So, I'm burning chips. I have the Willem burner with AT29C256 chips.

I'm using Crome and loading the default P28 maps and have modified the options to fit my needs. But I'm wondering what I should set fuel values to. Should I leave them or increase or decrease the fuel (looking to get close to a base JDM P13 map).

Crome has this neat little multiplier calculator which takes into consideration old and new injector sizing, fuel pressure, and engine capacities and returns a value that I'm guessing should be used to change the fuel settings to.

So, using the following figures, Crome is telling me that I need to reduce fuel (I should use .94 as my adjusted multiplier):
240 -> 345
45 -> 45
1596 -> 2157

Does this sound right? Are the figures above correct? P28 was for Civic EX, right? Does the Civic EX have 240 injectors and it's engine size 1595? Want to make sure I'm doing apples to apples and not trying to compare apples to oranges...

I've ran it with a stock P28 map and it runs OK but the VTEC crossover was definately to high. Dropping that down to 4700 feels about right though the engine tone in VTEC sounds a bit different than the P13/VAFC setup I used before.

So, anyone have any ideas on what to change the fuel settings too?

 

right now ur comparing apples to meatloafs.

the fuel and timing maps are way off from what an h22 needs to run properly.

i woudl slap on a wideband and tailor the fuel that way.

 

wish i knew how to mess with that stuff...i would do it all the time...

 

what you do is go find a p13 base http://www.pgmfi.org look in the wiki get the timing maps low and high and bring them over to a p30 map then get a wideband and tune your whole fuel maps

 

heh, its not hard to learn either man, go read up on http://www.pgmfi.org will seem intimidating at first but jsut do alot of reading on there and it will all make sense.

 

Unfortunately I don't have time or money right now but I do intend on doing it later.

As a report though, decreasing all fuel by 6% has yielded some nice results. Pulls all the way up to 7700 when going w/ the tuned P13/vafc combo would fall on its face above 6500.

One thing that was weird that I had Crome set the rev limit to 8000 but it's kicking in at 7700...oh well. Don't think I'd want to rev higher than that anyway!

 

Also, I've checked to disable the ELD but it's still there when I jumper the MIL wires. :?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Daily Interlude &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Unfortunately I don't have time or money right now but I do intend on doing it later.

As a report though, decreasing all fuel by 6% has yielded some nice results. Pulls all the way up to 7700 when going w/ the tuned P13/vafc combo would fall on its face above 6500.

One thing that was weird that I had Crome set the rev limit to 8000 but it's kicking in at 7700...oh well. Don't think I'd want to rev higher than that anyway!</TD></TR></TABLE>

hoenstly i wouldnt rely on *** dynoing, itmight feel good, but u could be running her very lean for all you konw. i dont wanna see you blow up ur motor or anything, so if u can avoid it, try using somethign else while u save up for a wideband.

 

I'd run the stock JDM P13 bin but it gives a CEL because it's looking for EGR when the P28 doesn't support it and I can't check to disable it in Crome...

 

u cant run a p13 bin in a p28 at all, its not gonna work,

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Eddiebx &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">u cant run a p13 bin in a p28 at all, its not gonna work, </TD></TR></TABLE>But you'd think you could change what makes it not work (EGR, knock sensor, etc)...

 

umm all u do is copy the p13 timing values and paste them to a p30 map then there you have p13 timing values on a usuable p30 rom

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Daily Interlude &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">But you'd think you could change what makes it not work (EGR, knock sensor, etc)... </TD></TR></TABLE>

hehe i only wish it was that simple. the p13 is far mroe complex than the p28s and what not. the fuel map is determined by applying some formulas to values u see in the map and then it comes up with the final pulse width, unlike on the p28s where what you see is waht u get sorta.

 

please invest in a wideband, *** tuning is dangerous.

or atleast check your plugs after each run. Take it to redline, then shut the motor off. pull over and check the plugs.

 

add +30 fuel, up up down down left right left right a, b, select , start

 

Go to pgmfi.org and read, read, read. Then ask questions if you need to. Last time I was there, several H22 basemaps were available for download. FYI, P28, P30 and P72 are all the same in terms of code they run. P13 and others have a different CPU and are quite a bit different.

