Suspension question, brands and such.
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From: Bay Area, CA, US
Suspension question, brands and such.
Hey im new to the site. I have a DC2, im currently running tokico blues with eibach lowering springs.
im wondering if i should keep my suspension or get another one.
i was thinking about buying the Tein Basic Damper. What im wondering is if i should keep my set up or go for the Tein.
Also does anyone know how much the Tein can lower the car? I think my springs lower 1.7 inches, will i get more of a drop from Tein or not?
im thinking about buying a used one for 300 which seems like a reasonable price.
any suggestions about other alternatives to Tein? Any help is well appreciated, Thanks!
im wondering if i should keep my suspension or get another one.
i was thinking about buying the Tein Basic Damper. What im wondering is if i should keep my set up or go for the Tein.
Also does anyone know how much the Tein can lower the car? I think my springs lower 1.7 inches, will i get more of a drop from Tein or not?
im thinking about buying a used one for 300 which seems like a reasonable price.
any suggestions about other alternatives to Tein? Any help is well appreciated, Thanks!
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Re: Suspension question, brands and such. (TheKid1488)
Yeah, I have suggestions. Well...if all you care about is slamming your car with no care about ride quality or handling....just get some inexpensive sleeve overs.
Now i'll get into comlicated (somewhat) suspension theory crap:
Full coilovers are way overkill for ...I'll venture to say...ATLEAST 90% of people who buy them. Most people have no idea how to set them up and buy them to slam their cars. The car will probably handle worse than stock if you over lower it on a complicated coilover with settings for damping and ride height. This is made worse by the fact that most people dont study imaginary angles like scrub radius, roll center, instant center, etc. It is made even worse by the fact that most people dont know how to spec a good alignment.
Unless you're taking your coilover to a professional shop to be tuned, I would suggest saving your money. I've seen tons of people on this site with $2000 coilovers that are set up by guys who should be paid $2000 an hour to stay AWAY from cars
. I dont see the point of buying an expensive coilover system just to slam the car. You can do that with ebay sleeves.
In your case, the price is $300, which is hella cheap. The Tein basic is an entry level coilover with no shock body adjustment. This means you will have to turn the spring down to lower the car, and in doing so, you will diminish the performance of the damper (shock), and put it out of it's optimal range if you over-lower it. I dont know what the recommended heights from tein are...but im sure its not going to be much less than, if even, 1.7''.
If you want to ride low, and still handle, you're going to need some big boy coilovers. Something with full ride height adjustment. You want to leave the spring alone, so that the shock travel is not diminished. If you diminish shock travel, you could run on a bumpstop when you take a turn hard or hit a bump...this will ruin your handling, and possibly cause damage to your shock towers.
Full ride height adjustment means that you, in essence, bring the suspension (control arm, hub, rotor, wheel) UP towards the car, instead of bringing the car DOWN towards the suspension. You turn the body of the shock up to lower the car. Basically, you shorten the entire shock body. Tein Flex has this adjustment...but I didn't really like the ride quality that i had from those on my S13.
But that is completely ignoring the angles i talked about earlier like roll center, instant center, and scrub radius. Over lowering will make your car more succeptible to body roll (yeah, you heard right, your car will roll MORE if it is lowered too far). The way to defeat that is bigger swaybars and stiffer springs. This however, reduces ride quality, and will make your car skip over bumps instead of taking them in stride and gripping over them. So there's another compromise. You could get pillowball mounts and roll center adjusters to make the geometry of the suspension correct, but you'd have to be an engineer with a blueprint of the car to make this affective. Or just know suspensions INSIDE AND OUT very very well. Which...would make you an engineer probably. However, your car will ride like crap.
