Please if you do not know what you are talking about, or are going to post some stupid remark about ITB's being a "BLING" mod just to get a +1 ppd, do not post here.

After wanting to go the ITB route for the last two years, I have finally decided to start saving my money and pull the plug once I have majority of the money saved. This may take a while, but untill that time I can learn as much as I can.

I understand ITB's are a big PITA to get running properly. I decided that I will need AEM EMS, and a good tuner which I have found.

Their are several brands of ITB's for the s2000, but here are the 4 main companies:
Hayward
http://haywardperformance.com/intake.htm

TWM
http://www.twminduction.com/Th....html

Toda
http://www.toda-racing.jp/new/frame_new.html

Jenvey
http://www.compsystems.com.au/77-103a.htm

Now it is said that Tracy Sports will be offering ITB's to the public this year, but from what I understand they are just re labeled TODAS.

Is one company better than the next? I cant answer this question. I know that some kits use the independant runner method and some have a solid piece.

As for mm's (48mm - 52mm), Im not sure where the difference lies. With dyno charts on a stock s2000 motor tuned with EMS it seems that the 50mm and 52mm makes generally the same amount of power.

I would like to learn more about the mm for the horns, and the pros and cons of the sizes.

Also, any other additional information would help out alot. I know you lose heat/ac with ITB's, but TWM does make adapters to retain these features. Personally I would lose the AC, but try to keep my heat.

Like I said before, only helpful information in this thread

 

runner volume affects where the power is made. Longer = more peak which is really the way to go except none of them are long enough to be truely usable. Most people don't dive below VTEC when doing any form of racing so why would you want to have more power below VTEC engagement?

Why would you lose air conditioning with ITB's?

It's a bling mod. I have first hand experience.

 

ITB's are a touchy subject,
without the supporting mods to the motor you will not benefit the full potenial of the ITB's.
also the Jenvey's are a nice set because they dont "stick" like TWM's and others that i have heard of...

 

The 50mm and 52mm measurements refer to throttle plate diameter, not runner/horn length. As far as the difference in the power on the stock motor/EMS combo, I'm betting that they did it on the F20. I would like to see the same test on an F22.

A/C should not be a factor.

With all that said, I would not even touch ITBs until I've opened up the motor and swap some goodies out. Let me know how it goes Frank.

 

Seen this?
http://www.s2ki.com/forums/ind...&st=0
Without one or the other. ITB's strike me as being the "icing on the cake" to a high compression, all motor, every bolt-on in the book car. I'm not swaying you from them, but there is A LOT left on the table IMO. Tuning seems to be the brunt of it. You'll also be in the market for engine management.

 

I know that From personal experience that ITB's Love compression. Like you said ITB's are very hard to tune. The throttle response is amazing. Almost like an On/Off switch at times. The runner length is supposed to determine the Power band. Longer runners= More Peak Power/Shorter Runners=more midrange. The car I ustalled and used them on was a build Type R, with 12.3.1 CR. They where 52mm TWM's.They wanted More compression. They made approx 5 peak hp, and 3-5 midrange. But the Throttle responce was amazing..... IF I were you and I was goin to get ITB's I would at least Get some some big cams/ Valvtrain, a real good header,and A thinner HG. Maybe even get the head ported. (I have not really researched porting on the F2xc motors, so this may not do anything) Good luck!

 

as stated.. yes they are touchy.. and responce it like no other!!!
the mid range gained is second to none..

but on a stock F motor i would honestly stroke the motor or up the comp then go ITB's down the road to get the most out of your $

 

With all that has been said, I plan to get the ITB's first to get the hang of them before I plan to build the motor. Im not sure If im going to stroke the motor (Inline pro 2.5 or TODA 2.4).

As for head work, no one has really played with the f22 head yet. I hear mixed reviews about TODAS products, but I keep hearing how good Alaniz and Portflow's work are.

I figure if I get the ITB's up and running come summer, then I can save money this summer to buy a beater so that next winter I can take the motor out and build it.

 

On another not, lets talk about the longevity of the motor with the ITBs.

Will ITB's diminsih the life of a motor since more elements from the air can enter the intake system?

 

I don't see anything different between the heads except the cams.