 

As I said, all the P13 maps have EGR and knock sensor which won't work on a P28 and I couldn't disable these in Crome...it sets the CEL steady on.

I may try to load them in Uberdata and see if it lets me unselect them...

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Daily Interlude &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">As I said, all the P13 maps have EGR and knock sensor which won't work on a P28 and I couldn't disable these in Crome...it sets the CEL steady on.

I may try to load them in Uberdata and see if it lets me unselect them...</TD></TR></TABLE>

your not reading this correctly, you can disable the egr and knock all you want on a p13 bin, its not going to function at all in a p28 ecu. period.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Daily Interlude &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">As I said, all the P13 maps have EGR and knock sensor which won't work on a P28 and I couldn't disable these in Crome...it sets the CEL steady on.

I may try to load them in Uberdata and see if it lets me unselect them...</TD></TR></TABLE>

correct me if im wrong but you can disable knocka nd egr in crome ..

to tell you the truth the crome fuel calc that you orignally talked about in the very first post would probably be righton. going from 240 to 345 is a 30% increase in injector size and 1596 to 2156 is 29% increase in displacment.. so the fueling would be very close , so a multiplier of .94 prob would be right on

BUT just use a god damn p13 map, and read up at pgmfi.org

 

No reason to be like that...

As I have said over and over, the maps I have that are p13 will not let you uncheck the EGR or Knock in Crome. I'll have to take a screen shot of what it looks like because the options screen for the P13 doesn't look anything like the options screen for the P28. The P13 looks almost DOS based while the P28 looks like a Windows program form...and only one of the check boxes are even changable...

But I found some H22 tuned maps and will burn and test with them...

Are BIN files supposed to be loadable by any tuning program? Some that I load in Uberdata and some in Crome can't be right...the numbers are all crazy on some of them (maybe these BINs are corrupt).

 

I think what Eddiebx is saying is that it doesn't matter whether egr and knock are enabled or disabled because the p28 doesn't matter at all...so just use the p13 map, it's not going to matter.

 

Are you using Crome Pro Jason? Honestly this is not a good place to ask these questions. You should post in PGMFI Crome forum. You might get better help from there. Just wonder why do you use P28 stock map? There are P30, P72 there. Do you run with IAB? P28 and P30 map doesn't have IAB feature enable. I use P72 stock map in Crome and I tune from there with a wide band.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Daily Interlude &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">No reason to be like that...

As I have said over and over, the maps I have that are p13 will not let you uncheck the EGR or Knock in Crome. I'll have to take a screen shot of what it looks like because the options screen for the P13 doesn't look anything like the options screen for the P28. The P13 looks almost DOS based while the P28 looks like a Windows program form...and only one of the check boxes are even changable...

But I found some H22 tuned maps and will burn and test with them...

Are BIN files supposed to be loadable by any tuning program? Some that I load in Uberdata and some in Crome can't be right...the numbers are all crazy on some of them (maybe these BINs are corrupt).</TD></TR></TABLE>

the p13 support using crome is limited and those EGR check boxes and what not dont fucntion properly as far as i konw, unless john rewrote the prog a bit.

what i am trying to tell you is, that the rom dump off a p13 ecu chip, is not useable in a p28 ecu. it's like trying to stick a mac program into a pc and try to make it work, sure it fits in the CD drive the same way, but it wont run (shhhh dont tell me u can use a mac or pc emulator program )

what you need to do is find a p30 based H22 BIN and work from there if you are using crome. and if you want to use uberdata u need a p72 based bin to start off with.

 

^^^That makes more sense, Eddie....thanks for clarifying that up.

My IABs are not hooked up like stock...they are connected directly to the IM via a vacume line so no biggie there. Between that and the EGR ECU light I get, I wanted a P28.

But anyway, I did find an Uberdata H22 basemap and modded it to give me the FTL and shift light (got both working!). If anyone wants, I can post a link if they want a copy or just to look at it...in fact, here it currently is:

P13 Map On P28 ECU (full throttle launch at ~4K and ShiftLight at ~7400)
Rev limit is set to 8100 but I hit it at ~7800 according to my VAFC...