I have a 94 Accord LX 5spd. I installed Eibach Sportlines with KYB AGX struts on the front of my car. I also installed Camber kit, similar to those sold on ebay. The springs lower it 1.8" in the front. I have the AGX adjusted to #2 position.


I now notice that there is A LOT of rackling anytime I go through bumps in the road. I can definitely hear something like it is out. It sound as if something is loose. When I got home, I lifted the car and dropped it back down and when I lift it high enough, I hear a poping sound as if something is free to pop out of place as I unload the chassis. I checked all my bolts, and they all seem to be fine. I cut the bump stop in half. I got an alignment. They did the best they could, but they say that it still needs some more work.

Do you guys with lowering springs experience this? Is it the spring shaking around on the shocks? Or is there another problem?

I also notice that on the driver side, the shocks is all the way down to the brake line bracket, whereas on the passenger side, it is up in the position which I thought it should be, with about 1/2" between the brake bracket and the fork.

Firestone says that they were unable to get a better alignment than what they did and recommends that I take it to a professional alignment shop. This is the result that they got. Is this terrible alignment? What should I do to fix it? Could you comment as much about the alignment results as you can because I have no idea what anything on it means.



As far as the adjustment of the KYB AGX, I drove home with them set to #2 position. It was firm, but I could live with it. When I got home, I played with the settings, changing from 4 to 1. position 4 is definitely way too rough. I tried driving with it in position#1 and it was soft. I like this for everyday driving. Does it reduce the lifetime of these shocks riding in the soft position? I know I was supposed to get stiffer shocks for these springs, so am I cheating myself driving in position#1? I would definitely be fine driving in position#2 if it extends the life of my shocks, and it might be a better balance of firm sporty ride and comfort.


Modified by professorman at 10:39 PM 11/27/2007

 

you really should read this a bit more carefully. They did what they could but they were obviously slacking off because they didnt adjust the toe on the right rear (which they could), caster is non-ajustable. Any digits in RED under the word ACTUAL still needs to be fixed. Looks like you'll need a camber kit for the rear too (see how the numbers are in RED under ACTUAL). Just take care of the rear and you should be OK. I don't think you should go back to the same shop again because they didn't correct the toe and they told you to go someplace else.

As far as KYB AGX, mine died after 1 year. im running Tokico now.
As far as Sportsline - even though I cut the bump stop it rode on the bump stop, the upper arm started banging on the chassie. If you didn't install the rubber that goes between the spring and the hat you will hear thumps and twang.

I hope this helps a little.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by professorman &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Firestone says that they were unable to get a better alignment than what they did and recommends that I take it to a professional alignment shop.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Then tell them you want half your money back so you can take your car in and the rear re-done. Thats crap that they can't get the rear toe any better. Hell, they did nothing but make the rear worse than what it was when you went in

To fix your rear camber, just do the washer trick. There is a link in the FAQ that explains the "washer trick" and how to do it.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by aasaa666 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">As far as KYB AGX, mine died after 1 year. im running Tokico now.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Would setting them on stiffer setting extend their life?

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by aasaa666 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> If you didn't install the rubber that goes between the spring and the hat you will hear thumps and twang.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I had my mechanic friend help me install them. He is not a everyday modifier, but he is a good mechanic. In the kit that came with the AGX, there were 3 things... 2 nuts and one little metal spacer. He used one of the nut for the upper hat and the spacer below the top hat. I didnt figure out what the other nut was for. I need to go read the instructions again. He figured it might be a lock nut for the top hat.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by TouringAccord &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Then tell them you want half your money back so you can take your car in and the rear re-done. Thats crap that they can't get the rear toe any better. Hell, they did nothing but make the rear worse than what it was when you went in

To fix your rear camber, just do the washer trick. There is a link in the FAQ that explains the "washer trick" and how to do it.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I have lifetime alignment with them. I plan to take it back to a different location. Can I tell them to ONLY adjust the rear and do not touch the front? I do not want them to try to fix the front and mess it up. What do you think?

I have stock springs/shocks in the rear. I do not have any camber kit or anything in the rear. I had planned to do the washer trick for the rear. My rear sags a bit because I tow a jet ski and a motorcycle trailer occasionally. He did not tell me why he couldn't adjust the rear. They told me that he tried his best. I was actually working on it for about 2 hours.. I was wondering if he stopped, so I randomly go check on him, and he is there working on the alignment. They recommended that I take it to a specialty alignment shop though, because he says he couldn't get it much better. I was appreciative that he was working so hard on it. I know the camber is off in the rear, because I had two rims, lots of tools and other load in the trunk. I forgot to take out everything. I know the rear looks terrible on the paper.

