Posted: Tue Dec 12, 2006 12:58 pm Post subject: Life after an ITR....

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....a tale of two half's

I am still gutted after selling the Integra. I thought I would forget about having fun with driving and get used to driving a sh*tbox about. I even started to have a little game seeing how many MPG the mighty Toyota Carina would push (37-42 if anyone cares!) but the lack of anything interesting met an end this weekend.

The sale came from the need to fund a disturbing mortgage payment and double garage but with nothing to fill it apart from sh*te it was only a matter of time before the 'house fund' became what can we buy next? Obviously a Toyota Carina isn't the last word in sophistication, even in 1990 when this one was built it was duller than dull so anything that handled remotely well was going to feel like an F1 car. Enter an Mk1 MR2. Fairly decent money but 30K and in great condition. I would have taken it for sure but I had already arranged to look at another car, something a little warmer.

I shouldn't have viewed it, I shouldn't have sat in it and definately should never had gone for a test drive. With the less than fantastic reaction from my partner of 'what that one there.....my God, tell me you're f*cking joking......you are f*cking joking aren't you' still ringing in my ears I did all of these things and have now told the the MR2 seller that I dont want the car and set all the wheels in motion for the next part of the tale. Quite frankly it scares the crap out of me!

Strange though it is that something of relative cheapness can suck you into relative exclusivity. There are millions of Golfs/RS's/Elises etc, etc they are an everyday thing. ITR's introduce you to a place that is very bad because the replacement is going to be one of two paths, sideways or better. I'll discount sideways as there is nothing that stimulates that I can see. Everything I have driven has been a let down. The worst being a TT which I really wanted to be a decent drive. The Elise was good but the interior looked like Ikea had put it together not a manufacturer wanting south of 20K. Plus I know it’s a sports car but it was totally un-practical in the extreme.

M3's are nice but with all the power that they have and THAT engine noise aside it's only a 3 series and can feel like one if you are not gunning around. A newer DC5, nope don’t rate them, neither do I like the CTR. I have really tried to like the S2K since it was launched but every one I have driven (last one was an 04) felt odd. Quick, yes but so un-composed after the Integra. As a measure the last one managed sort of 80 ish down a favourite road and it got to the point where I was concerned for my health and the cars shape! For ref. the teg would rattle through closer to three figures on the same stretch.

Back to the drawing board.

Boxster - maybe, but if you are going to dump a relatively large amount of dosh into a car too civilised and running costs too high for such a practical car. Also which one, start at the 2.7 then you get into 3.2's and the face lifted ones, no.

911 - Great cars, even greater bills. Again which series to buy it soon runs away with you?

Noble - too expensive, Caterfield - too unusable, Atom - even worse, Focus RS - not special enough, new TT - too expensive, 350Z - not special enough, Ferrari 355, ho ho ho, E39 M5 too much of an all-rounder, Corvette Z06 - left hand drive only. B*llocks. Then I stumbled on something that ticked all the boxes and made me smile.

Like I said this is a tale of two parts as the car involved is going to be inspected on Friday. If its cool then I will definitely be posting it up for no other reason than to make myself feel better about selling a car that IMO has no direct replacement in this day and age and is probably the best value/£ you can buy. 6 odd years of ownership and I would have another tomorrow

Friday is MY Xmas, fingers crossed

PS I dont envy anyone making the change, good luck with it!

 

Thats an awesome story. Many of us have been there(and back).

 

You can pickup an 2000-2001 high mileage 911TT (996) for around 65-80K nowadays. They are superfast, do decent on the track. They use up alot of tires. Maintenance needs to be more meticulous and frequent. However, those bills are in most cases larger. Its a good all around car however I would have to upgrade the seats to the Porsche GT-GT3 seats.

Or, preowned GT3.

 

I live in the Uk and 996's cost three arms and several legs to run. I would love a GT3 but again dont want that level of expense, it is only a car after all

 

i'm never selling my itr!

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Luke &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">... it got to the point where I was concerned for my health and the cars shape! For ref. the teg would rattle through closer to three figures on the same stretch.[/I]</TD></TR></TABLE>

I dont quite understand what you mean when you were concerned for your health and the cars shape, did you think the car would loose control? I always thought S2k's were stiffer than ITRs.

How bout a NSX-R?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Nabil. &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

I dont quite understand what you mean when you were concerned for your health and the cars shape, did you think the car would loose control? I always thought S2k's were stiffer than ITRs.

</TD></TR></TABLE>

Not to start yet another S vs ITR debate but I personally don't think that for road use the S is as good. You'd have to drive one for yourself to see if you got on with the car

Edit. Yes I meant that the car felt unstable enough to bumpsteer off the road.

 

Next step is a E46 M3, seems like the natural progression. After that I won't have much else to look forward to automotive-wise.

