there are definitely NO leaks anywhere.

I'm thinking it is the valve guide seals, but how can I be certain?

PS. I will be performing a leakdown test this Saturday as well.

thanks for any help!

 

You will be certain saturday when you do the leak down test it should tell you where the oil is going. If it was valve guides your car would still burn the oil. What do your spark plugs look like? Do they look black or have oil deposits?

 

the last time the plugs were replaced (about 3-4 months ago) they looked good, but I will check them out on saturday and see what they look like.

 

How is your PCV system?

Your valve guide seal problem wouldn't show up on a leakdown or compression test. The valve seals are OUTSIDE the cylinder. The valve face is what does the sealing of the cylinder.

These are cheap to replace. A speed shop around here quoted $200 parts and labor.

How are you sure it's not leaking? Is the WHOLE underside of your car bone dry? No valve cover leaks? Check your spark plug holes.

 

yea i know the valve guide seal problem wouldn't show in leakdown or compression, but if both tests' results are good, then does that mean that it is the guide seals? I will check on the PCV system as well when I do the leakdown... I've looked EVERYWHERE around the engine and have not seen any leaks, but will check again.

how would a bad PCV valve cause oil to burn? I've been searching through the archives and found little information. (I did find out how to test the PCV valve though, which is nice to know )

 

funny this came up...my 90 teg does the same thing but at a lesser rate, about 2 quarts of oil a month...referring to the reply above about the spark plugs, i replaced mine and they keep getting black, noticing a slight oil slick ring around the notches of the outside of the spark plug...think the tube seals are shot? But would that cause it to burn through this amount of oil?

 

ok so I did the leakdown and checked the PCV and spark plugs.

I had all acceptable percentages in leakdown.

PCV rattled only a very tiny small amount, so I have replaced that. EDITthe one that was in there was red and said "PACIFIC JAPAN".... I'm pretty sure that means it's original... anyone?)

Spark plugs were checked and 1 and 3 were perfect (nice gray ash) and 2 was pretty sooty and black, and 4 was so-so (a little gray and black) -- *there was NO oil on any of the plugs*

I once again THOROUGHLY searched the engine... no leaks anywhere. Even my pan is bone dry (it BETTER be, considering I just replaced the gasket like 3k miles ago)

But here's my question once again, how does a bad PCV cause oil to burn? And also, is there any other possibilities since basically everything else has been ruled out?

thank you!

 

Well, simply, and by no means am i a mechanic...but PCV is "Positive Crankcase Ventilation"...it sucks all those bad gasses out of the crankcase and gets rid of em...they can get clogged from time to time and back up, great to replace once every few months...in fact, most people I have talked to have said that the oil canister they add to the engine helps with the PCV system...newho, PCV cannot directly relate to burning oil, but could be some evidence that something else is going on, that is causing you to burn a lil oil...also something you might want to check is something called "Start-Up Syndrome"...on many older cars, such as mine...oil builds up on the lifters because of old leaky rings...especially when the car sits for a day or two, depending on how bad the rings are...have someone start the car and stand behind it...can smell it, and most likely see some blue smoke coming out...should only burn for a few seconds...indicative of leaky rings...add some oil treatment, should run like a beaut...hope that helps!

 

yea i understand what the PCV does, just don't quite get how it causes oil to burn, but what you're saying makes sense. I haven't noticed any smoke, and my car isn't too old (2000) but I'll check out the "start-up syndrome" thing tomoro. I will be rebuilding the engine this summer though either way.

thanks for your input.

 

No problemo...lemme know how everything works out!

 

You can have good leak down and compression numbers and still burn oil through the rings. GSR rings are notorious culprits for oil consumption when you get into high mileage like you have. The problem likely is that the oil scraper or control rings have lost their tension and are no longer scraping enough excess oil off the cylinder walls. A quick fix would be to re-ring the pistons with the engine in the car but if you're going to rebuild the whole thing than that's much better. I would recommend going to a chromoly ring like hastings has or a total seal low friction setup, but the latter can get quite pricey. Keep in mind that you should let your machinist know what kind of ring you are using as chromoly rings should use a different honing procedure.