Does the front affect the rear because its lowered in the front only?
I have lifetime alignment at Firestone. If I take it to a different location, can I try to get them to align the rear only since the front is relatively fine?


I might change the stock rear springs to the Sportlines, because they should be a bit stiffer than the stock springs. I don't have shocks for it yet though. What do you think about installing Sportlines in the rear with stock shocks? Would the rear sportlines blow out the stock shocks just as easily as the fronts?

 

it can't hurt to ask. I dont see why they wouldn't just do the rear alignment for you.

I don't think the lowered front would have an affect on the rear being off.

it doesn't matter if it is the front or rear, the sportlines on stock struts will blow the struts eventually. How long is dependent on the current condition of the struts and the roads you drive on.

 

All that rackling and poping when I hit bumps, is that normal? I would want to fix that before I go back and get another alignment. What do you think? Did I do something wrong?

 

where is it coming from?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by TouringAccord &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">where is it coming from?</TD></TR></TABLE>
Anytime I hit a pothole or a bump, I hear it. I first thought it was mainly the passenger side that was cllunk, but then after, it came from the driver side as well... Any bump that I hit that cause the front to rebount enough, I hear the clunk.

It would sound like the spring is not secure in the damper, and it thump everytime the car goes back down... Like if I drive fast over a speed bump, as the wheel goes over the bump, it would clunk/thump after going over it.

 

almost sounds like the strut mount (top hat) wasn't tightened down all the way.

 

It seems as if the top nut is tightened all the way down, however, there seems to be play in between the top hat and the strut... What do you think?

I also notice that on the driver side, the shocks is all the way down to the brake line bracket, whereas on the passenger side, it is up in the position which I thought it should be, with about 1/4" between the brake bracket and the fork.

Which one is the correct one? resting on the brake bracket or having a gap?

 

you probably wont be able to tell if that nut is tight with it installed on the car. The spring should be compressed to be sure the nut and top are tight.

You said you think there is play between the top and the strut? Like the nut didn't tight the top down all the way? Is it like this on both side or on just one? If one or both are loose like this I would think that would cause the clucking you are hearing.

 

It could be the A arms hitting the shock tower. When you add a camber kit in the front on top of being lowered, it really shortens the ammount of room it has to travel.

It's a pretty common problem, so it's something to consider.

 

ah, I wasn't thinking of that. Do sportlines drop it that low?

 

quick question were the springs/struts used because I notice you only installed the front? According to Eibach sportlines the springs only lower the car 1.8 inches with time/wear lets just say 2".

I highly doubt Eibach would sell springs that would have clearance issues lol.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Charri &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I highly doubt Eibach would sell springs that would have clearance issues lol.</TD></TR></TABLE>

It wouldn't be the springs causing the issue, it would be a combination of the lower springs along with the camber kit.

IIRC, he bought these new but didn't have money for the rear struts so he just bought the springs and the front struts. Later he is planning to buy the reat struts and install the spring/strut at that time.

 

The first thing I noticed was that the rubber bushing at the top of the strut didnt seem like it was very tight. It seemed like it might have about &lt;1mm free play if forced. So, I took the spacer and grind it down, and then retighten the top nut. The uppper bushing is now more compressed and the nut tightens down more. Going for a test drive, I notice that it does not clunk 'as much' as it did before. I did clunk though.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by hurleyint &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">It could be the A arms hitting the shock tower. When you add a camber kit in the front on top of being lowered, it really shortens the ammount of room it has to travel.

It's a pretty common problem, so it's something to consider.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I came back and checked H-T and saw the post about the A-arm, so I looked on the A-arm... low and behold, it was banging on something. I looked under and realize that there was a fairly large area for it to swing up into, however, because of the camber kit, it is now pushed out in the positive camber direction, and it was scraping on the side of the wall area as it swings up into its cavity. I cut away some of the rubber underside where it scrape and got a hammer and banged away at it until I got enough clearance for the A-arm to pass without clunking/binding. The car now drives wonderful. I have no clunking, and the wheel does not feel as if it is lifting off the road.

