I just picked up a 2000 integra type r shell for a race car and now that everything is set up, cage, suspension and brakes, I need to look at the engine.

I have a b18b which is in there now just as a test motor which was a spare on another race car. Has anyone done a K series swap into a type r ? possibly a k24/k20a2. How much will this end up costing me? Or should I just drop in a b18c5 or even pickup a spoon b18c5 (I already have a S80 with 4.29 FD)?

Can anyone offer up some suggestions? Looking for good hp numbers but with lots of reliability for the enduro's.

 

they have that new k20/f20 hybrid motor. try that

 

Power potential with the K-series is greater than the B.

It really depends on what your power goals are. 200whp would be cheaper to go B-series. 250whp would be cheapter to go K-series.

Also check into the rules of whatever racing body you are going to race in.

 

4.29 Final drive?!? haha is that from and ls or something......thats pretty low, id go with a 4.7 or even a 4.9 FD if your saying this is a race car, K-swap is pretty expensive, since its an R, id just drop in a another C5 in there and do some mild upgrades

 

k is easy 10g jsut for swap and the parts even with hook ups thats out of the box 200whp want more going to cost 3g but way more potential

b little cheaper to swap and use money towards a rel;iable build

 

Ok do I go with a used b18c5 or just pick up a spoon b18c5?

I also have a SSR 4.9 sitting in my garage. I agree 4.7 would probally be best but waiting for some testing before I purchase it.

The rules are pretty much open. I have 2 devisions which are possible to race in. The one states you have to run as delivered by the manufacturer, but I am racing an EF with a b16b and others have some nifty setups. The other is strictly based upon lap times and mods are free.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by cltitus &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">k is easy 10g jsut for swap and the parts even with hook ups </TD></TR></TABLE>

umm, so your saying a motor and related parts to get into the car is 10K?

The motors and trans are available for $2500 and most auto recyclers. So approx $7500 to get into the car?? seems abit high, esp. if that is not including install.

 

axels, mounts, hybrind header, wriing harness, ecu flash or kpro. the install and tuning. those are just a few things your need i cant remember the whoel list. and a spoon b18c and a used c5 put out about the same hp i wish i could find the dyno thread of a stock b18c5 and a spoon b18c i think spoon was 5hp more and 8tq more over stock c5 dont quote me until i can dig up dyno sheet

 

Yea that is a bit of an exageration. You can find Accord/TSX K24 blocks for under $600 fairly easily from wrecking yards. TSX/RSXS/SI heads are easy to come by. However you are forced to buy a custom exhaust manifold to fit in a swapped chassis, so you'll be dropping up to $1200 on one, then there is the mount kits, wireing, axles, and miscelanious peripheals like intake manifold/throttlebody, alternator, power steering...etc. If you do the work yourself, you can get a decent setup in a car for under $5000, including Kpro.

 

yeah, the spoon motors aren't built to make crazy horsepower over stock. They are just refined to be able to handle the stress of racing more than stock. Their strong suit is endurance. But don't expect 50hp more than stock or anything.


For reference, I'm running a spoon crate in my ITR, with spoon cams, and spoon headgasket. The intake and exhaust are stock, and it's tuned on Chrome. I make 190whp with that setup, and I think that a stock C5 is like 179 or 180whp? Might not be worth the extra money, unless you WANT the endurance for racing.

 

It all really depends on what you're using it for.... After all costs are over with you're going to pay a lot for a K swap, however you also get a lot too....

spoon b18c? expletive that.

b18c5, that'd probably be my personal option, but you didn't leave us much as far as your budget and goals are concerned.

 

spoon is also doing spoon create k20a's as well i have no clue what they are going for but i still say but a b18c5 for how much you pay for a spoon create or a kswap you can make a nice reliable motor it jsut depends on your budget

 

Well I dont have a set budget at the moment. I am willing to spend the money on something which is worthwhile yet I do not want to spend gobs of money on the motor as well.

Goals are vauge too as it will probally be a progressive build. I would say 200 whp is a goal with decent reliability.

