Installed Eibach Sportlines... Now have issues..
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Installed Eibach Sportlines... Now have issues..
I have a 94 Accord LX 5spd. I installed Eibach Sportlines with KYB AGX struts on the front of my car. I also installed Camber kit, similar to those sold on ebay. The springs lower it 1.8" in the front. I have the AGX adjusted to #2 position.
I now notice that there is A LOT of rackling anytime I go through bumps in the road. I can definitely hear something like it is out. It sound as if something is loose. When I got home, I lifted the car and dropped it back down and when I lift it high enough, I hear a poping sound as if something is free to pop out of place as I unload the chassis. I checked all my bolts, and they all seem to be fine. I cut the bump stop in half. I got an alignment. They did the best they could, but they say that it still needs some more work.
Do you guys with lowering springs experience this? Is it the spring shaking around on the shocks? Or is there another problem?
I also notice that on the driver side, the shocks is all the way down to the brake line bracket, whereas on the passenger side, it is up in the position which I thought it should be, with about 1/2" between the brake bracket and the fork.
Firestone says that they were unable to get a better alignment than what they did and recommends that I take it to a professional alignment shop. This is the result that they got. Is this terrible alignment? What should I do to fix it? Could you comment as much about the alignment results as you can because I have no idea what anything on it means.
As far as the adjustment of the KYB AGX, I drove home with them set to #2 position. It was firm, but I could live with it. When I got home, I played with the settings, changing from 4 to 1. position 4 is definitely way too rough. I tried driving with it in position#1 and it was soft. I like this for everyday driving. Does it reduce the lifetime of these shocks riding in the soft position? I know I was supposed to get stiffer shocks for these springs, so am I cheating myself driving in position#1? I would definitely be fine driving in position#2 if it extends the life of my shocks, and it might be a better balance of firm sporty ride and comfort.
Modified by professorman at 10:41 PM 11/27/2007
I now notice that there is A LOT of rackling anytime I go through bumps in the road. I can definitely hear something like it is out. It sound as if something is loose. When I got home, I lifted the car and dropped it back down and when I lift it high enough, I hear a poping sound as if something is free to pop out of place as I unload the chassis. I checked all my bolts, and they all seem to be fine. I cut the bump stop in half. I got an alignment. They did the best they could, but they say that it still needs some more work.
Do you guys with lowering springs experience this? Is it the spring shaking around on the shocks? Or is there another problem?
I also notice that on the driver side, the shocks is all the way down to the brake line bracket, whereas on the passenger side, it is up in the position which I thought it should be, with about 1/2" between the brake bracket and the fork.
Firestone says that they were unable to get a better alignment than what they did and recommends that I take it to a professional alignment shop. This is the result that they got. Is this terrible alignment? What should I do to fix it? Could you comment as much about the alignment results as you can because I have no idea what anything on it means.
As far as the adjustment of the KYB AGX, I drove home with them set to #2 position. It was firm, but I could live with it. When I got home, I played with the settings, changing from 4 to 1. position 4 is definitely way too rough. I tried driving with it in position#1 and it was soft. I like this for everyday driving. Does it reduce the lifetime of these shocks riding in the soft position? I know I was supposed to get stiffer shocks for these springs, so am I cheating myself driving in position#1? I would definitely be fine driving in position#2 if it extends the life of my shocks, and it might be a better balance of firm sporty ride and comfort.
Modified by professorman at 10:41 PM 11/27/2007
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according to the alignment sheet...the alignment for the fronts seem ok. theu adjusted the toe to zero or close to it on the left. toe is the most important for tire wear. if u got a camber kit they adjusted it a little...however if i had this car in my shop i would have tried to make both sides even...your right and left are .6 away....esp if u installed camber kit on it. i believe caster isn't adjustable...but camber effects caster and toe.
however for the rears if i'm correct i think should have toe adjustment...didn't seem like he adjusted the right rear toe...unless the adjustment is at the limit....did he tell u why he couldn't do it? o yea did u have rear camber kit or no?
for the fronts i think having a little negative camber is ok...gives it a little better handling.
however for the rears if i'm correct i think should have toe adjustment...didn't seem like he adjusted the right rear toe...unless the adjustment is at the limit....did he tell u why he couldn't do it? o yea did u have rear camber kit or no?
for the fronts i think having a little negative camber is ok...gives it a little better handling.