Now if we get into alignment, there's really no way for me to say specifics without knowing specifics, so i'll say this. Every time you tune your coilover...you might have to tweak the alignment. ESPECIALLY if you're doing ride height changes. Some people commit the sin of buying an expensive suspension and getting a camber kit to cure their tire wear problems. Your car needs negative camber to a certain specific degree to handle like you want it to. Camber kits usually diminish handling...and are an expensive way to fix a problem. Toe is usually what kills tires. Camber barely affects tire wear. But i digress. You can use toe in/out to your advantage depnding on your setup and drivng style and skill. So thats a WHOLE another can of worms.
Damper (shock) tuning is a WHOLE different thing that would take more effort to type than I'm willing to put in.
lol so you see...lowering a car TO MAKE IT HANDLE isnt as simple as getting coilovers and slamming it. I cant say it enough. If you dont care about handling or anything besides slamming a car, there's no point in getting full coilovers. Well...on a honda anyway. They have more than enough shock travel to lower it on some gas performance shocks. If they had shitty shock travel, i could see buying a fully hieght adjustable coilover to get slammed.
To answer your question in short: The tein basic is a BASIC coilover. You will bottom out the shock and/or put it out of optimal range if you lower it much past 1.7-2'' DEPENDING ON WHAT TEIN RECOMMENDS. You can see that info on their website. If you want to slam your car, buy $60 ebay coils and put them on your existing tokico blues. I had that set up on my EK (but I did pick out some good spring rates) and i would regularly embarass cars with a LOT more money into their suspension and engine as far as handling thru a course went.
Now i'll get into comlicated (somewhat) suspension theory crap:
Full coilovers are way overkill for ...I'll venture to say...ATLEAST 90% of people who buy them. Most people have no idea how to set them up and buy them to slam their cars. The car will probably handle worse than stock if you over lower it on a complicated coilover with settings for damping and ride height. This is made worse by the fact that most people dont study imaginary angles like scrub radius, roll center, instant center, etc. It is made even worse by the fact that most people dont know how to spec a good alignment.
Unless you're taking your coilover to a professional shop to be tuned, I would suggest saving your money. I've seen tons of people on this site with $2000 coilovers that are set up by guys who should be paid $2000 an hour to stay AWAY from cars
. I dont see the point of buying an expensive coilover system just to slam the car. You can do that with ebay sleeves. In your case, the price is $300, which is hella cheap. The Tein basic is an entry level coilover with no shock body adjustment. This means you will have to turn the spring down to lower the car, and in doing so, you will diminish the performance of the damper (shock), and put it out of it's optimal range if you over-lower it. I dont know what the recommended heights from tein are...but im sure its not going to be much less than, if even, 1.7''.
If you want to ride low, and still handle, you're going to need some big boy coilovers. Something with full ride height adjustment. You want to leave the spring alone, so that the shock travel is not diminished. If you diminish shock travel, you could run on a bumpstop when you take a turn hard or hit a bump...this will ruin your handling, and possibly cause damage to your shock towers.
Full ride height adjustment means that you, in essence, bring the suspension (control arm, hub, rotor, wheel) UP towards the car, instead of bringing the car DOWN towards the suspension. You turn the body of the shock up to lower the car. Basically, you shorten the entire shock body. Tein Flex has this adjustment...but I didn't really like the ride quality that i had from those on my S13.
But that is completely ignoring the angles i talked about earlier like roll center, instant center, and scrub radius. Over lowering will make your car more succeptible to body roll (yeah, you heard right, your car will roll MORE if it is lowered too far). The way to defeat that is bigger swaybars and stiffer springs. This however, reduces ride quality, and will make your car skip over bumps instead of taking them in stride and gripping over them. So there's another compromise. You could get pillowball mounts and roll center adjusters to make the geometry of the suspension correct, but you'd have to be an engineer with a blueprint of the car to make this affective. Or just know suspensions INSIDE AND OUT very very well. Which...would make you an engineer probably. However, your car will ride like crap.
