I would go fo the Hondata reflash, but I would hate to wait 1 week to for the ecu to come back. Also, I want more control over the ecu, at any time. People have said that the Apexi NEO wouldn't work, so how about the Camcom? Here's the link:
http://www.outperformanceshop....C-201

 

I'm interested in the specifics as why the Apexi NEO does not work. Everyone is quick to say it doesn't work but no one can seem to explain it.

I'm interested in the Greedy E-Manage(New one)
anybody have anything useful to contribute to this thread.

 

its not I v-tec compatible.

im getting the APEX AFC 2 for the exact reasons. plus it will save me 300$ over the hondata

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by huevosrancheros &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I'm interested in the specifics as why the Apexi NEO does not work. Everyone is quick to say it doesn't work but no one can seem to explain it.

I'm interested in the Greedy E-Manage(New one)
anybody have anything useful to contribute to this thread.</TD></TR></TABLE>

People have already explained it. Many times at that. Try "search".

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by The Answer &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

People have already explained it. Many times at that. Try "search".</TD></TR></TABLE>

see, what I mean. I have already searched and everyone gives generic answers. I did some research on 8th civic.com and the general concensus seems to me that "It does not work" I don't know if everyone is playing the follow the leader. There are many conflicting stories. I 'm going for the Reflash

 

im not 100% but i thought that it had something to do with the language (in the computer) that honda used is different then what was used before

 

Honda no longer uses speed density fuel injection. We now have Mass Air fuel injection.

"SPEED DENSITY-- Speed density is a control algorithm which "infers" the amount of air flow into an engine. Incorporating a MAP sensor (manifold absolute pressure), and measuring the engine RPM's (speed) airflow is calculated. Programmed into the ECM (electronic control module) is a volumetric efficiency table for each specific engine application. This table compares the current engine conditions (speed & pressure or vacuum) and outputs a calculated air flow value. This can now be used to insure the proper amount of fuel based upon the air/fuel requirements of the engine. These systems are very cost effective and work well. The downside is that re-calibration can be required with engine modifications.


MASS AIR FLOW-- This system incorporates a mass air flow sensor in between the air cleaner and the throttle body on the intake manifold. This sensor directly measures the precise amount of air flowing into the engine and sends this information to the ECM for proper fuel metering. These systems work very well, are very dependable, but are very costly compared to a speed/density system. More sophisticated air flow control and ducting are required for mass air systems"

easier to trick a computer that isn't measuring exact airflow

 

Thanks for the detailed response on Honda's ECU program. But someone said above that the AFC2 from Apexi is the only one that is compatible? And the Apexi Neo and the Camcom is a no go, right? Thanks.

 

Any piggy-back fuel management system is complete JUNK IMO -- unless you're driving a HMT kit'd EF. Why do you think that you need control over air/fuel maps and vtec engagement?

Hondata reflash &gt; any other tuning that is avaliable for our cars at this time

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by TRE_ &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Any piggy-back fuel management system is complete JUNK IMO -- unless you're driving a HMT kit'd EF. Why do you think that you need control over air/fuel maps and vtec engagement?

Hondata reflash &gt; any other tuning that is avaliable for our cars at this time</TD></TR></TABLE>

Perfectly stated.

What mods is everyone running that you need Neo's and AFC2's etc etc

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by IT GUY &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Honda no longer uses speed density fuel injection. We now have Mass Air fuel injection.

"SPEED DENSITY-- Speed density is a control algorithm which "infers" the amount of air flow into an engine. Incorporating a MAP sensor (manifold absolute pressure), and measuring the engine RPM's (speed) airflow is calculated. Programmed into the ECM (electronic control module) is a volumetric efficiency table for each specific engine application. This table compares the current engine conditions (speed & pressure or vacuum) and outputs a calculated air flow value. This can now be used to insure the proper amount of fuel based upon the air/fuel requirements of the engine. These systems are very cost effective and work well. The downside is that re-calibration can be required with engine modifications.


MASS AIR FLOW-- This system incorporates a mass air flow sensor in between the air cleaner and the throttle body on the intake manifold. This sensor directly measures the precise amount of air flowing into the engine and sends this information to the ECM for proper fuel metering. These systems work very well, are very dependable, but are very costly compared to a speed/density system. More sophisticated air flow control and ducting are required for mass air systems"

easier to trick a computer that isn't measuring exact airflow
</TD></TR></TABLE>

now that's what I'm talking about, thanks for the info IT GUY

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Type X &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Perfectly stated.