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Re: (supracrx)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by supracrx »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">however for the rears if I'm correct i think should have toe adjustment...didn't seem like he adjusted the right rear toe...unless the adjustment is at the limit....did he tell u why he couldn't do it? o yea did u have rear camber kit or no? </TD></TR></TABLE>
I have stock springs/shocks in the rear. I do not have any camber kit or anything in the rear. I had planned to do the washer trick for the rear. My rear sags a bit because I tow a jet ski and a motorcycle trailer occasionally. He did not tell me why he couldn't adjust the rear. They told me that he tried his best. I was actually working on it for about 2 hours.. I was wondering if he stopped, so I randomly go check on him, and he is there working on the alignment. They recommended that I take it to a specialty alignment shop though, because he says he couldn't get it much better. I was appreciative that he was working so hard on it. I know the camber is off in the rear, because I had two rims, lots of tools and other load in the trunk. I forgot to take out everything. I know the rear looks terrible on the paper.
Does the front affect the rear because its lowered in the front only?
I have lifetime alignment at Firestone. If I take it to a different location, can I try to get them to align the rear only since the front is relatively fine?
I might change the stock rear springs to the Sportlines, because they should be a bit stiffer than the stock springs. I don't have shocks for it yet though. What do you think about installing Sportlines in the rear with stock shocks? Would the rear sportlines blow out the stock shocks just as easily as the fronts?
I have stock springs/shocks in the rear. I do not have any camber kit or anything in the rear. I had planned to do the washer trick for the rear. My rear sags a bit because I tow a jet ski and a motorcycle trailer occasionally. He did not tell me why he couldn't adjust the rear. They told me that he tried his best. I was actually working on it for about 2 hours.. I was wondering if he stopped, so I randomly go check on him, and he is there working on the alignment. They recommended that I take it to a specialty alignment shop though, because he says he couldn't get it much better. I was appreciative that he was working so hard on it. I know the camber is off in the rear, because I had two rims, lots of tools and other load in the trunk. I forgot to take out everything. I know the rear looks terrible on the paper.
Does the front affect the rear because its lowered in the front only?
I have lifetime alignment at Firestone. If I take it to a different location, can I try to get them to align the rear only since the front is relatively fine?
I might change the stock rear springs to the Sportlines, because they should be a bit stiffer than the stock springs. I don't have shocks for it yet though. What do you think about installing Sportlines in the rear with stock shocks? Would the rear sportlines blow out the stock shocks just as easily as the fronts?
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Re: (professorman)
I dunno man, to me that alignment looks pretty damn terrible. You started out with slight positive camber on the front right and now have MORE positive camber. You were also in spec on toe for the rear right, and after the alignment your rear right toe is now out of spec. 
Now first of all, I'm pretty sure the shock forks should be fully seated against the brake line bracket. At least that's how it is for Civics and Integras. Whenever I take my front shocks off and then put them back on, if I don't get the fork fully seated against the brake line bracket, I'll hear a couple of popping sounds either after I put the car back on the ground, or when I drive it around immediately after. It's kind of a metallic popping sound, and it is the fork shifting slightly to seat itself against the brake line bracket.
Second of all, ditch that camber kit. I currently run about -1.5 camber all around, and previously had as much as -2.8 in front with no major tire wear issues. As long as you get it aligned to set the toe to 0 (or slight toe-in) you should not have tire wear problems. The negative camber will also help the car handle better.
Right now you have positive camber on both sides in the front, and had positive camber on the front right to start with even after lowering the car. That makes me think you have damaged parts somewhere under the front right. Any idea if the car has ever been wrecked?
As for loading, I guess you should have whatever load you normally have in the car. If not, then the alignment will end up being off when you do put your stuff back in the car. Truthfully, you should be sitting in the car or ballast placed near the driver seat to account for your weight while aligning the car, but I don't know of any place that does that. We did it once in my car when my buddy used to align mine. I sat in the car while he adjusted toe all around.
*edit* oh yeah Supracrx, the type of camber kit the OP is using does allow a very limited amount of caster adjustment, because you could set the front and rear adjuster on each control arm slightly different, which will move the upper ball joint on the control arm forward or backward slightly, which will change caster. Too much difference, though, and the bushings will bind up. IMHO it's too much trouble and makes it more difficult to get everything set right.
