As you've heard in my other post i just bought a 91 civic si and it has a zc swap from and 88-89 integra, or so the guy says but it won't pass emitions... There isn't any visible smoke or anything but the guy say's it has to do somthing with the obd 2 or somthing like that because there not the same but anyways any ideas how to atleast pass emitions??? any tricks of the trade please help









those engine and tranny numbers are
2604610 engine
l3-204-9657 tranny
and the head had a couple of unclear numbers but i think they were h8

the only two parts that it failed on emissions 3 times were as fallows

HC(PPM) C0(%)

idle limit 220 / 1.2
idle emissions 504 / 3.14

2nd time
idle emissions 224 / 2.83


3rd time 424 / 3.67
all the same limits but different results

if any of this isn't clear i'll try to explain or clear it up as best as i can


Modified by hung_kuen at 3:09 PM 9/21/2007

 

If i remember right the motor in the car has to be the same year or newer to pass

 

interesting, so is there anyway to trick it?? the guy i bought it from said two bottles of rubbing alcohol and then i discovered there was 2 failed emissions papers in files he gave me with the car

 

yeah you will need to convert it to obd2. The old cars never passed emissions test. The reason why they have went from obd0 to obd1 to 0bd2 is because through time emissions have gone up so it was required for newer vehicles to have more 02 sensors. Hope this helps.

 

What parts of the testing is it failing on?

I don't know what WA tests on, but in IN we have CO, HC, and NOx

You could always retard the **** out of the timing and run low octane fuel with fresh plugs and run it hard on the way to the testing station to get the cat as hot as possible.

 

If you have the results from the previous emissions tests post them. It will help us figure out why the car is failing. If the tester doesn't notice that the engine isn't stock you could get by. Believe me it happens. I passed my 91Si D15b Vtec at a Test only station. But we need to know why it isn't passing so we can help you. post the results and We'll see what the prob is. If ANYONE can help you it will be the Cali Boyz! We live to beat the EPA/BAR! LOL!

P.S. That convert to OBDII **** is not necessary. Post the counts and I'll see if my CA Emissions control classes have paid off! Hahaha! You should be able to pass OBD0. As long as the test conductor doesn't realize your eng. is not stock

 

If you have the results from the previous emissions tests post them. It will help us figure out why the car is failing. If the tester doesn't notice that the engine isn't stock you could get by. Believe me it happens. I passed my 91Si D15b Vtec at a Test only station. But we need to know why it isn't passing so we can help you. post the results and We'll see what the prob is. If ANYONE can help you it will be the Cali Boyz! We live to beat the EPA/BAR! LOL!

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ilovemyd16 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">yeah you will need to convert it to obd2. The old cars never passed emissions test. The reason why they have went from obd0 to obd1 to 0bd2 is because through time emissions have gone up so it was required for newer vehicles to have more 02 sensors. Hope this helps.</TD></TR></TABLE>

This is complete bullshit. Please know what you are talking about before you give advice.

You only have to pass for what year the vehicle is. Period.

The main problem on a car that old with an engine that old is the catylitic converter. That, and a clean running ignition system, as long as there are not any internal problems such as worn rings or bad valve seals or bad injectors.

Pleast post your Co2 and NoX and HC numbers so we can help you.

 

LOL Go SIred91!!!!!!! Hahahahaha! You are absolutely right! I've taken multiple Emissions courses and this has never been an obvious cause for failure. Kudos to you!

.......Cali Owns emissions Laws!!!! Hahahaha!

 

What ecu are you using and how old is the cat?
the car and the motor should be obd0. Did you do a tune up
and what were the readings.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SIred91 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

You only have to pass for what year the vehicle is. Period.

</TD></TR></TABLE>

Now hold on. Sorry Red If you put an OBDII motor in a obdI car then you have to have the emissions equipment for the OBDII, ECU and all.

You cannot put a 89 motor in a 91 car this is illegal. You can't put a older motor in a newer car. Unless like was stated they don't notice.

Yes, we need more info to help you correctly.

 

isn't this an OBD0 motor in an OBD0 car?

OP is in WA anyways and not CA. Alot of states could care less what motor is in the car as long as you meet the emissions standard for the car as it was originally.

in for emissions results.

 

Absolutely. WA has different standards. What I stated is for CA.
Just to make that clear. Sorry again Red I didn't know OP was in Wash.

I believe the 91's are obdI aren't they?

