Well I have been reading topics saying how when Azenis's are new that they are kind of slopy on turn in (etc). Well Thomas got a set (tjtruong) and I was looking at them and noticed that because the rim is 15X6 that the side wall is angled in towards the car.Size thomas runs is 205/50/15 same as most on board. On my SI I run a rota slipstream 15X6.5 with same size tire but not a Azenis and side wall is much more straight. Seing how the Azenis side wall's are so stiff mabe because of the angle of the side wall mabe that is why they seem sloppy and mabe a stock 195/55/15 would not be as sloppy. I dont know, it was just a theory of mine. Mabe Azenis just have to be broken in or are just a sloppy tire at first.

Well all feedback and flames are welcome just was brainstorming and wanted to see what you all thaught of my theory.

Chris


[Modified by underrated99si, 8:24 AM 5/8/2002]

 

I think it is because the stock rim is not wide enough.

 

That is what I was thinking and mabe a 6.5 wide rim would be beter for the 205

 

*runs out and buys a new set of rims *

 

how long is break-in? im planning a mountain run and hate for them to get sloppy on me. i have driven them two runs at a auto-x before.

 

u are right. This has been an issue since the 94 days with GSR. My friend always complain with any 205's he puts on with oem rims because not wide enough and he feels not solid but wiggys of bulging sidewalls. I gave him my worn RE010 oem size and he couldn't believe the differences. See, Honda designed it that way.

 

When I throw my set on my stockers I'll post.

I hope they don't feel bad. I cannot afford wheels. Yet.

 

I never noticed anything until I recently put my second set of Azenis on. The old tires were damn near slick and handled great. Well except for in the rain, which was very exciting. Once the new ones were on I immediately sensed slower turn in, but I just figured it was because the new tires actually had tread blocks. We went up to the Blue Ridge Parkway recently and they seem fine now, although I've probably just adjusted to the difference. Either way they stick like mad.

 

You guys need to do a search. This topic has been talked about *at least* three times in the past month. I'm not going to bother to repost any info as it is all oout there.

 

little OT, but how many miles areyou guys geting out of your azenis? Ive heard countless reviews but nobody has really touched on this topic.

Mike D

 

I've often wondered about sidewalls that angle in towards the rim. You should see a set of 225 Hoosiers on stock rims! Those sidewalls look close to horizontal!

Disclaimer: Nothing scientific here - just thoughts - please join in and correct/expand/ramble.

The sidewall is gonna be pushed on during a turn. Given that the wider tire presents an angled sidewall, could the push actually straighten the sidewall somewhat? Kinda like putting a little negative camber in the wheel? I doubt it'd feel the same as a camber change, but there could be some benefit in that regard. Then again, maybe it won't.

Another thing is that since the sidewall is pushed out at an angle, does that tend to cause the contact patch to be smaller? Plus make the shoulder rounder? Think of a beanbag sitting on the floor. I know - but the visual works! Say it contacts 3 sq ft of floor. Now reach out and push the sides in a few inches. The beanbag would pull up from the floor, now only covering say 2.5 sq ft. Plus it went from sitting flat to a more rounded ball like stance - as if you've overinflated a tire causing it to change it's shape somewhat.

If that's true, the square shoulder that gives good turn in response is now compromised and you are effectively riding on basketballs, to exaggerate a little bit to demonstrate a point! After initial turn in, the tire may square up somewhat and give the intended response.

If that's all true (and it may not be), then a 205 may have 4% more tire patch than a 195, but on a small wheel, it may give up 3%, plus round out the shoulder. The 195 would probably be the better performing tire in that situation.

Again, just think about that and see what you come up with. It's just a thought and isn't known/tested/verified in any way. I do think what I'm talking about is true to some degree - but is it a real world factor - w/o testing, it's too hard to say.

Maybe a few of the tire techs at Tire Rack might know a thing or two about this very subject.

Here's a bit of info from Dunlop on the topic.
http://www.dunloptire.com/tiretech/?...tire_width.txt

 

Once again--do a search. We have talked about this and I even drew a pic.

 

just like the michelin F1 tires (sorry tyres). They need to be scrubbed in.

 

Hope there fine cause I just got me a set. Should be here this week :D

 

as long as they grip well , i'll get use to it and correct any sort of sloppiness.

tj

 

I agree with Todd00, do a search (if it's working today, grrr) - you'll find my post which I updated the other day. I found that when my pressures (205/50 on a 15x6) where around 30-32 the sloppiness was minimalized. It didn't go away completely, but helped a lot - it was almost floaty at 47-50psi, but always stuck to the road like glue. I might actually try the 195/50 next time around as I like my ITR wheels - otherwise I think a 6.5 or 7" width wheel would really do the trick.

 

When you lowered your pressures to 30-32 what did it do to grip?

 

Grip seems as great as before, but haven't been on the track since having the pressure that low, it was at 50f, 46b at the track. I've pushed it pretty hard through some local twisties though and I can't feel any loss of grip.

 

i was thinking of running 35 F, and 40 B for 205/15 on slipstreams. good or bad?

 

I'm not "slamming" on anyone but I don't get how these tires can be considred "sloppy". I find that these tires grip extremely well without a trace of sloppyness- except when theyre extremely hot with high pressures. I think the sloppiness referred to is when they're first slapped on. The tires need to wear down little.

 

If it matters, I had 205/50/15 RE71s on 6.0" rims on my old GSR (with that inward slant that everyone seems so concerned about), and turn in was immediate and fantastic.. then again, those old 71's had really stiff sidewalls.. for that matter, the Azenis do too, right?

I autocrossed on that old combo, and it worked fine.. unlike the wish-washy but cheap Kumho Ecsta 712 street tires that I am running now on the 15s.

 

Goch, these tires are sloppy when they are first slapped on. I put mine on last Saturday, the whole weekend they felt a little uneasy. Now, I have put maybe 200-250 miles on them and they work fine! Cant to test them at BW this Friday!

PS, I also notice the tires dont have FULL PATCH on the ground. You can see after a drive where its dirty, is where its patched the most. I HONESTLY have about 0.75" on EACH side that doesnt get a full patch. Im running 32-32psi. I will lower them at the track to maximize patch.

 

The tires don't have full patch to the ground, but they still do stick pretty well. I konw the sloppyness youre talking about. On the track, I think i was running 32 psi all around if not 30psi. Seemed to work well for me.


[Modified by Type Goch, 12:48 AM 5/9/2002]

 

more like 500 miles on most tires. THis problem is particularly noticable on RE730's.

You could do burnouts to help if you wanna waste tire.