Now if we get into alignment, there's really no way for me to say specifics without knowing specifics, so i'll say this. Every time you tune your coilover...you might have to tweak the alignment. ESPECIALLY if you're doing ride height changes. Some people commit the sin of buying an expensive suspension and getting a camber kit to cure their tire wear problems. Your car needs negative camber to a certain specific degree to handle like you want it to. Camber kits usually diminish handling...and are an expensive way to fix a problem. Toe is usually what kills tires. Camber barely affects tire wear. But i digress. You can use toe in/out to your advantage depnding on your setup and drivng style and skill. So thats a WHOLE another can of worms.
Damper (shock) tuning is a WHOLE different thing that would take more effort to type than I'm willing to put in.
lol so you see...lowering a car TO MAKE IT HANDLE isnt as simple as getting coilovers and slamming it. I cant say it enough. If you dont care about handling or anything besides slamming a car, there's no point in getting full coilovers. Well...on a honda anyway. They have more than enough shock travel to lower it on some gas performance shocks. If they had shitty shock travel, i could see buying a fully hieght adjustable coilover to get slammed.
To answer your question in short: The tein basic is a BASIC coilover. You will bottom out the shock and/or put it out of optimal range if you lower it much past 1.7-2'' DEPENDING ON WHAT TEIN RECOMMENDS. You can see that info on their website. If you want to slam your car, buy $60 ebay coils and put them on your existing tokico blues. I had that set up on my EK (but I did pick out some good spring rates) and i would regularly embarass cars with a LOT more money into their suspension and engine as far as handling thru a course went.
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From: Bay Area, CA, US
Re: Suspension question, brands and such. (B serious)
thats a lot of info, ahaha. Yea, i hear ya man, i'm not thinking about lowering my car that much, at most 2 inches or 2.5. I'm hella picky about suspensions, i can't decide what i really want. I like a good ride, my current set up is pretty alright, but i kinda want something stiffer and i dont know what to get. I guess the problem is i want something stiff that can also provide a good comfortable ride. I want something that can give me handles, and something that wont bottom out. So if that helps, then any further suggestions are much appreciated. Thanks man.
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Re: Suspension question, brands and such. (bmxican360)
im new to suspension also. Im going with some Tokico Illuminas. Ive riddin in cars with these shocks. They have a couple different tunable settings. They are relatively cheap for shocks but are superb quality. Being able to tune your shock is awsome. You can ajust to make the car ride like a caddy, or turn it into a full on race style setup.
I just ordered my Tokico Illuminas, And h&r lowering springs with a 2 inch drop. Sounds like this maybe kind of what you are describing. Springs are progressive compression(meaning the spring gets stiffer as it compresses more so it takes small bumps better with out bouncing all over the road), coilovers are not. (whch is good for a race track, but not so great for a bumpy street)
Im a noob, but hope this helps man.
Devin
I just ordered my Tokico Illuminas, And h&r lowering springs with a 2 inch drop. Sounds like this maybe kind of what you are describing. Springs are progressive compression(meaning the spring gets stiffer as it compresses more so it takes small bumps better with out bouncing all over the road), coilovers are not. (whch is good for a race track, but not so great for a bumpy street)
Im a noob, but hope this helps man.
Devin
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Re: Suspension question, brands and such. (TheKid1488)
cant go wrong with k sport/ omni power/ tein/ PIC/ or gc and koni combo
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Re: Suspension question, brands and such. (B serious)
Ya that is a lot of info and im not looking to lower it all that much at most maybe 2" but if i can get a little less than that it would be great cus were i am we get a good amount of snow and i dont want that to be a problem
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Re: Suspension question, brands and such. (4F_HANS)
I've had other people recommend tein. have u had them or was that just a suggestion? and to lower it what do u think about eibach springs.