 

b18c5 build2.0L is probably your best bet

 

k series will cost you 7-8k just for engine and install, then if you wanna make sick power, you will drop thousands in mods. Of course a B18C5 isnt cheap either and to make alot of power you gotta drop plenty of thousands as well. If you wanna go turbo I would say stick with the Bseries, if you want all motor go with Kseries.

If you say your trying to hit 200 whp, then i would def stick with the Bseries, some head work and good exhaust system can get you there much cheaper than K series build.

 

^

200whp is pretty easy to do if you start with the c5. You don't need all that much work done to it. A good header/intake/exhaust and maybe some cams. Then get it tuned.

 

hmm if i had the money I would love to do a build with a 82mm bore on my b18c5

 

did skunk2 come out with cams for the basic k20/k24 basically making them into the tsx/rsx type s version. i was read they were gonna release this and this was 5 months ago... going wit ha accord motor type s trans skunk 2 cams would be pretty cheap

 

$2500 for a k20 from a salvage yard? that is pretty low isn't it? $600 for the k24 block? these prices are really good...

The JDM type r K20's are selling for something between 4-5000 aren't they?

On thing to consider is that with a RSX k20 you don't have a LSD, pretty you should also factor that into the calculation.

 

heres what you should do if you want to go k24/20

ERL K24A1 Sleeved Race Block
New/Used Head
IPS K10 Cams and valve train
ITB
DTR/SMSP Race Header
you will put down 260whp on 91 with right tuner and you will retain full 50degree vtc but you will have mad wheel hope so nice suspension should fix that

 

Did anyone mention the Torque difference on the K20R vs the C5??

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 00IntegrAllmotoR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Did anyone mention the Torque difference on the K20R vs the C5??</TD></TR></TABLE>

there might be more torque with the K series, but is it honestly worth an extra 10 ft lbs for a engine that costs thousands more when apparently he only is hoping for 200 whp? If he had said he wanted 260 whp then maybe I woulda said go for a K series.

But in reality, even if someone wanted 260 whp, why not get a cheap used block for few hundred, pay the $2000 to get a 86mm bore and 89mm stroke, do about $2000 in head work, $1000 in exhaust, your making 250-260 whp with a Bseries then, running faster 1/4's than stock Vipers haha..still cheaper than trying to swap the Kseries in an R.

 

From the looks of it, a K swap does not seem that hard, its been done many time before, Involves some cutting of the chasis if I remember right...
There are many kits out there, only a few that are good...
need new axles.... ECU swap harness, misc shift linkage... ect... That will get a k20 in the car....

260whp will cost lots of money no matter which way you go... you're still going to need cams, pistons, injectors, exhaust, ITB's, headers.... list goes on...
this thread is pointless.

 

Also don't forget that K-series engines do not have oil starvation issues during high lateral G's due to a good pan design, unlike B-series motors, where anything past street tires you run the risk of catastrophic engine failure.

If you want a sure-fire reliable setup, a stock C5 with a baffled pan + accusump + oil cooler and a good set of boltons + 4.9FD, will be your best bet. You don't need a bazillion hp to be fast around a track, and the more you add in terms of power, the more you have to compensate in suspension and braking.

 

A local "Spoon Dealer" used to sell their used race motors for $2,500, straight from their race cars. They removed them and "refreshed" the motors. I asked them what the difference was between that and a stock C5, and they told me, nothing besides that it was balanced. Then I proceeded to ask why they have all the aftermarket performace parts and why they dont use them in their race motors, and they said that a balanced C5 is more reliable in a race, and that depeneding on the race, they may use a different motor with Spoon upgrades. Like pvt_awol said their strong suit is endurance. So no matter how you look at the two motors, Spoon and a stock C5, its still going to be a C5, the Spoon motor is just going to be balanced, unless you go with their semi-build motor, which to me is not worth the money becasue you could go with better upgrades and yield better results from other manufacturers. It all comes down to how much YOU can get these motors for. As far as the K series, all I can say is that they are great drag motors (in lighter cars), I personally havent seen them in a road race.