Ok..ok... it is not really a conspiracy, but I do have some theories in my noobness that I wanted to address. At this point it feels like ME against my CAR/HEAT. I just wanted to let it all out: frustrations and all...

So let's begin with setup:



B16 Head lightly port and polish
ITR 01 CAMS
Supertech valve springs and retainers
Skunk2 Cam gears
Precision 1000cc Injectors
Blox IM
Edelbrock Throttlebody
Magnecore wires NGK plugs
Samco hoses

B16 bottom bored 84mm GE sleeved...
Cometic head gasket
CP Pistons 9:1
Eagle Rods
Eagle crank
ACL bearings
ARP head studs
ITR crank pulley OEM/w harmonic stabalizer
Ingals engine torque damper

GT3076R BB .48AR
Spoolin Quick 4 manifold AC compatible
3" downpipe and exhaust to vibrant
NEW Koyo RACE radiator w/SPOON CAP
New Jackson Racing thermostat
New Buddy Club Fan switch
blah blah blah.........

ok enough of that. Car has been dyno tuned before I hit the streets.




Situation:

This past weekend I thermotec wrapped my coolant lines that run along the passenger side. I switched my fan from pusher to puller. I just put that new Buddy Club fan switch to turn on earlier. I put water wetter in the car. I bleeded my coolant to the best of my knowledge. I ran the fan 10 times and let as many bubbles out as I know.

Theory 1:

At idle my car is at a perfect operating temperature. It can stay like that for a long time at idle. A tad under half on guage. The fan turns on and pulls heat, but it shoots it right at the coolant lines. After driving around for 15 mins. it starts to get really hot 3/4 of my guage+. Is this my first mistake? Fan pulling hot air towards those coolant lines that goto my block? BTW I did wrap those puppies too just as a reminder. My turbo intake is there as well.

Theory 2:

There is that huge gap of several inches between radiator and intercooler, can it be causing a vortex of heat that doesn't want to escape therefore increasing underhood temperatures?

Theory 3:

I notices on my wideband that it gets hot when I am driving on the streets faster. The tune shows about 13 to 14/15 at times from 1K to 4500K on rpm band but not hitting boost all the way yet. When I hit boost at 4500 to redline, my AF jumps down to 11.8 - 11.2 at times (right where it needs to be). When driving on the streets I am a bit lean right? Can that contribute to this sudden heat only when I drive?

Theory 4:

I looked this up on searches...is there such thing as heat soak with turbo applications? I have a turbo jacket on the turbo and planning to wrap my downpipe as well. Maybe all this heat builds up while I drive and then the heat just sits or soaks with nowhere to go. Is this possible?

Theory 5:

Machine shop didn't really check my head and needs to recheck it again? Make sure it is flat? Or can it be the mystery COMETIC head gasket that someone said can cause overheating on one thread? I am at 9:1 if I put a GE head gasket on and it was suppose to be at .57 thousandths how think is the stock and where will it take me compression wise?

The theories are endless when all I want to do is drive my car everyday and spank some EVO's or STi's.

Anyone local that can help me out?

Last Theory:

All of the above!!!

Side picture



Front shot


guage when it starts to get hot



I hate driving with my heater on just to try and save my car. I hate having to drive a hot car all the time since I know it is hurting my pistons.

Long post..but just wanted some final thoughts?





Modified by Urugly at 10:41 PM 9/17/2007

 

did your car run fine before u switched the fan, and did all the other stuff?

 

Nope it was still running hot and that is why I recently wrapped stuff and put a fan switch and new thermostat and switched the fan to puller.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Urugly &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
B16 bottom bored 84mm
</TD></TR></TABLE>

if you just bored the stock b16 block well... thats your overheating problem. answer me this then i'll try to help you with something else?

 

Good find..I just edited it and it is sleeved by GE.

 

what are the jackson racing thermostats rated at?

 

Straight from their site:

Our 160 degree thermostat is a must for an forced induction car. The lower engine temps will aid in making horsepower but equally as important will help keep detonation away. The lower the cylinder temperatures are the less likely detonation is to be a problem.

 

Hmmm, i would try and mount the fan as a pusher see how that effects it. Just try different things make note of the effect. Checked for bubbles lately?

 

in the end you could just check for bubbles without the rad cap on... wait for it to warm a little... if you get an unending bubble situations your headgasket is leaking, or do it the right way and do a leakdown on it and check for bubbles in the rad.

 

Sounds to me like you don't fully understand how everything is supposed to work. The car operates in closed and open loop modes. Closed loop should run around 14.64 to 1 or stoich at light loads if it hasn't been messed with in the computer. When starting to get into boost and higher throttle (pushing foot down more) the computer should switch over to open loop (unless you have the wideband hooked up to your ECU) and drop the A/F ratio down like you're seeing. Point being, that isn't causing the excess heat problem you're seeing, because combustion temps are much lower at lower engine loads.

I would also count out the fan pulling heat on the engine block. If that made cars overheat, then it would be an issue with every car on the road.

If the head gasket is not a problem I would say theory number two is your best bet. You need to force that air through the radiator, which may also explain why its getting hot when you're moving and not at idle. Get some thin aluminum or steel sheet and make something that seals off the intercooler to the radiator, thus forcing the air through the radiator. I also suspect that you no longer have the plastic "undertray" that sits under the radiator on the stock EG. Not having that will let air pass under the radiator and not through it.