Now first of all, I'm pretty sure the shock forks should be fully seated against the brake line bracket. At least that's how it is for Civics and Integras. Whenever I take my front shocks off and then put them back on, if I don't get the fork fully seated against the brake line bracket, I'll hear a couple of popping sounds either after I put the car back on the ground, or when I drive it around immediately after. It's kind of a metallic popping sound, and it is the fork shifting slightly to seat itself against the brake line bracket.
Second of all, ditch that camber kit. I currently run about -1.5 camber all around, and previously had as much as -2.8 in front with no major tire wear issues. As long as you get it aligned to set the toe to 0 (or slight toe-in) you should not have tire wear problems. The negative camber will also help the car handle better.
Right now you have positive camber on both sides in the front, and had positive camber on the front right to start with even after lowering the car. That makes me think you have damaged parts somewhere under the front right. Any idea if the car has ever been wrecked?
As for loading, I guess you should have whatever load you normally have in the car. If not, then the alignment will end up being off when you do put your stuff back in the car. Truthfully, you should be sitting in the car or ballast placed near the driver seat to account for your weight while aligning the car, but I don't know of any place that does that. We did it once in my car when my buddy used to align mine. I sat in the car while he adjusted toe all around.
*edit* oh yeah Supracrx, the type of camber kit the OP is using does allow a very limited amount of caster adjustment, because you could set the front and rear adjuster on each control arm slightly different, which will move the upper ball joint on the control arm forward or backward slightly, which will change caster. Too much difference, though, and the bushings will bind up. IMHO it's too much trouble and makes it more difficult to get everything set right.
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Re: (PatrickGSR94)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by PatrickGSR94 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Right now you have positive camber on both sides in the front, and had positive camber on the front right to start with even after lowering the car. That makes me think you have damaged parts somewhere under the front right. Any idea if the car has ever been wrecked?
</TD></TR></TABLE>
I had messed with them when I was installing them. I may have installed them in that position to have positive camber I guess. I should look up some old alignment sheets to find out how it was before the lowering. It was hit in a tree back in 95. According to the police report on carfax, it was a slight impact with the tree. I do see some overspray on the front, but it didnt seem like it affected anything else. This only showed up on carfax 1 1/2 year after purchasing the car in 2004.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by PatrickGSR94 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Second of all, ditch that camber kit. I currently run about -1.5 camber all around, and previously had as much as -2.8 in front with no major tire wear issues. As long as you get it aligned to set the toe to 0 (or slight toe-in) you should not have tire wear problems. The negative camber will also help the car handle better.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
I am not looking to make the Accord into a race car. I'm going mainly for the looks, and then the handling is second. I do a lot of long distance driving on the weekends, so I do not want it to be too terrible. This is my daily driver, my road trip car, and my utility truck to tow stuff. I am very concerned about tire wear with this.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by PatrickGSR94 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Now first of all, I'm pretty sure the shock forks should be fully seated against the brake line bracket. At least that's how it is for Civics and Integras. Whenever I take my front shocks off and then put them back on, if I don't get the fork fully seated against the brake line bracket, I'll hear a couple of popping sounds either after I put the car back on the ground, or when I drive it around immediately after. It's kind of a metallic popping sound, and it is the fork shifting slightly to seat itself against the brake line bracket.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Can I adjust this by just jacking up the car and loosing the bolt and fix it?
</TD></TR></TABLE>
I had messed with them when I was installing them. I may have installed them in that position to have positive camber I guess. I should look up some old alignment sheets to find out how it was before the lowering. It was hit in a tree back in 95. According to the police report on carfax, it was a slight impact with the tree. I do see some overspray on the front, but it didnt seem like it affected anything else. This only showed up on carfax 1 1/2 year after purchasing the car in 2004.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by PatrickGSR94 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Second of all, ditch that camber kit. I currently run about -1.5 camber all around, and previously had as much as -2.8 in front with no major tire wear issues. As long as you get it aligned to set the toe to 0 (or slight toe-in) you should not have tire wear problems. The negative camber will also help the car handle better.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
I am not looking to make the Accord into a race car. I'm going mainly for the looks, and then the handling is second. I do a lot of long distance driving on the weekends, so I do not want it to be too terrible. This is my daily driver, my road trip car, and my utility truck to tow stuff. I am very concerned about tire wear with this.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by PatrickGSR94 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Now first of all, I'm pretty sure the shock forks should be fully seated against the brake line bracket. At least that's how it is for Civics and Integras. Whenever I take my front shocks off and then put them back on, if I don't get the fork fully seated against the brake line bracket, I'll hear a couple of popping sounds either after I put the car back on the ground, or when I drive it around immediately after. It's kind of a metallic popping sound, and it is the fork shifting slightly to seat itself against the brake line bracket.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Can I adjust this by just jacking up the car and loosing the bolt and fix it?
