Well im in the process of changing out my cam gears. So far this is what Ive done.

1)remove valve cover
2) set to tdc
3)slide the timing belt off after marking tdc
4)remove old cam gears
5)install new ones

Now after the install of the new cam gears Im off by a half a tooth. Ive search about this happening and found that I have to loosen the timing belt and rotate the engine. Well I look down below and notice a plug thats covering a 14mm nut and I was wondering if that was the timing belt tensioner. Can someone confirm this? I have the jdm b18cR motor. Also if anyone has any tips for lining the cam gears up please let me know. thanks for the help.



Modified by skata89 at 2:26 PM 12/9/2006

 

You are correct. Remove the plug and you are set.

As far as lining up the gears, If you can not set them by hand, you can use the pin method and that will keep them lined up for you.

 

ummm how did you slide the belt off without loosening the tensioner? as far as I know, I dont think its supposed to be that easy. you should have to loosen the tensioner to get the belt off. sounds like the tensioner spring is weak, or the belt wasnt properly installed originally.

 

I slide the belt off just by pushing a little bit at a time. But I just posted up a pic of the cams and notice that between each white line on the left side it has nine and on the right cam gear it only has 8. Is this correct?

 

Also what is the pin method?

 

The cover is to keep grime and stuff from getting into the center of the timing belt tensioner. It should be a roundish looking cover with a slightly elongated side. Remove that and loosen the 14mm nut. MAKE SURE that you use a six sided socket and not a 16 sided socket. For some reason, Honda decided to use a lower grade metal that strips very easily. Do not over torque it.

The cam gears when the are set at top dead center....there are those lines on the left and right side of the cams. The white ones. When the cams are in the head and the engine is at TDC, those lines are supposed to be parallel with the metal on the head, where the valve cover sits on. This will put you at the proper adjustment. If you try and line the lines up with themselves, you will be off a tooth. Remember, the motor is slightly tilted toward the front of the car.

Line the left and right lines up to the head, put on the timing belt and hold it in place. Take a coat hanger and straighten it out. Take some needle-nose pliers and at one end, bend a small hook into it. Take that hook and hook it around the bracket that connects the tensioner to the spring holding it in place. There is a small hole there. Slip the hook into that and pull up on the coat hanger. You will see that the timing belt now has tension. Pull until the OEM deflection has been achieved and have a friend tighten down the tensioner bolt. Done.

 

Now for this part
"Line the left and right lines up to the head, put on the timing belt and hold it in place. Take a coat hanger and straighten it out. Take some needle-nose pliers and at one end, bend a small hook into it. Take that hook and hook it around the bracket that connects the tensioner to the spring holding it in place. There is a small hole there. Slip the hook into that and pull up on the coat hanger. You will see that the timing belt now has tension. Pull until the OEM deflection has been achieved and have a friend tighten down the tensioner bolt. Done. "

Is that with the cover on or off?

Also Im not quite sure how you get the cam gears to line up right. Bc as you can see in the picture its off by half a tooth.


Modified by skata89 at 3:40 PM 12/9/2006

 

Here's a how to http://www.c-speedracing.com/h...t.php

 

Ya Ive look at that link but I dont want to remove the whole belt.

Whats the pin method of lining up the cam gears?

 

I was searching around and found this

Since nothing's positioned, you want to FIRST move the crank away from TDC.

Find the TDC notch in the crank pulley, turn it directly to a sideways position. You want the TDC notch to be 90 degrees away from the pointer, either towards the front or back of the engine, doesn't matter which. Even if you have to turn it backwards, just don't turn it THRU TDC or BDC. Now all 4 pistons are at mid-stroke, & you can spin the cams any way you want...

Now line up the camshaft sprockets to their #1 TDC positions.

Now turn the crank directly to the #1 TDC position. Even if you have to turn it backwards, just don't turn it thru BDC.

Now put on the belt & finish tensioning/checking it.

Would this method be safe for lining the cam gears up??

 

ive only done one timing belt, and it wasnt even on a honda. but i wouldnt follow that method. the chances that you will be completely off and destroy something is far greater than just following the c-speedracing method, or the one posted above. or even one in a haynes manual.
and i especially wouldnt follow it if you are questioning yourself as to whether or not it is safe... just follow a provon safe method

when it comes to internals, im extremely paranoid that i follow proper procedure, so take that as you will.


Modified by 6gSI at 3:29 PM 12/10/2006

 

see what I dont understand is why you have to remove the timing belt to get the cam gears to line up. can someone plz explain how take the timing belt off would help this?

Also how do you line the cam gears up? Im only a half a tooth off.

And on the timing belt tensioner do I just loosen the bolt the loosen the belt and tight the bolt when I have the belt back on? Or is there more to it then that?


