I am looking to buy a set of 14" honda hx wheels. the guys says i'll need a set of spacers for my larger '92 si discs to fit. i was wondering, what are the effects of putting wheel spacers on a car/what have people noticed in terms of ride/handling/tradlife, etc.

 

It depends on how thick the spacers are.

There are a couple of big concerns when using spacers. One is the lugs (studs); if they push the wheels out so far that you can no longer get at least six full turns on the lug nuts (seven is even better), then you need to get extended lugs.

A second concern is the hub. If the spacer pushes the wheel out further so that the center bore is no longer centered on the hub, you lose the hubcentric centering and the wheel/tire is then susceptible to vibrations which can loosen the lug nuts. Some people don't have problems, but others do, even after taking all the proper precautions (e.g. tightening the lugs with the tires off the ground, etc).

You're also changing the suspension geometry, which can affect the handling, but the previous two issues are greater concerns IMHO.

I think you're much better off finding wheels that are made for your car, with the proper size and offset and center bore etc, so you don't have to take those risks...

 

Thanks a lot for the advice. For the Hx wheels to fit, it sounds like i need 5mm spacers. This doesnt sound like a whole lot to me, but is this enough to effect any of the things mentioned?

 

It's definitely enough to push them out away from the hub, enough to lose the hub centering.

As for the need for extended lugs, I'm not sure. Count how many turns you have now on the lug nuts, and count the thread pitch (number of threads per 5 mm) to see how many turns you would lose by losing 5 mm of the stud.

 

sounds like the biggest issue though is if the wheel is moved off of the hub, since you can always buy longer studs whihc i have seen a few spacer packages come with. Is there are way to remedy the hub situation?

 

You can get a "wheel adapter" type of spacer, which replaces the lugs on the hub, but it typically moves the wheels outward by an inch or more.

 

hmm. well thanks for the advice. i gotta think now on what i want.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by nsxtasy &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">It depends on how thick the spacers are.

There are a couple of big concerns when using spacers. One is the lugs (studs); if they push the wheels out so far that you can no longer get at least six full turns on the lug nuts (seven is even better), then you need to get extended lugs.

A second concern is the hub. If the spacer pushes the wheel out further so that the center bore is no longer centered on the hub, you lose the hubcentric centering and the wheel/tire is then susceptible to vibrations which can loosen the lug nuts. Some people don't have problems, but others do, even after taking all the proper precautions (e.g. tightening the lugs with the tires off the ground, etc).

You're also changing the suspension geometry, which can affect the handling, but the previous two issues are greater concerns IMHO.

I think you're much better off finding wheels that are made for your car, with the proper size and offset and center bore etc, so you don't have to take those risks...</TD></TR></TABLE>
So assuming those concerns are accounted for --- sufficient amount of turns on the lug nuts, no vibes at speed --- is it okay to run spacers? I'm just looked at 5mm or so since that's what I hear is the threshold for stock studs.

Though, with that said, I don't really see what extended studs would really do for you besides giving more thread contact.

I thought there were other issues with use of spacers such as wheel bearings being worn out more? etc.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by blackdc5 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">So assuming those concerns are accounted for --- sufficient amount of turns on the lug nuts, no vibes at speed --- is it okay to run spacers?</TD></TR></TABLE>

That's a big assumption. You're assuming that the risks won't be a problem.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by blackdc5 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I don't really see what extended studs would really do for you besides giving more thread contact.</TD></TR></TABLE>

That's exactly what they do and why they may be needed. The problem is, with the stock studs, when you use spacers you get LESS thread contact, for the threads that you lose by moving the wheels out from the car. You need to count the number of turns to see if the remaining threads give enough thread contact to keep the wheels on. If you don't have enough, then you need the extended studs.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by nsxtasy &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">That's a big assumption. You're assuming that the risks won't be a problem.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Well if you got the 2 concerns covered why is it a big assumption?
Say you only get a 5mm spacer and still have more than 7 threads left (I have no spacers right now but I KNOW I have a lot of threads) and it doesn't vibrate on the freeway.