I think what happen was that the A-arm would go up in there, and bind momentarily, and so the wheel is out of contact from the road for a split second... but man, did it feel dangerous driving with the car like that. Everyone was telling me that lowering makes things bang around and feels dangerous, but I couldnt accept that it should feel so dangerous. THanks guys! I &lt;3 HT

All in all, my car drives great now. I just need to go get my alignment fixed and I should be good to go until I get enough money to lower the rear as well. With my rear saging, I have between 2-3 finger gap depending on my load though, so it doesnt look that bad.

With this A-arm issue, and from reading postings in the Suspension tread, everyone there was saying that I should not have gotten a camber kit, because it causes more trouble and doesnt save the tires. I read in the Accord section that I should not drop without camber kit if I want to save my tires. I'm confused about this camber kit thing, because I thought I was saving my tires by getting the camber kit. I hope I dont do more harm than good. What do you guys think?

On a side note, I called KYB and they said that the AGX isnt meant to drop that low. I called Eibach, and they said that the KYB AGX is not meant to use with Eibach Sportlines, because even the AGX is a stock replacement shock, even though it is adjustable. The guy at Eibach says that the AGX blows out as quickly as stock struts when used with the sportlines. I need to find this out, because I dont want to know I waisted my money on the AGX. What do you guys think?

 

Honestly? It's up in the air.

I have not run a camber kit since owning my car and have it fairly low to the ground.

There's a few things with it though.

You HAVE to keep the toe 0'd otherwise it'll tear tires up

You have to keep an eye on tire pressure

But thus far my car has been 100% fine without one

And I have a feeling if I got a camber kit it'd knock the crap outta the A-arm

 

I've been riding on Ground Controls (about a 2" drop) and KYB AGX shocks for about a year now with no problems. I ride on the stiffest settings.

I never got a camber kit, but my tires have virtually no wear (toyo proxes).

I think you should be fine with the KYB's...

 

yeah, it's been debated before. Some say you need a camber kit and some say you don't. I never had a camber kit on my Accord though I wasn't lowered that far (1.2" Pro-Kit). Now my Civic is dropped lower and I still dont run camber kits.

Like muffin said, keep the toe at 0 as that'll tear up the tires more than negative camber will. I also make sure I rotate and balance my tires every other oil change.

 

I've been having the same problems. My driver side spring does sound like it is not tighten enough. It doesn't look like the a-arm is touching any thing. It did when I first got my camber kit installed, but we fixed that. It started making all that noise after I installed a different set of springs.
When I first had my car without a camber kit, my tires were gone within a year and a half. After installing the camber kit, there is less wearing on my tires . If I was to do that again I would just rotate tires evry other oil change because I feel like my suspension has not been that good since installing the camber kit. I ride on tokico and they feel great. KBx are too stiff. I have them on my civic.

 

When my car is sitting on the ground, the A-arm does go up in that cavity, so without me banging it out with the hammer, the A-arm would probably be resting on the body with the car on the ground.

I went and did a new alignment today at a different Firestone again. I am loosing faith in them. I might just take it a specialty shop to get it set right once and for all, then I can take it to firestone for subsequent alignments to try get the toe to zero.

Here are the results
BEFORE


After


Compare it to the first alignment. I am wondering if they messed it up. The numbers does not match up. The "Actual" for the previous alignment should be the same as the "Before" for this current alignment.

I am lost with these numbers. Can I go on a long distance trip this weekend (400 miles) with these numbers? I dont want to do it if it is going to wear my tires.

Is it just that they are lazy why they cant set the toe to Zero? Is it hard to do or are they just lazy?


Modified by professorman at 8:17 PM 11/30/2007

 

zero'ing toe isn't really that difficult its rather easy. When I was align-tech at just tires the issue about 0-toe would be that it is close to the "minimum" alignment specs. I personally 0 all my cars. They have your alignment set up at factory settings. Since you have a lifetime warranty they dont make any commission off your car so they dont have the monetary incentive to really do a "great" job dont get me wrong I was always trying to do my best on alignments but there are some out there are just PURELY LAZY

 

I realize you dont have a camber kit or anything for the rear so that can't be touched, but whats up with the front. They have one side positive and one side negative? That would make your tires look like \ ___\ (exaggerated of course but you get the point). It says it's within spec but I would see if they can get it closer.

I remember when I had my car aligned, I didn't have a camber kit and mine checked within .2 of each other. I take mine to an alignment shop and pay about 10-20 more than say bell tire or some other places, it's worth it in my opinion. They do great work and a very nice.