Okay I had posted a while back about the car all of the sudden losing 5th gear while on the freeway. All other gears work fine/great. I was given the car for VERY cheap because of this.

You all came to the conclusion that the tranny ran low on oil, or the wrong oil was used and 5th gear burned up since its the first to go with no oil.


Just got the car out and going to start driving it again. Hasnt moved since I posted last.

What is involved in replacing that fifth gear? Something a shade tree mechanic can do? Ive messed with trucks/cars quite a bit, but never imports.

Any idea on approx. cost in having a shop do it vs. doing it myself?

How long would this take if I did it myself, assuming everything went according to plan?

Thanks all!!!!!

 

you can replace the gears with the trans in the car, pull the end cap off after draining the trans, both gears need to be replaced. I'm pretty sure that one shaft nut is left hand thread [the one on the right as you face the trans tail] Then when going back together return the shaft nuts to their original position. Fish around in the drain hole area with a magnet for loose metal chips.
I'm guessing the cost for the gears at around $175.
Change out the trans fluid a couple times in the next few hundred miles of driving to help flush out any metal chips.

 

what should the nuts be torqued too?

Does anything else need to be removed? I mean is it REALLY as easy as removing two nuts, sliding off two gears and replacing????


Is there any special gasket on the trans pan or just use some gray RTV?

are the gears pressed on?


What are the names of the two gears I need to replace? (just so I sound educated when calling to order them.

I assume these would be a dealer only item?

Also, before you get to the trans/pan/gears, does anything else need to be removed? Is the trans pan easiest accessed from the side or underneath or? On the right side with the tire off I assume?

Thanks!!

 

if you have not worked on honda tranny before. get yourself a helms before proceeding. It is not a novice task. also, if you are not using a lift, this may not be the most fun.... especially leaving the tranny in and trying to do the work.

 

I have not worked on a honda tranny before. And I'll be using jackstands and a floor jack. No lift in my driveway unfortunately

I checked and a gearset would be $84 for both gears.

How long would something like this take to do for the average person (mechanically inclined, but no lift, etc)

 

depends on how quick you follow helms...

 

Okay so when it I started it today there was a 'rattling' noise coming from soemwhere. So i added oil to the tranny as it was very low.

Jacked up the car and put it on jackstands and had a listed. It sounds like its coming from right inside that side cover where the 5th gears are located.

It only makes the noise in nuetral, once you push in the clutch, it goes away.

Any ideas?

I was tempted to pull off the side cover and have a look, its real easy to get to and only a few 10mm bolts.

A Helms I'll have to order as no one carries them around here that I know of. Not sure if a Haynes or Chilton would be worth a crap.

Would the helms have the 5th gear replacement detailed?

It sounded pretty straight forward from the earlier post, but now its sounding more involved. I've taken things apart, replaced manual and auto trannies, engines, etc all with a floor jack and some jack stands. I've just never messed with front wheel drive stuff.

 

Take the trans mount loose to let it drop down a little and it's real easy to get to. End cover, a couple nuts, might need a screwdriver to pry the gears off. (maybe not) Then put the new ones on. Dont forget to fix your oil leak so it doesn't happen again.

 

Here's a couple pics of one I did not long ago:

 

damn those gears are shot!

 

Hey that inner CV boot is slinging grease too, needs to be reclamped. LMAO I'm on the upsell trail.
Great pics BTW this should help the guy alot.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by hondadude &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Hey that inner CV boot is slinging grease too, needs to be reclamped. LMAO I'm on the upsell trail.
Great pics BTW this should help the guy alot.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Actually the guy declined the axle seal we reccomended about 3 months before. That was the result when he came back.

 

Okay, got it apart tonight. Drained the oil, pulled the side cover and a little piece of wire was laying in the pan and fell out when I dropped the pan down. It looks like it was at one time some kind of retainer ring. Its pretty mangled now though. I am wondering if that was what the noise was, that ring bouncing around off the gears.
The nut on left side shaft was loose. I could pull the gear in and out about 1/8" maybe a little more. Once I bent the tab back, I just had to barely use any pressure to spin it loose, basically it was hand tight. The one on the right side shaft was a little tighter, but not much.
Bearing behing the left side gear (as you are looking at it) looked to be fine. No up and down play in the shafts.
From what I can tell, the gears themselves look good
I have pics on my computer but I am not sure how to post them up.


Here are the pics:
The wire (retaining?) ring that fell out when I pulled the pan:
http://community.webshots.com/...zJwYA#

Before I removed anything:
http://community.webshots.com/...gfTKi

left side gear:
http://community.webshots.com/...wSqwR

right side gear:
http://community.webshots.com/...HiGue

Better view of left side gear:
http://community.webshots.com/...Kpqoc


So now that those gears look good, got any other ideas? Would the loose shaft nuts (which allowed the left side gear to spin freely) and that wire ring being off and mangled have anything to do with no having a fifth gear?