Longevity depends on tuning, craftsmanship, and design parameters. If you plan on a 12k beast, forget about it.

 

for now 9k might be in the parameters. With no head work I cant rev the f22 to anything higher. And if something breaks im SOL. I need to be conservative. Mainly this is a learning experience.

Even if I went FI, that would also be a learning experience.

 

I would only think running unfiltered/untuned would reduce engine life. My concern would be filtering them and/or building an airbox for them. The thing is even a motor with low compression in 1 cylinder can run for quite a LONG time. I honestly don't think you'll keep it long enough for that to be a factor.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Francesco &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">for now 9k might be in the parameters. With no head work I cant rev the f22 to anything higher. And if something breaks im SOL. I need to be conservative. Mainly this is a learning experience.

Even if I went FI, that would also be a learning experience.</TD></TR></TABLE>

well like some people said... you need a really modified engine to get the benefit form your ITB so conservative and ITB wont go together. If you really want to use them get a good air filter box, a guy I know received a rock right into his ITB... and did a big mess into one of his cylinder on his RSX.

 

The F22 has basically the same ports & valve sizes but different cam profiles. Don't go with alaniz trust me on this. TODA valvetrain components aren't where I'd put my money.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by kane.s2k &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">. TODA valvetrain components aren't where I'd put my money.</TD></TR></TABLE>

why do you say this?

I ran toda b's in my itr , and never had any problems....

i cant imagine the quality is any less for the s2k, so what are you stating?

or are you just refering to springs and retainers?

 

I'm not sure about the valvetrain, but I can't say I've read any good info on toda cams for the F20/22. Back on topic.

 

Everyone has thier own experiences/opinions. I have seen plenty of good things from Alaniz technologies. I have heard a few bad stories, but I have only witnessed good things. I have seen real bad things with Toda products, and I have seen people swear by them..... It is all preference. Unfortunatly as you know not too many internals are made for the F-series......But I definetly give you props for tryin this out.... Just expect this to end in a built motor!!!!!!!!!!

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by cmdr430 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

why do you say this?

I ran toda b's in my itr , and never had any problems....

i cant imagine the quality is any less for the s2k, so what are you stating?

or are you just refering to springs and retainers?</TD></TR></TABLE>

I was talking to YA about TODA valve train, and pretty much he said they had to machine certain components, I believe the rocker arms, because they were hitting certain areas.

Also, a guy from s2ki in my Del Val community had TODA cams in his s2000 and they failed, breaking his motor. TODA is a great company, but I honestly havn't heard good reviews for their products relating to the s2000.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by kane.s2k &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The F22 has basically the same ports & valve sizes but different cam profiles. Don't go with alaniz trust me on this. TODA valvetrain components aren't where I'd put my money.</TD></TR></TABLE>

What would you recamend Kane?

 

Supertech, and put redline at exactly 8800.

 

dood francesco.... im all for this one! itbs are the shiz, i dont care what people say... so what if it is just a bling factor, its baller as hell!

 

F20 still ownz...
THERE I SAID IT!
j/k

sounds beauitful thats for sure

 

just an fyi for anyone who doesn't know fuji racing makes a ITB kit for the s2k as well. they are 47mm http://www.fuji-racing.com/fujiracing_008.htm

 

yea....47mm runners...

I sell the Supertech valvetrain and that's the same that alaniz uses and also portflow. Brian Crower also released some stuff and the seat pressure is slightly higher than the supertech dual's that I sell but have an acceptable max lift for aftermarket cams. Toda just hasn't impressed me at all. The two cars with Toda cams I've had on made no gains since they were so close to factory specs and the casting was so soft they galled.

*edited for advertising* I will be running the stage 2 myself and ditching my Alaniz head. I don't know if that means anything to you but I definately think that those cams will yield me more positive gains than my ported and polished head. Just FYI also, I have one of the best flowing heads that Alaniz has worked on next to sideway's. I think for an N/A car the stage 3 would be just ***** out wild and give extremely high gains in comparison to most mods.

*edited link for advertising* final warning

 

in the butt discussion? jk.

nice to see someone going this route. you know that inline pro's going for their 2.7ltr stroker kit soon right you should check that out beforehand. they too are going for a all out NA motor. and btw, how much power are you looking for?