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Re: Suspension question, brands and such. (bmxican360)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by bmxican360 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">thats a lot of info, ahaha. Yea, i hear ya man, i'm not thinking about lowering my car that much, at most 2 inches or 2.5. I'm hella picky about suspensions, i can't decide what i really want. I like a good ride, my current set up is pretty alright, but i kinda want something stiffer and i dont know what to get. I guess the problem is i want something stiff that can also provide a good comfortable ride. I want something that can give me handles, and something that wont bottom out. So if that helps, then any further suggestions are much appreciated. Thanks man.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Well if you want your car to handle well on U.S. roads, and tracks, you're probably not looking for anything too stiff. Very stiff springs and dampers will give you good handling if the surface you're driving on is glass smooth. IMO, a good spring rate for most purposes is around 7-10K for most civics and integras. You can go slightly stiffer since those cars have a .75 wheel rate ratio. Meaning that the actual affect of the spring will only be 75% of how stiff it actually is. A 10k spring will feel and have the effect of a 7.5k spring. At your lowering height of 2'', you shouldnt have much of a problem with bottoming out or shock fatigue from over lowering. I think you're getting a good deal on the Tein basics. The lower level Tein coilovers get kinda bouncy (my flexes did) after a while, so thats another thing to consider. The best way to do it in your case is to buy sleeve overs with good spring rates, and some good shocks. Since you dont wanna go past 2'' of lowering. But to figure all that stuff out is gonna take some doing.
Well if you want your car to handle well on U.S. roads, and tracks, you're probably not looking for anything too stiff. Very stiff springs and dampers will give you good handling if the surface you're driving on is glass smooth. IMO, a good spring rate for most purposes is around 7-10K for most civics and integras. You can go slightly stiffer since those cars have a .75 wheel rate ratio. Meaning that the actual affect of the spring will only be 75% of how stiff it actually is. A 10k spring will feel and have the effect of a 7.5k spring. At your lowering height of 2'', you shouldnt have much of a problem with bottoming out or shock fatigue from over lowering. I think you're getting a good deal on the Tein basics. The lower level Tein coilovers get kinda bouncy (my flexes did) after a while, so thats another thing to consider. The best way to do it in your case is to buy sleeve overs with good spring rates, and some good shocks. Since you dont wanna go past 2'' of lowering. But to figure all that stuff out is gonna take some doing.
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From: Nowhere and Everywhere
I think there's MANY other, better products on the market for the money than the Tein stuff, namely the Koni/GC combo.
Also, I wouldn't put K Sports on the list of recommended products, not after hearing of so many of them blowing out after about a year.
*edit* what is this wheel rate ratio? 10 kg/mm spring would only act like a 7.5, huh?
Also, 10 kg/mm seems a little high for the street, unless you're slamming the car and trying to keep it off the bumpstops. That's a 560 lb/in spring, which is really too much for an off-the-shelf Koni shock to handle. Even the 7.5 is a 420 lb/in spring. I had 380 lb/in springs in front and 450 lb/in out back when I had GC's on Konis, and the ride was pretty horrendous on my 100-mile daily commute. I don't know, maybe if I went with something like 450 up front and only 350 in back it would have been a little better.
Also, I wouldn't put K Sports on the list of recommended products, not after hearing of so many of them blowing out after about a year.
*edit* what is this wheel rate ratio? 10 kg/mm spring would only act like a 7.5, huh?
Also, 10 kg/mm seems a little high for the street, unless you're slamming the car and trying to keep it off the bumpstops. That's a 560 lb/in spring, which is really too much for an off-the-shelf Koni shock to handle. Even the 7.5 is a 420 lb/in spring. I had 380 lb/in springs in front and 450 lb/in out back when I had GC's on Konis, and the ride was pretty horrendous on my 100-mile daily commute. I don't know, maybe if I went with something like 450 up front and only 350 in back it would have been a little better.
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Re: (PatrickGSR94)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by PatrickGSR94 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I think there's MANY other, better products on the market for the money than the Tein stuff, namely the Koni/GC combo.
Also, I wouldn't put K Sports on the list of recommended products, not after hearing of so many of them blowing out after about a year.
*edit* what is this wheel rate ratio? 10 kg/mm spring would only act like a 7.5, huh?
