I want to build a motor, I decided to try on building a poor mans type R. I have read lots of threads, but nothing was clear to me . If a professional individual on this forum can help me out I would appretiate it. I'm planning on using this car for circuit racing and some daily driving on pumped gas w/ maybe a p28 chiped ecu. I want to rev high so I would need to build a strong and reliable set up w/ some budget, thank you.

 

What is your budget and what block and head are you gonna use? GSR block w/ b16 head is pretty common. Look into itr pistons, replace your bearings, seals, gaskets and rings, maybe some machine work, such as a hone, head resurfaced, polished and balanced crank, ARP rod bolts, new timing belt and water pump. This is a start to some things you need to consider and sart pricing out. Also what cams and valvetrain do you plan on using?

 

Plan on going with gsr block and b16 head w/ skunk2 s2 setup.

 

What's your budget? Also, what pistons do you plan on running?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by EsFresso9 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I want to build a motor, I decided to try on building a poor mans type R. I have read lots of threads, but nothing was clear to me . If a professional individual on this forum can help me out I would appretiate it. I'm planning on using this car for circuit racing and some daily driving on pumped gas w/ maybe a p28 chiped ecu. I want to rev high so I would need to build a strong and reliable set up w/ some budget, thank you. </TD></TR></TABLE>

I can help you but rather than give you all the information, I'll help you "think" your way through it, you'll learn more that way.

What do you want to build, a poor mans ITR motor or a motor that's specifically designed for circut racing/daily driving? (in other words an engine that's not an ITR copy)

Do you understand what the concept is behind a "poor mans ITR build" is? If so, eplain it.

 

Currently I have an obd1 b16 in my ride. I was planning on selling my swap and purchasing a used ITR through a local distributor, but a friend of mines brought to my attention that I can build my own type R style set up consisting; a gsr bottom end and while utilizing my b16 head my question was if this was possible and how w/pump gas. I know this is a direct bolt on, but will the motor operate properly? I have read many things about compression and I am still confuse. This will be my first build and do not know where to start. So hopefully this may answer lots of questions out there. My theory on a poor mans itr is: best of both worlds utilizing the b16 and b18C vtec.

 

Ok, so you'd like to build a type R engine using a GSR bottom end and b16a head. You're on the right track as far as the initial concept goes, the only question is do you want to end up with an ITR copy when you're finished or an "enhanced" version of an ITR motor?

You have some concerns about compression and pump gas but I'm thinking you already know that the ITR uses the PR3 head which is the same head casting the b16a uses so using a b16a head will not change the compression ratio/would be the same as using the ITR head (compression wise).

The GSR bottom end or "short block" has the same stroke and rods as the ITR, the main difference is the pistons (and slightly stronger rod bolts). If you install ITR pistons, you'll end up with an ITR "copy" more or less with ITR compression ratio. ITR's run everyday on pump gas no problem so compression isn't a concern. The question is, is this what you want to do or were you thinking about enhancing the motor even more?

 

So basically I can build a gsr short block with ITR pistons... Now should I use, used ITR pistons or brand new ones and where would I be able to locate them? As far as building an enhance motor should I go ahead and forge everything such as pistons, rods, crank and etc. also guarding or sleeving the block? I know its starting to get pricey, but as long as I can build a nice strong motor its all worth every penny. Well lmk whats up thanks.

 

Always use new pistons and rings and you'll probably want to go .25mm oversize and have your block bored out to match the new pistons for best results and engine longevity. The crank and rods are already forged from the factory so you don't need to touch them. Pistons are cast but unless you plan on running boost or a large amount of nitrous you don't need to waste your money on forged pistons. If you want to know where to buy these pistons simply use the little red SEARCH function at the top right side of the screen and type in "ITR pistons" or "type R pistons" and look at what comes up. Type R engines were designed to be run at high rpm and for track use as they were, there's no need to add block guards or sleeve the block unless you plan on going to a much larger bore size than stock.

 

I'm a little confuse, you said that the crank and rods are forged from factory. We're you refering to the gsr or ITR? Would it be a good Idea to replace the bearings also? So for engine management will I need to run a chipped ecu and need a thicker head gasket to make clearance? Sorry if I'm asking to much, its just that I can not find proper info on building this set up. Thanks again 00Red_SIR

 

yes, its a good idea to replace bearings,and also, remember, use ARP head bolts, rod bolts, etc. rs machines sell cast itr pistons at a pretty good price, hit them up

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by EsFresso9 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> I'm a little confuse, you said that the crank and rods are forged from factory. We're you refering to the gsr or ITR? Would it be a good Idea to replace the bearings also? So for engine management will I need to run a chipped ecu and need a thicker head gasket to make clearance? Sorry if I'm asking to much, its just that I can not find proper info on building this set up. Thanks again 00Red_SIR</TD></TR></TABLE>

From what I understand, all honda cranks are forged from the factory. ITR/GSR rods are the same rods, ITR's simply use slightly stronger rod bolts and the rods are forged from the factory. If you're rebuilding your engine you should replace things like bearings all seals and gaskets and install a new oil and water pump while you're at it. Factory headbolts are fine to use but you may find the ARP head studs to be cheaper. A stock head gasket is fine to use, no need for a thicker one. You should look into using something like hondata, or crome, etc to help tune your engine which usually requires something like a chipped p28 ecu to start off with. A good manual should be on your list of things to purchase to help walk you through much of the proceedure for working on your car/engine.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by EsFresso9 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> I'm a little confuse, you said that the crank and rods are forged from factory. We're you refering to the gsr or ITR? Would it be a good Idea to replace the bearings also? So for engine management will I need to run a chipped ecu and need a thicker head gasket to make clearance? Sorry if I'm asking to much, its just that I can not find proper info on building this set up. Thanks again 00Red_SIR</TD></TR></TABLE>


You do not need to run a thicker head gasket there will be no clearance issues. An OEM honda headgasket is fine. Your choice of Skunk2 Stage 2 cams will work well with this setup.

Heres a link for ITR pistons and rings. I would recommend .25 oversized.

http://www.hmotorsonline.com/s...10016

Heres a link to for OEM Honda parts

http://www.hondapartsdeals.com

Hope this helps

 

listen to these guys. the only diff. is although the itr and b16 use the same casting, the itr head is ported adn polished straight from the factory., also you would want to use itr or the jdm p30 psitons for slightly higher comp. also you would want to use diff. cams. Itr or ctr's are great.

i currently run a "poor man's type r" in my teg, its a completly oem build, consisting of gsr block, with gsr rods, PCT pistons, PnP b16 head with itr valvetrain, and itr cams. and i am very happy with it. i was running itr pistons, adn they were great but i switched ove to pct's (ctr) pistons as they yield me a higher c/r. the only draw back is the pcts made the ran run like absolute **** till i got her tuned.