What mods is everyone running that you need Neo's and AFC2's etc etc

</TD></TR></TABLE>


im more interested in engaging my vtec a little sooner when needed and seting it higher when not.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by seed2harvest &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">


im more interested in engaging my vtec a little sooner when needed and seting it higher when not.</TD></TR></TABLE>

:slaps forehead:

 

lol. : Punchs nuts : ... dude, give us answers than....... why is everyone so quick to bash here?

ive read apexi v-afc 2 description. than i read handatas....... they seem to both have the same functions, only afc 2 is controllable. whats the problem?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by seed2harvest &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">lol. : Punchs nuts : ... dude, give us answers than....... why is everyone so quick to bash here?

ive read apexi v-afc 2 description. than i read handatas....... they seem to both have the same functions, only afc 2 is controllable. whats the problem?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Do you have mods that will support decreased vtec point engagement? Do you know how to properly adjust fuel on a vehicle...

and its not so much what your doing... its the car its being done to. The new civic si has technology that will actually "fight" adjustments being made.. which is why the ecu is pretty much the only way to go.

This isn't 1999 , the cars are 100X smarter & more advanced.....

 

thanks for the more detailed reply.

I see your point with the its not 1999 anymore. but it is apexi's new ****, so ill call them and make sure its legit in that matter.

adjust fuel? I plan on taking it down to my local shop to have them install it and explain in more detail how to adjust it. im smart enough to do that.

Mods..... what kinda mods we talkin here?
im only on the exhaust and sri right now.

 

Hondata &gt; your local shop + piggyback

piggyback + dyno time = $$$'s
Hondata is good to go out of the box, and by not being adjustable you can't F*ck it up and make your car run worse..

haven't you ever ridden in someone's car with a vtec controller that wasn't tuned? (pretty much anyone with a vtec controller)
I'll just say it's easier to make a car run like butt than it is to make it run better than stock.

 

yeah, piggybacks are getting less and less effective.

Hell, even with my 01 slowica, piggybacks just did not work. They eventually got canceled out or overwritten by the ecu...

 

Thanks for the info so far you guys. But anyway what I got a an intake, header, exhaust, pulley, hondata gasket, high flow cat, and grounding wires...down the road im going stage 2 skunk cams with full valvetrain and maybe a street port...I'd like to say I know what im doing, I know guys that have built b20 vtec from the ground up, to a guy with a 1500hp supra display car...im not going to randomly do stuff to my car or whatnot that I don't know, which is why im turning to you guys. So with all the piggybacks out there, eventually the ecu is going to correct itself? Is hondata working on a programable ecu?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by kt411gcn &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Thanks for the info so far you guys. But anyway what I got a an intake, header, exhaust, pulley, hondata gasket, high flow cat, and grounding wires...down the road im going stage 2 skunk cams with full valvetrain and maybe a street port...I'd like to say I know what im doing, I know guys that have built b20 vtec from the ground up, to a guy with a 1500hp supra display car...im not going to randomly do stuff to my car or whatnot that I don't know, which is why im turning to you guys. So with all the piggybacks out there, eventually the ecu is going to correct itself? Is hondata working on a programable ecu?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Considering the amount of money you've spent thus far on mods, I would NOT be skimping on fuel managment... get the Hondata reflash or wait for Hondata to come out with a fully-programable setup(in the works from what I've heard.)

Piggy-back systems do nothing more than trick your ecu by feeding it falsified inputs, allowing for SOME increased fuel/timing. Dont even bother with it.

 

All this computer-controlled car stuff makes my head hurt...and makes me long for my carbureted V8.

That being said, someone please show me a place or suggest any sort of material for me to read so that I can learn myself about this obnoxious ECM/ECU business so I can plan a roadmap to modding my SI.

Being a noob sucks :/

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by TRE_ &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Considering the amount of money you've spent thus far on mods, I would NOT be skimping on fuel managment... get the Hondata reflash or wait for Hondata to come out with a fully-programable setup(in the works from what I've heard.)

Piggy-back systems do nothing more than trick your ecu by feeding it falsified inputs, allowing for SOME increased fuel/timing. Dont even bother with it.</TD></TR></TABLE>

X2

hondata will even cut you a break on k-pro when it comes out if the reflash is already installed. reflash is about $600 and k-pro is around $1100 for the RSX and should be for us when it comes out. if you already have the reflash when the k-pro comes out then you can just pay the $500 difference or whatever it ends up being rather than spend $1100 all at once.

My suggestion for you kt411gcn is to go with the reflash now, wait on the cams and stuff until the k-pro comes out. When the K-pro is available, ship your ecu back to hondata for the upgrade while you install the valvetrain

 

Got it, that's exactly what I'll do. Thanks for everyone's help.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by seed2harvest &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">im more interested in engaging my vtec a little sooner when needed and seting it higher when not.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Reminds me of the old school days when people would say, "I'm going to get a VAFC, lower vtec, advance the spark so it's on all the time for power." lol

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by seed2harvest &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">


im more interested in engaging my vtec a little sooner when needed and seting it higher when not.</TD></TR></TABLE>

wtf is vtech anyway