Also, 10 kg/mm seems a little high for the street, unless you're slamming the car and trying to keep it off the bumpstops. That's a 560 lb/in spring, which is really too much for an off-the-shelf Koni shock to handle. Even the 7.5 is a 420 lb/in spring. I had 380 lb/in springs in front and 450 lb/in out back when I had GC's on Konis, and the ride was pretty horrendous on my 100-mile daily commute. I don't know, maybe if I went with something like 450 up front and only 350 in back it would have been a little better.</TD></TR></TABLE>
450/350 is exactly what i had and i loved it. But it was a little soft. I think for beginners it's very good, but as i progressed i kinda wanted something more. So depending on the OPs driver level, maybe the softer springs would suit. I said anything between 7-10k, though. The 450/350lb equals 8/6k just about. So I guess anything between 6-10k would work relatively well.
What i mean by the wheel rate:
On a civic/integra with front double wishbone, and rear multilink (DC/DA/EG/EK/EF), the position where the shock sits on the control arm is at about 75% of the length of the control arm from the chassis. This means that the leverage that the Hub (wheel) has on the control arm is 25% more. Hence, the force that the spring can put on the wheel is DECREASED by 25%, making it 75%.
Simply put, lets say the LCA is 10''. The chassis is at 0'', the Shock is at 7.5'', and the hub is at 10''. So the hub actually has a small (2.5'') lever to push on the spring with. Those are not the exact measurements, but those above mentioned cars generally have a 75% spring rate. GENERALLY SPEAKING.
In contrast: if it was like a Mcperhson strut car, like a 240sx or RSX, where the spring was directly (almost) above the hub, you get a 1:1 or 100% ratio. A 10k spring on a mcpherson strut car will be a 10k spring.
Also, I wouldn't put K Sports on the list of recommended products, not after hearing of so many of them blowing out after about a year.
*edit* what is this wheel rate ratio? 10 kg/mm spring would only act like a 7.5, huh?
Also, 10 kg/mm seems a little high for the street, unless you're slamming the car and trying to keep it off the bumpstops. That's a 560 lb/in spring, which is really too much for an off-the-shelf Koni shock to handle. Even the 7.5 is a 420 lb/in spring. I had 380 lb/in springs in front and 450 lb/in out back when I had GC's on Konis, and the ride was pretty horrendous on my 100-mile daily commute. I don't know, maybe if I went with something like 450 up front and only 350 in back it would have been a little better.</TD></TR></TABLE>
450/350 is exactly what i had and i loved it. But it was a little soft. I think for beginners it's very good, but as i progressed i kinda wanted something more. So depending on the OPs driver level, maybe the softer springs would suit. I said anything between 7-10k, though. The 450/350lb equals 8/6k just about. So I guess anything between 6-10k would work relatively well.
What i mean by the wheel rate:
On a civic/integra with front double wishbone, and rear multilink (DC/DA/EG/EK/EF), the position where the shock sits on the control arm is at about 75% of the length of the control arm from the chassis. This means that the leverage that the Hub (wheel) has on the control arm is 25% more. Hence, the force that the spring can put on the wheel is DECREASED by 25%, making it 75%.
Simply put, lets say the LCA is 10''. The chassis is at 0'', the Shock is at 7.5'', and the hub is at 10''. So the hub actually has a small (2.5'') lever to push on the spring with. Those are not the exact measurements, but those above mentioned cars generally have a 75% spring rate. GENERALLY SPEAKING.
In contrast: if it was like a Mcperhson strut car, like a 240sx or RSX, where the spring was directly (almost) above the hub, you get a 1:1 or 100% ratio. A 10k spring on a mcpherson strut car will be a 10k spring.
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From: Nowhere and Everywhere
Re: (B serious)
ah gotcha. So a 10K spring on a Honda won't feel as harsh (or be as effective at preventing bottoming out) as would a 10K spring on a car w/ Mac struts?
I guess the harsh ride on my car was due to the 450 lb (stiffer) springs being in the rear.
Before I had GC's, I had H&R Sport springs on the Konis, that was just awful. 276 lb/in springs FTL
I guess the harsh ride on my car was due to the 450 lb (stiffer) springs being in the rear.