 

All I can say is I've been there and I feel your pain. I think I'm still there. I had an accident in May 2005 on my way to the Expo and I haven't been as happy since. It took me almost three months to figure a replacement for my R after driving a bunch of cars. My first choice was trying to find a used Boxster S I could afford. There weren't any that fit my budget or taste. I also drove the M3, EVO, STi, 350Z, Corvette, S2000, G35 Coupe, RSX, and probably a few others. None of these had the balance and raw feeling of the Type R. I narrowed it down to the RSX and the G35 Coupe and ended up buying the G35. Its not a bad car, but its not everything that I wanted it to be. In 2005 Infiniti did away with Brembo brakes, so that pretty much eliminated track days without some brake mods. The traction control is a little overzealous and I think its under-tired (even with 19" bling wheels). I was going to throw some money at the problem and mod the car, but figured I'd hunt again for something else. So far the car I like best is the Cayman S, which is going to be in the $60K's and while its a great car there are some things it won't have that the Type R did (an LSD for one... How can you have a $60K sports car without an LSD???). I'm sure some people are going to read this and say just buy another Type R, but the thought of a 6 year old car that I don't know about scares me and car issues won't work with my job and lifestyle. Anyway, the point of all this is sometimes you don't know how good some things are until they're gone.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Luke &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Not to start yet another S vs ITR debate but I personally don't think that for road use the S is as good. You'd have to drive one for yourself to see if you got on with the car

Edit. Yes I meant that the car felt unstable enough to bumpsteer off the road.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Sounds good to me.

 

996 gt3 if you can swing it.....otherwise euro e36m3

 

I was acutally thinking about a Twin turbo supRa as a replacement but dont know how it would compare. I know I could get 600whp with a supRa with a single turbo (I read they are suppose to hold about 800whp stock?, highly unlikely though). The problem is its an old car and it costs about 25k. Anyone know any other newer 6 cyclinder Rwd turbo cars? nothing crazy like a gt2

 

Luke - track down an e30 m3 sport evo. Hell, the euro spec m3s are good enough as they are. Good track day car.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by migs &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">You can pickup an 2000-2001 high mileage 911TT (996) for around 65-80K nowadays. They are superfast, do decent on the track. They use up alot of tires. Maintenance needs to be more meticulous and frequent. However, those bills are in most cases larger. Its a good all around car however I would have to upgrade the seats to the Porsche GT-GT3 seats.

Or, preowned GT3. </TD></TR></TABLE>

The problem isn't the cost of the car when you buy it, the problem is maintianing the car after track events and abuse. my fathers 993 is a biatch to maintain because of the cost in parts and such.

GT3 seats are good, but i like the RSR seats from the 911 RS in Europe. Great for track and also everyday driving to and from the track. they still go for over 2,000.....so nice!

 

Coming from a previous/current ITR owner to an S owner I don't see any problems with the S being unstable. I can see if your used to the way FWD cars feel vs. RWD cars feel and the cornering. Sure, it's RWD so you can't step on it as early in the corner but to say it's unstable is odd. I have yet to track the S but I think it will be fine even at high speeds on track.

 

94-98 TT Supra

 

Welcome back to the ITR family...Wait... you haven't get the caR yet

 

Honda Civic Si or Acura RSX Type-S are the descendants of the ITR.

Also Honda is going to introduce a 220hp Civic Type-R in Japan..I think its being produced in England actually but I don't think its going to be available in NA or EUR

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Luke &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Not to start yet another S vs ITR debate but I personally don't think that for road use the S is as good. You'd have to drive one for yourself to see if you got on with the car

Edit. Yes I meant that the car felt unstable enough to bumpsteer off the road.</TD></TR></TABLE>

So what did you get after ITR? After all these words...
You want performance you HAVE to pay!

DC2-ITR is by far the best bang for the buck in performance! Honda WILL never produce a double-wish bone compact car EVER, EVER AND EVER!!!

 

I feel your pain... After they stole mine i was hart broken and did a butt load of looking and came up with the only other car that was a well built and handling car E36 M3. I now have a 95 " because i did not want the obd2 or the weight of side impact air bags" i have to say its not far off the R and holds a line just a bit better all though the transition is not nearly as good. And no one trys to steal it is a huge bonus..

 

funny you say that because i was looking for a '95 M3 just last week. i ended up test driving a '99 E36 M3 a couple of days ago. the engine made great noises and was very tractable. but i find the seating position to be odd because the steering wheel was so close to the high dashboard that it felt like it was glued there (non telescopic ). the steering feel was nicely weighted and typically euro-like with a great off center feel. the turn in was not nearly as sharp as i had anticpated (probably due to the soggy 245/40R17 mounted on the stockies in the front). pedal placement was odd for me because of how everything was so shifted to the left since the tranny tunnel took up so much space, but the bottom-hinged gas pedal was definitely cool. shifter was a bit long and rubbery for my taste. i didn't really like the stock suspension because it felt underdamped, possibly because of its age (also had 3 people in the car).

all in all i liked how it was solid but i think the R is more for me something fun, cheap to maintain and decently capable, especially for a fwd econobox.

 

I love threads like this. After reading it, I start the car and took it for a spin and rev it a little close to redline in 2nd and 3rd. Best natural high one can get....

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by fuko &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i didn't really like the stock suspension because it felt underdamped, possibly because of its age (also had 3 people in the car).</TD></TR></TABLE>

Probably needs new shocks or some people have put some crappy aftermarket stuff for a great car. Not that all aftermarket stuff is crap, but drove one that the aftermarket stuff seemed worse than what came on the car to begin with or it was just poorly adjusted.

 

Here she is.

 

if that's life after an ITR, i'm all for it.

congrats!

kepani