I have my own ideas for suspension and how the car is going to be used, but need some direction. I have an 00 civic hatch, that i recently purchased with stock struts front and rear with what i believe are neuspeed race springs. Ok let me say first i hate neuspeed and didn't buy the car for what it had but for what i am going to do. The car is tucking right now on 15 in civic wheels, way to low. The ride is bouncy, harsh, horrible. The car is my daily so it needs to be a lot more comfortable and solid. Now i know there are few other thigns that can help it be more soild but i have to start with the struts and springs becasue the ones in there have to go .
Like i said its going ot be my daily but it needs to handle, there is a lot of power that is being made so i don't want brake dive or massive squat when i take off. At most i will drag at the track, hpde and highway. I was thinking of getting koni yellows with gc's with top hats.
Now what about getting the konis revalved, who can i purchased revalved konis from. Next what spring rate would be best for me being a street car with high aspirations. I need it to be solid and smooth but no rock hard ride i value my kidneys too much. Its pretty much like i smack my head every bump i go over now. I live in PA know for some of the worst roads in the country turst me i agree. So help me out!

Cliffs: Civic need dd suspension not to hard but firmer than stock.

 

If you want "not too hard" you'll have brake dive and launch squat. Thats just how it is.

My Integra came stock with something like 220/110 springs, and even with 400/400 springs, there's still bodyroll and squat. And thats at about the upper limit of daily driver comfort for most people I have given a ride to. Since the DC2 is heavier than you hatch, you might find even a 400 rear spring is too much for comfortable daily driver use. Me, I'm massochistic, and will be moving up to stiffer springs soon. Then again, I have a massive 4.5 mile commute each way, so my "daily drive" is certainly shorter than most peoples.

You best bet is to get regular off the shelf Konis, and either the default GC spring rates, or something close. Get used to it, and then adjust spring rate as needed for your personal needs and comfort level. In the Road Racing / Autocross forum here, there's a race spring buy / sell sticky you can get used spring from. here

 

thats what i was thinking as far as getting springs that the gc off the shelf would be good or maybe a tiny bit stiffer, the way that it is right now is bouncy and not fun. The stiffness isn't that big of an issue as bouncing around, my biggest issue is that and bottoming out which i don't need

 

i would also like to know how i should have it set up so that it rides firm but not bottoming out the suspension and having my tires rub

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by pumafeet10 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i would also like to know how i should have it set up so that it rides firm but not bottoming out the suspension and having my tires rub</TD></TR></TABLE>

Thats easy, don't lower the car too far.

Its real easy to lower our cars too far as well. When I first installed my suspension, we guestimated the spring perches, then installed. The front tires were flushed and it looked good, but it rode terrible. After a week or bouncing, banging (bottoming out) and scraping (front bumper), I had some time to go back and start playing with the height. Even with Ground Control extended upper mounts, I was sitting on the bumpstops at ride height. The car is now raised back up to a 2 finger gap and the ride is substancially improved, bottoming out minimized to nearly non-existent, and the car handles much much better.

Konis only adjust rebound, so you can't turn the shocks to any different setting to help with bottoming. If you're too low for your spring rates, you'll bottom. If its bouncy, then your underdamped and should turn the shocks up. I couldn't turn them up enough to control the bounce when I was sitting on the bumpstops, so make sure you have adequate suspension travel before you start messing with the shocks too much.

 

Those "race" springs are overpowering your shocks. Koni/GC combo is a great choice on any car. Try http://www.shox.com

 

thats what i wanted to get is the ground control and koni's. I also think these springs have completely worked my struts to hard that they are just worn way out and close if not blown already. Also i was looking at the gc website and they have some limited edition coilover looks the same and they say nothig about a difference, but wanted to know if there was a difference b/c weaksauce.org is running a special on koni yellows, gc, and top hats so i wanted to get the right spring rates as well. But i didin't want to get some outdated or something gc coilover...

 

Go with whoever that gives you the best deal on it, I just gave you a place to start. Do you have the link to the special edition one?

 

well i was looking at the weaksauce special and it says not limited edition, and on the gc site they have limited edition, im wondering if there is any difference i emailed them but didn't have a chance to call them..http://www.ground-control-store.com/...p/II=548/CA=55 not sure whats up

also sorry wasn't shooting the site down that you sent me for prices they def are a good deal on there..thanks

 

Doesn't look any different. Goes with any one you can get a good deal on.

 

the weaksos ones you can chose your spring rates and the threaded sleeves are made specifically for koni shock's diamter, the special/limited edition are their standard 'shelf' rates, 380F and 250R I believe.

 

i just talked to gc and the limited edition ones are set spring rates like chrisw85 stated so i thought there was something special about them, but other than having set rates thats about it. I was looking and they have springs for drag, auto x, swap and such. I guess i should get ones for aggressive street driving with an H22 swap. It needs to be all around capable, but not so hard i will smack my head on the ceiling or continously bounce around. I know they can reccomend rates but what do you think would be appropriate for what i am thinking, or are there more questions i should ask?

 

400F and start off at 350 rear and go from there. the rear rates is what you primarily feel as harshness. i'd even go 450 front and 375 rear that won't be too bad depending on how much rebound you have set on the konis; 1/2 from full soft should do it.