Before I had GC's, I had H&R Sport springs on the Konis, that was just awful. 276 lb/in springs FTL
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Re: (PatrickGSR94)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by PatrickGSR94 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">ah gotcha. So a 10K spring on a Honda won't feel as harsh (or be as effective at preventing bottoming out) as would a 10K spring on a car w/ Mac struts?
I guess the harsh ride on my car was due to the 450 lb (stiffer) springs being in the rear.
Before I had GC's, I had H&R Sport springs on the Konis, that was just awful. 276 lb/in springs FTL</TD></TR></TABLE>
lol yeah the 276lbs are supersoft.
I guess the harsh ride on my car was due to the 450 lb (stiffer) springs being in the rear.
Before I had GC's, I had H&R Sport springs on the Konis, that was just awful. 276 lb/in springs FTL
</TD></TR></TABLE>lol yeah the 276lbs are supersoft.
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Re: (B serious)
damn hard parkers. lol
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by B serious »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
lol yeah the 276lbs are supersoft. </TD></TR></TABLE>
bounce around like a mother I bet.
I'm getting tokico's, and H&R's in a few weeks.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by B serious »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
lol yeah the 276lbs are supersoft. </TD></TR></TABLE>
bounce around like a mother I bet.
I'm getting tokico's, and H&R's in a few weeks.
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Re: (PLAGUED_DB7)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by PLAGUED_DB7 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">damn hard parkers. lol
bounce around like a mother I bet.
I'm getting tokico's, and H&R's in a few weeks. </TD></TR></TABLE>
Well im guessing they didnt bounce much depending on the height. The stock spring rates are soft and they dont bounce. Bouncyness comes usually from shocks being too low. Damping force (making stuff stop vibrating or bouncing) comes from shocks. If anything, harder springs will make things bounce more because there will be too high of a frequency for the shock to handle.
bounce around like a mother I bet.
I'm getting tokico's, and H&R's in a few weeks.
</TD></TR></TABLE>Well im guessing they didnt bounce much depending on the height. The stock spring rates are soft and they dont bounce. Bouncyness comes usually from shocks being too low. Damping force (making stuff stop vibrating or bouncing) comes from shocks. If anything, harder springs will make things bounce more because there will be too high of a frequency for the shock to handle.
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Re: Suspension question, brands and such. (bmxican360)
Don't waste you money on low end tein setups. If you want the best bang for the buck I owuld say koni yellow/ground gc. I have them and they work great! 400/500 is great for fun on the track!
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Re: Suspension question, brands and such. (B serious)
ok so i've gathered all the information you've given me and i think your suggestion is good. With that in mind im thinking of getting either koni yellow shocks or tokico illumina shocks, and get the sleeve covers. As for springs im not sure what to get, i mean i have the eibach lowering spring. Which shocks would you recommend and which springs? Thanks for all the help i really appreciate it.
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Re: Suspension question, brands and such. (bmxican360)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by bmxican360 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">ok so i've gathered all the information you've given me and i think your suggestion is good. With that in mind im thinking of getting either koni yellow shocks or tokico illumina shocks, and get the sleeve covers. As for springs im not sure what to get, i mean i have the eibach lowering spring. Which shocks would you recommend and which springs? Thanks for all the help i really appreciate it. </TD></TR></TABLE>
Well, what i mean by sleeve overs is the type of coilover that comes with a perch adjuster. You know...the generic, or the ground control or skunk2 or whatever else. I have heard a lot of good things about ground control. You can get them in specific spring rates. I think that 6-8k is good for beginners. Go slightly stiffer in the front. It will make the car more predictable. As you advance, you could try some stiffer springs in the back or whatever you feel comfortable with. Honestly, the learning curve depends on being able to tell what the car is "saying" and then replying with the correct answer. I've heard good stuff about both shocks that you mentioned above. I had blues on my civic and it handled great. It was simple and effective....AND cost effective as well.