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i didn't know that it had caster adjustment but yea...patrickgsr94 is right...like i stated before the alignment reuslts seems like they didn't take their time on it esp if they took two hours...i would have took about 40 minutes on it and it would have came out better.
with the sportlines u'll probably end up having around -2.0 camber without the camber kit....i dont think u'll need it either because u wont get too much tire wear as long as toe is zero out. like he said..u'll get slightly better handling...if u keep the camber kit i would still set it to -1.0.....and not into the postive.
but the rears are still terrible alignment....if i ever did at my shop i will be fired immediately. the toe was in spec and after it was not...doesnt make sense why he let the car leave like that.
but i would change the shocks out in the rear. you're car is going to handle and ride like **** esp with different shocks and springs on frt and rears. if this is your utilty car why lower it? just curious
with the sportlines u'll probably end up having around -2.0 camber without the camber kit....i dont think u'll need it either because u wont get too much tire wear as long as toe is zero out. like he said..u'll get slightly better handling...if u keep the camber kit i would still set it to -1.0.....and not into the postive.
but the rears are still terrible alignment....if i ever did at my shop i will be fired immediately. the toe was in spec and after it was not...doesnt make sense why he let the car leave like that.
but i would change the shocks out in the rear. you're car is going to handle and ride like **** esp with different shocks and springs on frt and rears. if this is your utilty car why lower it? just curious
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Re: (supracrx)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by supracrx »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> if this is yur utilty car why lower it? just curious</TD></TR></TABLE>
Because it is also my sports car. lol. I hate the wheel gap, especially in the front. Also, the effects of going through a marriage then a divorce in 2 weeks. lol. I drive like a granny 90% of the time, due to past speeding tickets and stuff.. so, really, its for the looks more than anything else.
Because it is also my sports car. lol. I hate the wheel gap, especially in the front. Also, the effects of going through a marriage then a divorce in 2 weeks. lol. I drive like a granny 90% of the time, due to past speeding tickets and stuff.. so, really, its for the looks more than anything else.
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Re: (professorman)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by professorman »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
I am not looking to make the Accord into a race car. I'm going mainly for the looks, and then the handling is second. I do a lot of long distance driving on the weekends, so I do not want it to be too terrible. This is my daily driver, my road trip car, and my utility truck to tow stuff. I am very concerned about tire wear with this.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Same with my car, except I don't tow stuff.
I've raced my car on a track maybe 5 or 6 times since I bought it 6 1/2 years ago. In 6 years I've also put over 150,000 miles on the car. Even with high performance tires I still get 30K-35K miles per set with no camber correction. IMHO a camber kit is not worth the hassle and worrying that it might slip out of alignment or something.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by supracrx »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i didn't know that it had caster adjustment but yea...patrickgsr94 is right...like i stated before the alignment reuslts seems like they didn't take their time on it esp if they took two hours...i would have took about 40 minutes on it and it would have came out better. </TD></TR></TABLE>
There is no caster adjustment with stock parts. But with this type of camber kit, with each bolt on the upper A-arms having individual adjustment, it's possible to not get both bolts set in the same position, thus moving the location of the upper ball joint and changing caster.
Think of a triangle shape pointing to the right, like this: >
If you move that top corner of the triangle to the left slightly and keep the bottom point stationary, the point on the right end will move upwards.
But yeah I think stock parts would fix most of the alignment problems on the front, and the shop should have just done a better job on the rear.
