Don't know how many of you guys are running Toda Timing Belts but I was quite suprised when I found the culprit to my sudden power loss.





My car suddenly started running as if I had 60hp and decided to investigate at work today. Luckily I work at a dealership and found that my cam gears were off timing. Took off the plastic cover and found my toda belt all beat up. This is at bout 60,000 miles with spoon cam gears. Kind of pissed cause I spent $150 for this thinking its the shiznit. Just thought I would lay the info out.

 

I would think that if you even considered spending $150 on a timing belt to begin with you probably care a little bit about your motor, and if you do care about your motor, you might think to check things like that a lot more often, maybe even have already replaced it at say 30k miles, just my opinion what I would have done

 

I continually checked the timing belt as well as the motor so don't sweat me. An OEM Timing belt is supposed to be replaced at about every 80,000 miles. But as the pictures show you, the Toda belt just bout fell apart at 60,000. I don't think it's "stronger" than oem durability wise because I have taken oem belts off at around 60,000 and they do not look like this.

 

What I am trying to explain is that the Toda Timing belt is not worth the $150 when you can get an oem one that does the same thing for $50. I know toda makes good products, but I feel that the timing belts are not all they are hyped up to be.

 

oem timing belt is every 60,000 idk where you got 80,000 from, and a car with modified and added power is pronable to premature damage....i change my oil every 2,000 just cuz i beat on it, do full tune up every year....you gotta remember, your pushing everything to its limits, things are gonna break and wear faster.

 

FYI OEM timing belt replacement interval is 105k miles.
It was 90,000 miles up until 1996, then from 1997 on up it became 105k miles. 60k is not a lot of miles for a "super strong" timing belt.

 

60,000 is a lot for any timing belt on a modified motor....

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by h2b_eg8 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">60,000 is a lot for any timing belt on a modified motor....</TD></TR></TABLE>
Why?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by b19coupe &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Why?</TD></TR></TABLE>

your pushing things past their limit...things WILL break prematurely...any1 who thinks otherwise is crazy...

 

Break it down. What exactly would cause a timing belt, that is factory tested to be safe to 105k miles and beyond, to fail? It ain't so just because someone said it. A clear and concise technical explanation would be most welcome.

 

high compression, makes a motor harder to turn, therefore putting more tension on a belt...too much tension/faulty tensioner could cause a belt to wear prematurely (a lot of motors i work on come with belts way way wayyyy toooo tight.....i've seen stock single stick civic belts break at 50,000 70,000 or even sometimes only at 120,000+ lol some motors just get lucky

 

and how do they factory test it to 105k? i think driver conditions would take a big factor...a grandma driving a civic and a 19 year old driving the same exact civic, i'd be willing to bet my life that granny's belt would last longer....also if there ever was seals leaking could cause a belt to break....could be soooo many possibilities...

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by h2b_eg8 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">high compression, makes a motor harder to turn, therefore putting more tension on a belt</TD></TR></TABLE>
When cranking this is true. When the motor is running high compression puts no more stress on the belt than low compression.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by h2b_eg8 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">too much tension/faulty tensioner could cause a belt to wear prematurely </TD></TR></TABLE>
A faulty tensioner does not really support the argument that timing belts will fail prematurely on a built, high performance engine. The cars that I have seen with stripped timing belt teeth, without a single exception, all had extremely loose belt tension.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by h2b_eg8 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">and how do they factory test it to 105k? i think driver conditions would take a big factor...a grandma driving a civic and a 19 year old driving the same exact civic, i'd be willing to bet my life that granny's belt would last longer....also if there ever was seals leaking could cause a belt to break....could be soooo many possibilities...</TD></TR></TABLE>
The service manual actually has two maintenance schedules-normal and severe. I think that Grandma would fall under the "normal" category Leaking seals are another extraneous reason for belt failure, not related to performance engines.

 

im not only talking bout stupped teeth, im talking about snapped belts, that doesnt happen from a loose belt...

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by b19coupe &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The service manual actually has two maintenance schedules-normal and severe. I think that Grandma would fall under the "normal" category Leaking seals are another extraneous reason for belt failure, not related to performance engines.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

lol performance engines leak oil too...

 

anyways, i wouldnt keep a belt for longer then a year, i just like to keep my motors fresh, thats just me tho, and i use oem honda belts..

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by h2b_eg8 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">lol performance engines leak oil too...</TD></TR></TABLE>
Very true. That does not, however, establish that performance engines are more likely than stock motors to shred timing belt teeth.


One thing on high performance Honda motors that will put additional stress on the timing belt are performance camshafts. Stiffer valve springs also increase the load on the timing belt.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by b19coupe &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Very true. That does not, however, establish that performance engines are more likely than stock motors to shred timing belt teeth.


One thing on high performance Honda motors that will put additional stress on the timing belt are performance camshafts. Stiffer valve springs also increase the load on the timing belt.</TD></TR></TABLE>

you your right, i tell you what i see more snapped belts then shredded teath, but it all comes out to one thing, on most cases bent valves so end results are the same no matter the initial issue.

 

What camshafts were used in the engine along with valvetrain combo?

 

yeah i'd also like to know what cams were used, toda b's maybe?

 

I was running skunk2 stage 2 for bout 3 months. THen I switched it up to 96-97 ITR cams. I am running Skunk2 Valvetrain as well. My compression is approx. 10.6. JDM 2nd gen b16 with mugen headgasket. If you knew me in person and seen me drive you would think I drive like a grandma. NO joke. I go 70 on the freeway cause of b16 tranny and my motor burns oil and I don't like spending money on oil when I shouldn't.

 

what would cause the toda belt to wear like this? its a POS period. this stuff has been known for 5-6yrs at least. i remember when threads like this started popping up. OEM=best period.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 1 2 NV &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> OEM=best period.</TD></TR></TABLE>

 

saw a thread about this in the itr forum, with a toda belt a year or two ago,

do people have problems with oem belts?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by FullRaceHonda &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">saw a thread about this in the itr forum, with a toda belt a year or two ago,

do people have problems with oem belts?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Very, very, very rarely.

Oem is the way to go.