What other RISK is there? You only spoke of those 2 concerns?

Unless the general RISK is just running spacers in general, where the use of which can make the wheel fall off?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by blackdc5 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Well if you got the 2 concerns covered why is it a big assumption?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Because they're not "covered" by saying "assume they don't happen". They can happen. Risks are covered when you take specific actions to prevent them from happening. Not just by assuming they won't happen.

You sound like you're saying "Hey I know that there is a big risk that all kinds of bad things can happen, and so this is probably a bad idea, but is it possible that none of those bad things will actually happen?" If you're willing to take those risks, then just go try it out...

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by nsxtasy &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Because they're not "covered" by saying "assume they don't happen". They can happen. Risks are covered when you take specific actions to prevent them from happening. Not just by assuming they won't happen.

You sound like you're saying "Hey I know that there is a big risk that all kinds of bad things can happen, and so this is probably a bad idea, but is it possible that none of those bad things will actually happen?" If you're willing to take those risks, then just go try it out...</TD></TR></TABLE>
That's why I'm looking into what actual risks there are before I try it out.

You said 1 concern was not enough threads and told someone else in this thread to measure how many threads etc. So lets say one DOES count how many threads and there are &gt;7 threads. CHECK.

The other concern you mentioned was is if it does not center on the hub due to the spacer it will vibrate. Lets say one does not experience vibrations. CHECK.

So that takes care of the 2 concerns you mentioned. I'm asking if there's a bigger risk...i.e. less threads will cause the wheel to fall off...

I know several people who have run spacers with extended studs for years, even during track use. So the extended studs takes care of the "not enough thread engagement concern" and they haven't experienced vibrations. What BIG risk is there then?

Don't get me wrong, I was against spacers for years (ever since I cared about cars) but when you can't find a functional wheel in the right wheel width and offset, spacers become the next idea.

I'm not trying to validate use of spacers at all. Just trying to get a better idea of the potential risks.

Running out of threads, obviously that's important, but what if you're not losing a lot. Vibrations...that can even happen without hubcentric rings. On the last 3 of my aftermarket wheels, after getting hub rings for my first Koseis, I skipped out on the hub rings and learned to center the wheel during install. No vibes ever.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by blackdc5 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">You said 1 concern was not enough threads and told someone else in this thread to measure how many threads etc. So lets say one DOES count how many threads and there are &gt;7 threads. CHECK.
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I'm asking if there's a bigger risk...i.e. less threads will cause the wheel to fall off...
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Running out of threads, obviously that's important, but what if you're not losing a lot.</TD></TR></TABLE>

As long as you still have at least seven threads (again, some people say six, others say seven), then you shouldn't have any concerns about less threads or running out of threads. No matter how many you lost.

 

sorry to bring this rather old thread back up.

im doing some readings on running spacers. i've used 3mm thin spacers (non hub centric) on one of my wheels for almost a year, altho i dont use the same wheels for the whole full year, but i do use it ppretty often, havnt experinced any problems wth the spacers (yet). i guess its because its only 3mm? it aint much at all.

i've recently acquired another set of wheels that needed 5-6mm spacers to clear.

i've been reading, and some says it requires at least ~6-7 turns on lug nuts? and some say it requires at least 6-7 threads? to b safe.

my question: 6-7 turns on lugnuts is completely different to 6-7 threads on the stock studs. am i wrong?

one full turn on lug nut will easily take up a few threads.

i've tried counting the turns on stock stud without spacers, wth one of my wheels. the number of 'turns' is just about 7 turns.

if the rull of thumb has it that at least 6-7 turns is required. that means i cant really use any spacers? not even the thinny 3mm?

cheers guys.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by spoonGD1 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">my question: 6-7 turns on lugnuts is completely different to 6-7 threads on the stock studs. am i wrong?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Yes, you are wrong. One turn is the same as one thread.