I am not looking to make the Accord into a race car. I'm going mainly for the looks, and then the handling is second. I do a lot of long distance driving on the weekends, so I do not want it to be too terrible. This is my daily driver, my road trip car, and my utility truck to tow stuff. I am very concerned about tire wear with this.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Same with my car, except I don't tow stuff.
I've raced my car on a track maybe 5 or 6 times since I bought it 6 1/2 years ago. In 6 years I've also put over 150,000 miles on the car. Even with high performance tires I still get 30K-35K miles per set with no camber correction. IMHO a camber kit is not worth the hassle and worrying that it might slip out of alignment or something.<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by supracrx »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i didn't know that it had caster adjustment but yea...patrickgsr94 is right...like i stated before the alignment reuslts seems like they didn't take their time on it esp if they took two hours...i would have took about 40 minutes on it and it would have came out better. </TD></TR></TABLE>
There is no caster adjustment with stock parts. But with this type of camber kit, with each bolt on the upper A-arms having individual adjustment, it's possible to not get both bolts set in the same position, thus moving the location of the upper ball joint and changing caster.
Think of a triangle shape pointing to the right, like this: >
If you move that top corner of the triangle to the left slightly and keep the bottom point stationary, the point on the right end will move upwards.
But yeah I think stock parts would fix most of the alignment problems on the front, and the shop should have just done a better job on the rear.
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hey i wasn't trying to argue with u about it....i know how it works know but i just said i didn't know it was adjustable....but yea i agree with u stock parts should be ok with the front.
as for the rears....they need to fix that.
as for the rears....they need to fix that.
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From: Nowhere and Everywhere
I don't think this type of camber kit should be used specifically for adjusting camber, as there could be issues with the bushings binding. It's just something you have to look out for when using this type of kit. If you don't make careful adjustments, it can throw off your caster.
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Re: (PatrickGSR94)
All that rackling and poping when I hit bumps, is that normal? I would want to fix that before I go back and get another alignment. What do you think? Did I do something wrong?
Anytime I hit a pothole or a bump, I hear it. I first thought it was mainly the passenger side that was cllunk, but then after, it came from the driver side as well... Any bump that I hit that cause the front to rebount enough, I hear the clunk.
It would sound like the spring is not secure in the damper, and it thump everytime the car goes back down... Like if I drive fast over a speed bump, as the wheel goes over the bump, it would clunk/thump after going over it.
Anytime I hit a pothole or a bump, I hear it. I first thought it was mainly the passenger side that was cllunk, but then after, it came from the driver side as well... Any bump that I hit that cause the front to rebount enough, I hear the clunk.
It would sound like the spring is not secure in the damper, and it thump everytime the car goes back down... Like if I drive fast over a speed bump, as the wheel goes over the bump, it would clunk/thump after going over it.
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Re: (professorman)
Could be those camber kit bushings binding if they're not set evenly on both sides.
I had a popping sound from the front end of my car a few months back. At first I thought it was my steering rack, and then thought it was my stock UCA bushings. Finally I figured out it was my left lower ball joint. The boot had ripped and let all the grease out, and I guess a bunch of junk got up in the joint and caused the noise.
It was VERY loud inside the cabin of the car when the suspension moved up and down, especially when the car was stopped, but I could also hear it while driving slowly.
I had a popping sound from the front end of my car a few months back. At first I thought it was my steering rack, and then thought it was my stock UCA bushings. Finally I figured out it was my left lower ball joint. The boot had ripped and let all the grease out, and I guess a bunch of junk got up in the joint and caused the noise.
It was VERY loud inside the cabin of the car when the suspension moved up and down, especially when the car was stopped, but I could also hear it while driving slowly.
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Re: (PatrickGSR94)
The first thing I noticed was that the rubber bushing at the top of the strut didnt seem like it was very tight. It seemed like it might have about <1mm free play if forced. So, I took the spacer and grind it down, and then retighten the top nut. The uppper bushing is now more compressed and the nut tightens down more. Going for a test drive, I notice that it does not clunk 'as much' as it did before. I did clunk though.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by hurleyint »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">It could be the A arms hitting the shock tower. When you add a camber kit in the front on top of being lowered, it really shortens the ammount of room it has to travel.