As for why a bad PCV system may cause oil consumption, I believe the theory is that if the valve stops working then crank case pressure will become excessive and can vent oil into the intake manifold. Personally, I find this difficult to accept as both vents are baffled. But weird **** happens.

 

I totally agree with Kchung, especially with your setup...low friction rings, at least from what I have heard, have benefits in a GSR setup...most people that do that swap with high mileage GSR motors end up rebuilding them because of the excess oil consumption.

As for the PCV, that is true also...look at old-school VW Jettas...was working on one with my buddy a few years back. which was a mistake to begin with...he ended up seeing a ton of oil inside of his intake manifold, hell his air filter was soaked with oil! Come again with that??? HIS AIR FILTER WAS SOAKED WITH OIL!!! Not a total PCV fault, but i found that his PCV valve needed to be replaced and helped a ton with it!

 

ah ok I see... yea this just sucks that i have to wait until summer tho but anyways... today i just went outside and hopped in my car to get new tires and the thing is smoking like crazy... my exhaust manifold is majorly cracked! and I'm supposed to be leaving NJ to go back to FL in a few days... this blows...

 

You should be able to pick up a used exhaust manifold for cheap. Check ads for your area.

 

well good news is that BECAUSE of the cracked header/manifold, I figured out where the oil is being lost. Apparently it was leaking from cylinder two into the header. Valve guide seals? how much do guide seals go for? I've read they're cheap, but what exactly does "cheap" mean?

Also, should i just look for an OEM header or go with an aftermarket one?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by drummr6 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">well good news is that BECAUSE of the cracked header/manifold, I figured out where the oil is being lost. Apparently it was leaking from cylinder two into the header. Valve guide seals? how much do guide seals go for? I've read they're cheap, but what exactly does "cheap" mean?

Also, should i just look for an OEM header or go with an aftermarket one?</TD></TR></TABLE>


Valve Seals are cheap indeed, for the full set, intake and exhaust would be $40.

Theres also a thread made by WildOutGSR(I think thats his sn) who made a full walk through on changing your valve seals.

 

sweet deal... yea i found that thread a while back... good stuff!

so... since i have oil leaking out the hole for the exhaust on cylinder 2, this indicates valve guide seals correct?

once again thanks for the help guys... this is really frustrating since I'm supposed to be leaving on thursday!

 

Yea i'd like to confirm that, my valve guide seals leaked a while back when i was putting the engine together and i had similar issues id definatly change that and while your at it change ur valve cover gasket as well.

 

awesome... yea well I'm hoping that this will fix the problem and it'll AT LEAST hold me over til summer when I rebuild.

anyone know of someone selling a HEADER? lol i need one BADDD!

 

Well lets see, a normal oil change interval is 3k. Thats means you are going through about 12 quarts of oil per oil change. That is a freaking lot of oil, more serious then just the valve seals i would say. Probably both the rings and valve seals. Plus like you said, you don't even vtec the thing, damn!

 

yea true... i'm hoping this at least helps cut oil consumption down... cuz there was a pretty large amt of oil coming out of the exhaust from the damn valve seal

 

well I just went and bought my Fel-Pro valve stem seals and they ALL have black springs... what's the deal? I thought intake was white/silver/metallic and exhaust was black... any ideas?

 

throw those fel-pro pieces of **** in the trash and do your car a favor, order OEM Honda ones.

 

LOL! i agree., i hate Felpro...funny thing is i had a 95 integbra that burned about 4 quarts a week and i shot the bluest smoke you would ever see out the exhaust...my cat was so backed up that once in a while exhast would stop coming out and i revved up and it shot this black blob of **** out of the exhaust..freakin hlarious man! i miss that car though, did so much work to the damn thing...

 

so, after calling around to basically EVERYWHERE, everyone had the same ****, so my dad and I said screw it and used the Fel-Pro ****... car's runnin great, no smoke, no burnt oil smell... we'll see if this continues...