So where are the test results?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by hung_kuen &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> As you've heard in my other post i just bought a 91 civic si and it has a zc swap from and 88-89 integra, or so the guy says but it won't pass emitions... There isn't any visible smoke or anything but the guy say's it has to do somthing with the obd 2 or somthing like that because there not the same but anyways any ideas how to atleast pass emitions??? any tricks of the trade please help</TD></TR></TABLE>

88-89 is NOT OBD2, it is PRE-OBD aka OBD0

OBD1 did not hit until the EG chassis (1992-1995)

OBD2A/B is 1996+

I'd say post some pictures to verify what exactly you have because from what you've posted, there seems to be inconsistencies. Without a definite answer as to what exactly you have, we (people on the forum) aren't going to be able to give you definite answers.

Assuming you do in fact have a ZC out of an 88-89 integra, there still may be a couple of variations but it definitely would still be OBD0. Don't get me wrong though, there are variants of the ZC that are OBD1 that were used in other markets but without pictures or some sort of confirmation of what YOU have, we'll more than likely end up confusing you rather than helping.


Another thing you can do without having to take pics for us, is tell us what color the valve cover is, what the engine code is that is stamped onto the block, what color connectors are on the engine harness, fuel injected vs carbuerated (most likely you have fuel injected but you never know), tell us which side the "H" is on (intake or exhaust side of the valvecover, it might be "honda" instead of "H") and look to see if the valve cover bolts are on top of the valve cover itself or on the perimeter of the valve cover.


Modified by 24TEN at 2:26 PM 9/21/2007

 

Alot of people posting crappy info, obd2 lol what a tool

 

Thanks for clearing the obd question for me Boosted. All manufactures have different years and I had not heard any definite answers for Honda's yet.


Thank you 24ten I mean....


Modified by thesmogman at 2:46 PM 9/21/2007

 

LOL it's cool, I know you meant me But boosted knows his stuff too

 

try checking your spark plugs.. see if you need some new ones. and what octane of fuel are you putting in?

i put in some new plugs and put a little e85 in my b16 and passed with flying colors... then put in some 93 so i wouldnt tear the **** out of the motor

 

I see that you've added pictures (good job, very thorough )

It's a black top, you can tell because the bolts go around the perimeter of the valve cover and the "H" is on the exhaust side. It also looks to be from the same body (Civic) since the mounts look all stock. From the looks of it, the connectors are clearish/opaque in color which indicates an OBD0 harness. Here's something else that will make a difference, which ECU are you running? Take a look there and see what it is. I had a PG7 (88-89 Integ) running mine at first and it barely barely BARELY passes with that (plus a little help from the smog tech). I'm running a PM6 (88-91 Civic/CRX EX/Si) now, just smogged mine and I live in California. Only thing I did is buy a new cat and install a new 02 sensor. I've had it for the past 7 years now, this was the first time it's had trouble passing smog and all it needed was those two new things. Hope that helps.

Also as Spastik said, a good tune up would also be in order (plugs, wires, cap, rotor, filters, etc).

 

make sure the timing and fuel pressure is right, get whatever ECU is recommended for a DOHC ZC since its not a US spec motor. New O2 sensor and new cat will definitely help as well. Change your oil before as well, it helps.

 

Okay so does anyone have any idea what the engine is exactly??? i mean where did it come from if it's not stock.... and where to start looking for the parts nessicary to fix the problem i.e. the ecu cat ect.... thanks guys

 

Just wanted to point out the your vacuum lines are not correct and you should have the breather filter out of there and that a hose should go to your SRI. Unless the smogger didn't care about it.

The vac. line going to your fuel pressure regulator should be straight to it. No tee.

And you map and carbon canister purge solenoid needs work too.

If you are not getting the correct vacuum to these like the FPR it would raise your HC's at idle.

When you are high on HC's you start to get bad combustion and that is creating the CO.

I would start with these first. These are important! and then see where you are it.

 

^^^^Good info. Also put 4 125ml bottles of gas line antfreeze in you gas. My old mechanic swears by it. It will make your car run clean.

 

over 100 ppm on hc indicates a missfire...and from the co it looks like u have a rich missfire.

 

make sure ur secondary like wires, plugs are all in good condition. replace ur gas cap and get a new fuel filter. you want ur co to be between .3 to 1.0. make sure ur car is running good,do a vacuum test on the engine,should be 17 to 22 hg's of vacuum at idle. if u have low vacuum ur fpr will allow more fuel to the injectors,thinkin the car is under a load.