I was all ready to replace the gears and be done with it, but now I am not sure what to do since the gears look good.


Modified by Mychal71 at 11:08 PM 8/8/2006


Modified by Mychal71 at 11:10 PM 8/8/2006

 

Could the wire be the syncro spring? How do the syncro teeth look?

 

which teeth are the syncro teeth? Also to get the (as you are facing it) the right side gear off, there is a 'fork' holding everything on. Do you take out the bolt on the bottom of the housing to allow that 'fork' to slide out and remove the components on the right shaft?

Here is something else I just realized. When I pulled the side cover and felt the gears, the left side (what are the proper terms for these gears, I'm sure its not left side and right side) gear was kind of wobbling on the shaft. I remember being able to spin it freely.
So as I was thinking about this, this morning I went out and put the gear back on. Sure enough, it spins free. I am not sure if this is correct or not, but here is my thought. The inside surface of that gear is supposed to have teeth on it, to mesh with the main shaft. The nut became loose somehow (maybe due to that wire/ring/spring coming off?) and allowed that gear to become slightly loose and where the teeth right off of the inside of that gear which would allow it to slip on the shaft, which would make the tranny appear to be 'slipping' or not engaging in fifth.

The teeth on the shaft look fine as I am sure that main shaft is made from a much stronger hardened alloy that the gear would be.

So let me know if my theory is correct and what I need to do next. I assume I need that left gear and that spring or ring that i found in the pan.

Then I need to know exactly where that spring/ring goes and in what order.

Or maybe I am just thinking way to much and this isnt even close to what is going on....

Fun stuff


Modified by Mychal71 at 8:57 AM 8/9/2006


Modified by Mychal71 at 8:59 AM 8/9/2006

 

HOLLY CRAP!!!! same issue happened to me monday and i have been surfing the net since to find out what was going on. Great info and im going to hit it tonight. I was shocked when i called around and got quotes of around $800 to fix it. I hope its that simple.

 

It actually is THAT simple. Jack up the car, pull off the right side tire, undo a few bolts that hold the plastic apron on, drain the tranny (3/8" drive ratchet fits right in the drain plug) pull off the 10mm bolts that hold the side cover on and there ya go! Everything is right there as you see in the pic above.

Gear sets are about $85-$110 depending on where you call.

Good luck!

Now if I could just get one of these guys back online to help me figure out what my issue is, I could get mine going again. I guess not everyone has the day off today

 

Heres the best I could come up with tonite [honda ISIS is having a brainfart] hope we can all get on the same page

You'll need to better describe the 'ring' you found floating around... Does it look like the bearing retainer grip ring, or is it more round and like a wire?
And yes you'll need to unbolt the Fork Then pull off 5th gear 'cluster' note carefully how it all comes apart. Then look at the parts breakdown and try to see whats missing, from the picture I'm guessing the synchro spring.

 

Check out my link for the pics in my above post for the ring I am talking about

i just got back from the trans. shop. Got me some gears and the synchro ring. He said my gears got HOT when he saw them! The inside of the left gear was stripped, no splines. He said that is VERY uncommon and he hadnt seen that before. He also said its very rare to have that synchro ring brake and come off.

I am thinking that when somehow the nuts came loose, thats when all of this started.

I dunno, but I have two new gears and a new synchro ring to go install before it gets dark

I'll report back when I git 'er done !!

Oh and thanks for the diagram, that will help!
Oh and the fork isnt held on with a bolt, its held on with a roll pin.

 

Damn I need to know what to torqe the nuts too! I cant find the paper that I wrote it down on when hondadude told me the other day.

Theses nuts were LOOSE when I pulled the pan, so puting them back where they were wont be such a good idea.
Thanks!

EDIT: nevermind, I checked my instant message history and found it! 65 ftlbs.

How do you keep the gears, etc from turning while you tighten the nuts up?

Is it okay to reuse the existing nuts or should I replace them like the diagram says.



Modified by Mychal71 at 6:31 PM 8/9/2006

 

[IMG][/IMG]The inside of the left gear and the shaft itself on my car are both warn down. Can i replace the shaft myself or is that something i should let a pro do? Cant figure out how to get pictures in here. Whats the trick?[IMG][/IMG]

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by pb_beaker &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">[IMG][/IMG] Cant figure out how to get pictures in here. Whats the trick?[IMG][/IMG]</TD></TR></TABLE>

put the link to the site where the pictures are hosted in the thread. Then highlight it and click the image button. Then you are set.

 

can i just do it from my computer files or do i have to put them on the web some where else? Like the pictures above.

 

Got it all buttoned up and filled with oil. Started it up and no more noises!!!!

Going to slap the tires back on (did brakes while it was up on the jack stands, rotors were JUNK), and take it for a spin.

I'll report back in a bit

 

Like a new one?