It's a pretty common problem, so it's something to consider.</TD></TR></TABLE>
I came back and checked H-T and saw the post about the A-arm, so I looked on the A-arm... low and behold, it was banging on something. I looked under and realize that there was a fairly large area for it to swing up into, however, because of the camber kit, it is now pushed out in the positive camber direction, and it was scraping on the side of the wall area as it swings up into its cavity. I cut away some of the rubber underside where it scrape and got a hammer and banged away at it until I got enough clearance for the A-arm to pass without clunking/binding. The car now drives wonderful. I have no clunking, and the wheel does not feel as if it is lifting off the road.
I think what happen was that the A-arm would go up in there, and bind momentarily, and so the wheel is out of contact from the road for a split second... but man, did it feel dangerous driving with the car like that. Everyone was telling me that lowering makes things bang around and feels dangerous, but I couldnt accept that it should feel so dangerous. THanks guys! I <3 HT
All in all, my car drives great now. I just need to go get my alignment fixed and I should be good to go until I get enough money to lower the rear as well. With my rear saging, I have between 2-3 finger gap depending on my load though, so it doesnt look that bad.
With this A-arm issue, and from the postings, everyone is saying that I should not have gotten a camber kit, because it causes more trouble and doesnt save the tires. I read in the Accord section that I should not drop without camber kit if I want to save my tires. I'm confused about this camber kit thing, because I thought I was saving my tires by getting the camber kit. I hope I dont do more harm than good. What do you guys think?
On a side note, I called KYB and they said that the AGX isnt meant to drop that low. I called Eibach, and they said that the KYB AGX is not meant to use with Eibach Sportlines, because even the AGX is a stock replacement shock, even though it is adjustable. The guy at Eibach says that the AGX blows out as quickly as stock struts when used with the sportlines. I need to find this out, because I dont want to know I waisted my money on the AGX. What do you guys think?
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by hurleyint »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">It could be the A arms hitting the shock tower. When you add a camber kit in the front on top of being lowered, it really shortens the ammount of room it has to travel.
It's a pretty common problem, so it's something to consider.</TD></TR></TABLE>
I came back and checked H-T and saw the post about the A-arm, so I looked on the A-arm... low and behold, it was banging on something. I looked under and realize that there was a fairly large area for it to swing up into, however, because of the camber kit, it is now pushed out in the positive camber direction, and it was scraping on the side of the wall area as it swings up into its cavity. I cut away some of the rubber underside where it scrape and got a hammer and banged away at it until I got enough clearance for the A-arm to pass without clunking/binding. The car now drives wonderful. I have no clunking, and the wheel does not feel as if it is lifting off the road.
I think what happen was that the A-arm would go up in there, and bind momentarily, and so the wheel is out of contact from the road for a split second... but man, did it feel dangerous driving with the car like that. Everyone was telling me that lowering makes things bang around and feels dangerous, but I couldnt accept that it should feel so dangerous. THanks guys! I <3 HT
All in all, my car drives great now. I just need to go get my alignment fixed and I should be good to go until I get enough money to lower the rear as well. With my rear saging, I have between 2-3 finger gap depending on my load though, so it doesnt look that bad.
With this A-arm issue, and from the postings, everyone is saying that I should not have gotten a camber kit, because it causes more trouble and doesnt save the tires. I read in the Accord section that I should not drop without camber kit if I want to save my tires. I'm confused about this camber kit thing, because I thought I was saving my tires by getting the camber kit. I hope I dont do more harm than good. What do you guys think?
On a side note, I called KYB and they said that the AGX isnt meant to drop that low. I called Eibach, and they said that the KYB AGX is not meant to use with Eibach Sportlines, because even the AGX is a stock replacement shock, even though it is adjustable. The guy at Eibach says that the AGX blows out as quickly as stock struts when used with the sportlines. I need to find this out, because I dont want to know I waisted my money on the AGX. What do you guys think?
Joined: Jan 2002
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From: Nowhere and Everywhere
Re: (professorman)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by professorman »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">With this A-arm issue, and from the postings, everyone is saying that I should not have gotten a camber kit, because it causes more trouble and doesnt save the tires. I read in the Accord section that I should not drop without camber kit if I want to save my tires. I'm confused about this camber kit thing, because I thought I was saving my tires by getting the camber kit. I hope I dont do more harm than good. What do you guys think?
</TD></TR></TABLE>
I think you should trust us in the suspension forum more than those guys in the Accord forum.