 

yeah i want to get or could handle something more than the standard rate but again this is a car that will be driving on horrible pennsylvania roads so i need to be able to absorb bumps,potholes moslty and what not. But i also i will be putting rather large sways on and other accompanying suspension components so i def want to do back road carving, things like that. if anything the car will be daily driven, high speed highway fast things , i just want the car to really be able to handle and be safe. I need to be confident about my suspension not creaking breaking and blowing out on me. ok thanks again

 

Go with OTS then upgrade if necessary. My first setup was 450/500. Then I bought 350 and swap out the 500. I am planning to swap the front for 375. A little too harsh for me.

 

GC's are possibly the worst sleeve coilover i have ever used and or seen. 100% junk. If you want a coilover...BUY A COILOVER. If not AGXs and Sportlines are aggresive but very driveable.

 

why not konis? and what is junk about the coilover? i want eibach springs and they offer them and then also with the extended top hat for more range,

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ComeOnKip &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">GC's are possibly the worst sleeve coilover i have ever used and or seen. 100% junk. If you want a coilover...BUY A COILOVER. If not AGXs and Sportlines are aggresive but very driveable.</TD></TR></TABLE>

you are pretty un-educated about suspension. GC is a coilover.

give me one sold fact about why GC's suck, you can't do it......

 

pumafeet10
I just have a preference for Kayaba and most things they make. Konis are an excellent choice to, just not for me. I just think if you want height adjustability, you should buy somethings that both crucial parts are designed to co-exsist, not just slap an adj. spring on a damper and hope for the best.

slammed_93_hatch
Oh I can give you a bunch, and no its NOT a true coilover assbone. They are sleeve overs, NOT REAL COILOVERS. They are not matched for a shock/damper, and they are dirt cheap. JUNK. Theres a reason a set of Teins cost at least $700 and you can get those for next to nothing. Sorry if you're sponsored by them or whatever. The aluminum seats freeze up. The spring rates are crap. They look horrible. I mean I can go on....

But lets not jack this kids thread, I don't like them and lets leave it at that.

And don't tell me I don't know anything about suspensions when I set up dirt cars all day buddy. My post count isn't a direct correlation to my intelligence / knowledge about cars.




Modified by ComeOnKip at 6:31 PM 12/23/2006

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ComeOnKip &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

slammed_93_hatch
Oh I can give you a bunch, and no its NOT a true coilover assbone. They are sleeve overs, NOT REAL COILOVERS. </TD></TR></TABLE>

A.) Coilover means that the spring goes OVER the damper. So most honda's have a coilover suspension stock. So yes it looks like you don't know what your talking about.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ComeOnKip &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> They are not matched for a shock/damper, </TD></TR></TABLE>

B.) there isn't a "perfect" valving for a given spring rate, shocks have a range of spring rates that they can dampen properly. Even your teins that you are talking about have a range, although it is extremely small compared to say a Koni.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ComeOnKip &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> and they are dirt cheap. JUNK. Theres a reason a set of Teins cost at least $700 and you can get those for next to nothing. </TD></TR></TABLE>

C.) If you take a survey of height adjustable coilover setups ground control's are the most expensive.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ComeOnKip &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> Sorry if you're sponsored by them or whatever. The aluminum seats freeze up. The spring rates are crap. They look horrible. I mean I can go on....</TD></TR></TABLE>

D.) Yes i am sponsored by them, but I went after a sponsorship because they make/use great parts. The aluminum seats freeze up??? what are you talking about? They don't rust, and they can't 'freeze' together. Spring rates are crap? The OTS rates are a huge compromise between performance and being comfortable. FYI you can also pick ANY spring rates you want from the Eibach line of springs. Looks? are you some kind of show stoppa who want bling befor function

 

most expensive compared to what? dropzone? slamurride.com? whatever man, you're entitled to your opinion. its not a full coilover set up, its a coilover spring. personally if i'm going to spend my money, I want a damper and spring that were designed to work with each other, not a spring that can work with any shock and visa versa. the springs have no length to them, at the top inch of suspension travel the spring is unloaded by 3/4 of an inch at least. and teins and others of the sort are small in adjustability range because you don't need a ridiculous amount of adjustability to dial in your suspension when things are made to work together. and aluminum definitely seizes, i'll mail you my GC coils to prove it.

 

Most of the valving you see in the popular "jdm" coilovers is the same. There really is no difference between a civic, teg, wrx, etc kits. Most of the spring rates are nearly the same as well.

 

gotta link to some shock dyno threads? I'd like to verify that to know for myself actually. and spring rates nearly the same? a what? a supra spring is no heavier then a civic one? I could understand maybe if you meant the amount of spring rate to the given weight of a car but....

http://www.tein.com/badamp.html

so the 893 lb front spring for an s4 is in the same ball park as the 448 for my ed8? me thinks not.




Modified by ComeOnKip at 5:24 PM 12/24/2006

 

geez what am i supposed to do now i don't know what to get! i def don't want some sloppy suspension on my car like what is there now. i know an individual who had gc's on her celica and well i was less then impressed but from people on here and a few people with civics like mine they like them. I don't have a race car by any means but i want the best for a street car. would should i do They need to last a long time and take bad road abuse. quality and being solid are my biggest requirements. ok lets say i have no idea what to get what do i get? high speed highway driving, agressive backroad carving maybe drag racing on dr's and soft yet reponsive. any more wuaest PLEASE as k me i need help

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ComeOnKip &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">gotta link to some shock dyno threads? I'd like to verify that to know for myself actually. and spring rates nearly the same? a what?</TD></TR></TABLE>

search. we went over this a few years ago.