</TD></TR></TABLE>Well, what i mean by sleeve overs is the type of coilover that comes with a perch adjuster. You know...the generic, or the ground control or skunk2 or whatever else. I have heard a lot of good things about ground control. You can get them in specific spring rates. I think that 6-8k is good for beginners. Go slightly stiffer in the front. It will make the car more predictable. As you advance, you could try some stiffer springs in the back or whatever you feel comfortable with. Honestly, the learning curve depends on being able to tell what the car is "saying" and then replying with the correct answer. I've heard good stuff about both shocks that you mentioned above. I had blues on my civic and it handled great. It was simple and effective....AND cost effective as well.
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From: Nowhere and Everywhere
The only type of sleeve coilover I would recommend is Ground Control, and ONLY when paired with Koni shocks. The way the Koni-specific GC's mate up with the Koni shocks makes for a really nice setup. There is no stock-looking spring perch that goes unused, and it essentially becomes a full coilover setup.
Don't mind the rubber dust boot, it was too big and didn't work very well.
As for Tokico HP (blue) shocks, I would never recommend those for anything but stock replacement or the mildest of lowering spring. They are meant to be an OEM replacement. My buddy put them on a Civic with H&R Race springs and OMG talk about a horrible ride. They blew out in a matter of months.
Don't mind the rubber dust boot, it was too big and didn't work very well.
As for Tokico HP (blue) shocks, I would never recommend those for anything but stock replacement or the mildest of lowering spring. They are meant to be an OEM replacement. My buddy put them on a Civic with H&R Race springs and OMG talk about a horrible ride.
They blew out in a matter of months.
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 50
Likes: 0
From: Indy, IN
Re: (B serious)
You're a little off on your equation. You have to square the motion ratio.
Basically, to determine your wheel rates, multiply your spring rate by your motion ratio squared.
Wheel_Rate = Spring_Rate * (Motion_Ratio)^2
Example:
Spring Rate = 450
Motion Ratio = .75
WR = 450*(.75)^2
WR = 253.125
Hope this clears up a few things.
Latez,
Paul
PS - I rock GC/Koni Combo with 400F/300R
Basically, to determine your wheel rates, multiply your spring rate by your motion ratio squared.
Wheel_Rate = Spring_Rate * (Motion_Ratio)^2
Example:
Spring Rate = 450
Motion Ratio = .75
WR = 450*(.75)^2
WR = 253.125
Hope this clears up a few things.
Latez,
Paul
PS - I rock GC/Koni Combo with 400F/300R
Cool Cool Island Breezes. BOY-EE
iTrader: (1)
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,953
Likes: 9
From: TRILLINOIS....WAY downtown, jerky.
Re: (Zman15)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Zman15 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">You're a little off on your equation. You have to square the motion ratio.
Basically, to determine your wheel rates, multiply your spring rate by your motion ratio squared.
Wheel_Rate = Spring_Rate * (Motion_Ratio)^2
Example:
Spring Rate = 450
Motion Ratio = .75
WR = 450*(.75)^2
WR = 253.125
Hope this clears up a few things.
Latez,
Paul
PS - I rock GC/Koni Combo with 400F/300R </TD></TR></TABLE>
Yeah ...you're right sorry.
Basically, to determine your wheel rates, multiply your spring rate by your motion ratio squared.
Wheel_Rate = Spring_Rate * (Motion_Ratio)^2
Example:
Spring Rate = 450
Motion Ratio = .75
WR = 450*(.75)^2
WR = 253.125
Hope this clears up a few things.
Latez,
Paul
PS - I rock GC/Koni Combo with 400F/300R
</TD></TR></TABLE>Yeah ...you're right sorry.
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 503
Likes: 0
From: Midwest
Re: (B serious)
I love this thread. This is the deepest look into Suspension tech I've seen and it's great. I knew there was so much to know but I had no clue where to start. Big for B serious and everyone else contributing to this.
for B serious and everyone else contributing to this.
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