 

It may be your radiator. If you have a good thermostat, new head gasket, good radiator cap, working fan, and did the coolant air bleed. Then your radiator is shot. What kind of radiator and how long have you had it? I had my aluminum radiator for less then half a year and it gave out on me. Search for "first head gasket job" and you'll see my thread with pictures.

My advice: Drain the coolant, disconnect the hoses and take out the radiator. Check to see if the radiator is warped in anyway. See if the fins are to close together. Check to see if you can visually see through the radiator. (Lifting it up to the sky in front of the sun works great)
It would also be so much easier if you had a buddy with the same type car or radiator so you can swap it to see if that might be the problem.
-i may be wrong. but its worth a try. It only takes a few minutes to pull the radiator so why not?
ps. i ordered a brand new half size radiator from ebay for a total of $38 shipped. Figured it wouldn't hurt and at that price I could use it for a spare if anything.

 

heat in the engine bay wont cause it to over heat.. . ever

if the engine is getting hot its a cooling system problem or a headgasket problem.

flush the radiator out, change the thermostat. if that dosnt work pull the head.

 

Finally this is making a bit more sense. Now I know that heat in the engine bay won't cause it to over heat. It is the inner workings that is causing this.

1. I just bleed the coolant for air bubbles this weekend, I will try it again with it slightly jacket up.

2. HG is literally brand new. I have maybe 150 miles on it total now. The motor was just finished.

3. The radiator is brand new!! When I was having this heating issue, I thought it was the radiator so I replaced it with this Koyo race.

4. "I also suspect that you no longer have the plastic "undertray" that sits under the radiator on the stock EG. Not having that will let air pass under the radiator and not through it."

This is absolutely right. How important is that plastic piece under the car? Should I go buy one again and cut it out a little so that it fits? I believe that's why air doesn't pass through my radiator so much.

 

Sleeved blocks tend to run hotter than stock sleeved blocks. Smaller coolant passages etc etc etc.

Do you have datalogs or anything?! The stock gauge on the cluster is utterly useless dude, I wouldn't even look at that thing.

 

lessen the gap between your radiator & your intercooler

 

If it's not the head gasket or air in the coolant - try shrouding the space between the IC and the radiator.
Is the fan shrouded? If you just have a fan that doesn't cover the back of the radiator, use a FAL type fan. It's shroud covers all of the radiators backside, drawing all of the air through the radiator.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by JDogg &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">heat in the engine bay wont cause it to over heat.. . ever

if the engine is getting hot its a cooling system problem or a headgasket problem.

flush the radiator out, change the thermostat. if that dosnt work pull the head.</TD></TR></TABLE>

 

We had a similar problem with a sleeved b16 before. temps would be fine at idle or on cool days but as soon as a hot day came around it would overheat like crazy. It turned out to be a radiator/coolant volume issue. From what i understand the b16 block is narrower then b18/b20's and when you go to sleeves your cutting down on the volume of coolant that is in the area around the sleeves. We solved the problem by getting the rad changed, went a little over kill but had two aluminum half rads welded together sort of offset. The theory was to give the coolant a longer time in the rad to cool down while also giving larger surface area of cold air to coolant.

Dont get me wrong, im not saying to spend the money and do the same thing. But the problem may be in your rad.

 

use the air bleeder on the back of the head if you have it.. pour coolant in with that open till you get a steady stream, make sure the heater is on.

the plastic undertray dosnt matter

brand new hg dosnt matter, it could have been put on wrong, etc.. we have had 2 cars come in with similar issues, both had improperly installed headgaskets. (crushed dowels, etc)

 

i bet u if u get a FAL fan or if u can fit ur stock one back in it should fix the problem.....i had a similar setup and did everything then i swapped out the fan and it was day and night, no overheating or anything anymore. also, i tired like 4 of those cheap universal slim fans until i swapped it out for a FAL

 

IMO, Cometic head gaskets are garbage, i've had two blown with ARP's under boost. Switched to Felpro MLS, and haven't had a problem since.

I'm betting its a blown headgasket.

 

This is a lot of good info.

I haven't tried to bleed my head yet. Where is that screw located? Anyone have a picture or a link on how to? Do I do that with the car on? or just powered with heater on?

I almost bought a full size radiator too, now I think I should have done it...$300 later!!!!

I have a FAL fan and I tried my *** off to try and fit it, but my turbo gets in the way. This slim fan I have is shrouded and it is in an S blad fashion. Not sure if that is better than the flat blades everyone sells here.

**This there a FAL slim line fan I don't know about??

If all else fails then head is coming off and back to shop to see if it is the gasket.

Any suggestions for a pretty think gasket which one I should run? GE are great since they are OEM, but they are too thin. My machine shop said I need a .57 thousands (as mentioned in another post). The only reason we went COMETIC was the fact they make thicker head gaskets.

If there is a shop out there that knows of a good HG in this thickness IM me and I will buy from you.

Thank everyone for all the help. Sure this will help some other people that have been having heating issues lately too......

 

maybe the fan is not moving enough cfm. what size is it?

 

cometic gaskets work just as good as oem.. no reason to do anything different

you dont need a full size radiator, cheap rad fans work fine.

id put money on headgasket issue

 

tomorrow morning remove the rad cap and idle the car
see if you notice any air bubbles, if you do then its a sign that your HG is shot as JDogg guessed