Modified by skata89 at 10:30 AM 12/10/2006


Modified by skata89 at 10:34 AM 12/10/2006

 

"The cam gears when the are set at top dead center....there are those lines on the left and right side of the cams. The white ones. When the cams are in the head and the engine is at TDC, those lines are supposed to be parallel with the metal on the head, where the valve cover sits on. This will put you at the proper adjustment. If you try and line the lines up with themselves, you will be off a tooth. Remember, the motor is slightly tilted toward the front of the car."

did you even read the guide?

it clearly explains how you should line up the cam gears. they all need to be set in certain positions with the timing belt off before putting the belt on to make sure that everything is lined up properly. the timing belt precisely spins each gear at the same rate with it on. thats what its purpose is, to make sure that all the rotational parts in your motor are TIMED right so that combustion can occur and so that stuff doesnt slam into other stuff causing damage.

are you absolutely positive that your at TDC? is it possible that the cam gears are installed correctly? (ive never messed with cam gears on a honda before but is it possible that they just need to be spun 180 degrees to line up?) also, maybe the reason that they are off by half a tooth is because your not at exatly TDC. that would make a half tooth difference, but it wouldnt be aligned at the head level if that were the case.

so if you could just freely move teeth with the timing belt on, then stuff would be out of whack as far as timing goes, and the dreaded "breaking stuff" would happen. the same guide that i am referencing explains how to adjust the tensioner aswell.

maybe someone with a little more exp should be doing this for you? or there at least so that he can answer your questions and make sure that your not gonna break your baby

some links :
http://www.unorthodoxracing.co..._.pdf
http://www.team-integra.net/se...=1195 (goto page 21 and 22)


Modified by 6gSI at 3:50 PM 12/10/2006

 

OOOOK....

Do this...

The crank should be at TDC....which it still should be since you rotated it to TDC before you took the belt off.

Next is the cam gears....get a 17mm wrench (im 99% sure thats the size of the bolt on the cam gears) and you can turn the cams until the lines on the cam gears are aligned.....it shoudl take literally 5 seconds to get the cam gears lined up. if it keeps shifting down a half tooth then shove a screw driver through the gear, resting on the head of the engine to hold it in place.

After that, get a coat hang, bend the end over with needle nose pliers, like mentioned above, and just fuckign grab onto the spring on the tensioner and rip that **** out....yes rip it out and throw it away. A honda mechanic will tell you im a idiot for saying that, but all the good tuners, and engine builders on here will tell you that if you want the belt good and tight (but not too tight) take the spring off and use the coat hanger method to tighten it.

Ok so now the crank is at TDC, cam gears are at TDC....loosen the 14mm tensioner bolt, NOT ALOT THOUGH....you don't want the bolt falling out or wobbling loose. just loosen it so its like a little looser than hand tight (if you had tightened it by hand)

Next turn the crank CLOCKWISE about 1/4 of an inch or slightly less....this is so that when you go to turn it counterclockwise when the belts on...it allows for the initial slack at the FRONT of the timing belt before the cam gears start to turn.

Pull the timing belt tight in the front (side towards the front of the car)..pull it tight and then slide the belt onto the cam gears making sure you pull it tight in between the cam gears as well so its not a tooth off onthe belt.

Next have friend hold the belt in place on the gears while you take your coat hanger with the little bend on the end and shove it through the hold where the spring used to attach on the tensioner. Next get your 14mm wrench on the bolt for the tensior and set it to tighten mode. (Right)

Pull upwards on the coat hanger, you should be able to see the tensioner move upward and the back side of the belt, the side of the belt closest to firewall will start gettign tighter the harder you pull the tensioner. Pull the dam thing hard as you have to until the belt is good and tight and WHILE STILL PULLING UP ON THE TENSIONER, tighten down that 14mm bolt good and tight.

And this point you can put the 19mm wrench on the crank, turn it counter clockwise and everything should be tight and at TDC.

KEEP IN MIND...that the crank turns twice for ever 1 turn of the cams, so even if the marks on the cams are lined up perfectly, but the crank TDC mark on the pulley islike 1/4 of an inch off YOUR FINE....thats NO WHERE near 1 tooth off, and you would have to be like a whole tooth off on the cam gears for somethign bad to happen like bent valves. Also, keep in mind to turn the crank a few times, checking the marks on the cam gears and crank to make sure the belt is staying tight. Your not strong enough to bend a valve so if they were hitting you wouldn't be able to to turn the crank.

EDIT: The fact that you slid the belt off without loosening the tensioner first makes me worry you might have done damage to the belt...if I were you I would inspect the hell out of it before you start the car....turn the crank a bit and check each inch of it as you go. I would say to install a new belt, but I can tell you probably don't know enough of what your doing to do that without a mechanic.


Modified by totsie7944 at 7:08 PM 12/10/2006

 

Thanks for the help guys. But I have another ? Well I was about to put the timing belt back on and notice that my crank was off tdc. So I rotated it back to tdc and then the marks I made on the timing belt dont line up anymore. So I was wondering if the crank is set to tdc and the cams are at tdc does the marks on the belt matter if they line up or not?

 

dude, start from the beginning.
1, take tension completely off of belt via 14mm under rubber grommet.
2, align crank to tdc (it's best if you had balancer and lower cover off during this whole process).
3, align cam marks with top edge of head, they should also line up together (if the cams don't want to stay in place then use a punch or small screw driver and place in hole on top of each cam, it's about an inch inward from the cam gears)(also try removing spark plugs)
4, wrap timing belt around crank gear and up to front cam gear keeping high tension on belt.
5, wrap belt around rear cam gear and water pump leaving all the belts loose tension on the back side.
6, go around the tensioner then push tensioner with finger pressure to stretch out belt on back side leaving no slack
7, tighten 14mm bolt for tensioner

You should be all set with this.

 

k thanks!

 

as long as the belt is wrapped around everything properly marks on the belt are worthless...you just gotta put it on man. I don't know any other way to explain it. just follow how I told you to do it....

 

K well I ended up just taking everything off and doing it the right way. Now I have the timing belt back on and Im to the step where you rotate the engine 6 rotations. I can only rotate it about 2 teeth and then it feels like it gets jamed. Ive recheck the markings and everything but cant figure it out. Need some help again please.

 

you probably have it done wrong man....I advise you to let a professional or someone who knows what their doing install it for you man....