But seriously, over the past 10+ years, camber kits have been so over-hyped and over-marketed as the end-all savior against tire wear, that people just automatically ASSume you need it any time a car is lowered. This just isn't the case.
Back when I first lowered my car, I figured I would just get an alignment first, and then see what my tire wear did. I was amazed to see that my tires wore evenly until they were down past the wear bars over a year later. I was thankful for that because I've never had to deal with getting a camber kit adjusted, or having one slip on me, or having any of the contact problems that you were having.
Just get the toe set during an alignment, and don't worry about camber. Rotate your tires regularly and you should be fine.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
I think you should trust us in the suspension forum more than those guys in the Accord forum.
But seriously, over the past 10+ years, camber kits have been so over-hyped and over-marketed as the end-all savior against tire wear, that people just automatically ASSume you need it any time a car is lowered. This just isn't the case.
Back when I first lowered my car, I figured I would just get an alignment first, and then see what my tire wear did. I was amazed to see that my tires wore evenly until they were down past the wear bars over a year later. I was thankful for that because I've never had to deal with getting a camber kit adjusted, or having one slip on me, or having any of the contact problems that you were having.
Just get the toe set during an alignment, and don't worry about camber. Rotate your tires regularly and you should be fine.
Thread Starter
Honda-Tech Member
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Re: (PatrickGSR94)
Yes... I should..
I went and did a new alignment today at a different Firestone again. I am loosing faith in them. I might just take it a specialty shop to get it set right once and for all, then I can take it to firestone for subsequent alignments to try get the toe to zero.
Here are the results
BEFORE
After
Compare it to the first alignment. I am wondering if they messed it up. The numbers does not match up. The "Actual" for the previous alignment should be the same as the "Before" for this current alignment.
I am lost with these numbers. Can I go on a long distance trip this weekend (400 miles) with these numbers? I dont want to do it if it is going to wear my tires.
Is it just that they are lazy why they cant set the toe to Zero? Is it hard to do or are they just lazy?
I went and did a new alignment today at a different Firestone again. I am loosing faith in them. I might just take it a specialty shop to get it set right once and for all, then I can take it to firestone for subsequent alignments to try get the toe to zero.
Here are the results
BEFORE
After
Compare it to the first alignment. I am wondering if they messed it up. The numbers does not match up. The "Actual" for the previous alignment should be the same as the "Before" for this current alignment.
I am lost with these numbers. Can I go on a long distance trip this weekend (400 miles) with these numbers? I dont want to do it if it is going to wear my tires.
Is it just that they are lazy why they cant set the toe to Zero? Is it hard to do or are they just lazy?
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 30,000
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From: Nowhere and Everywhere
well, if the car was wrecked with frame damage, sometimes the car can't be aligned properly. If that was the case, they most definitely should have made you aware of that fact.
I don't get why your front left camber is still positive. That is bad. Could cause understeer problems when going around a right corner. Looks like they didn't even touch the camber kit.
I don't get why your front left camber is still positive. That is bad. Could cause understeer problems when going around a right corner. Looks like they didn't even touch the camber kit.
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From: San Francisco,, ca, USA
wow...they didn't touch camber kit for the front
and the toe isn't hard to adjust....but sometimes if u have rack and pinion problems, or if the frame has been damaged the alignment wont be perfect..usually at our shop we would adjust it to zero, have someone shake the steering wheel and set it back to the same spot that we marked and adjust the toe that way.....but we def get it close to 0 but never more then .03....but .08 seems to be little too much...
and the toe isn't hard to adjust....but sometimes if u have rack and pinion problems, or if the frame has been damaged the alignment wont be perfect..usually at our shop we would adjust it to zero, have someone shake the steering wheel and set it back to the same spot that we marked and adjust the toe that way.....but we def get it close to 0 but never more then .03....but .08 seems to be little too much...
Thread Starter
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Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 1,733
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Re: (supracrx)
I doubt the car had frame damage, because I never had alignment problems before.
I am going to take it a specialty shop and dont bother with the stupid people at firestone. After everything gets good, then I will use them for my subsequent toe alignments.
I am going to take it a specialty shop and dont bother with the stupid people at firestone. After everything gets good, then I will use them for my subsequent toe alignments.
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