http://www.team-integra.net/fo...02288

the link above is to a blown b18c5 engine, the guy said that it was caused by a stretched rod bolt. He had upped the revlimiter to 9000rpm. I was under the impression that the motor would be good to 9k?!?

Also this looks like it was caused by valve float, ie. piston slaps valve, he said he had just put in new cam package. I'm thinking that maybe something was installed wrong when the valvetrain was worked on.

So my question is, Can a stock ITR head and block be revved to 9k rpm without worries. If not what needs to be upgraded?

Granted i know that titanium retainers should be used and maybe upgraded dual valvesprings and arp rob bolts are always added security. I'm am more curious as to what the oem itr parts are rated to? Safley?

 

i would like to know too

 

made a couple of 9000+ down shifts... Car still runs.

For the love of god, ban me already!

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Bbasso &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">made a couple of 9000+ down shifts... Car still runs.

For the love of god, ban me already!</TD></TR></TABLE>

Poof, your banned...

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Bbasso &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">made a couple of 9000+ down shifts... Car still runs.

For the love of god, ban me already!</TD></TR></TABLE>
nice to know!

Thought they already banned you once !

Anyone have an actual rating though.

 

I think it depends on how its getting revved to 9k that is the problem.....A fresh and healthy stock motor should be able to handle it.....but of course not repetitively.....the car does not even make power past 8000 without cams so it would be pointless to shift pass 8500 unless you are modded and making power that high up top....very few people that ask this kind of question even make power up there.....they just want to say

"Yo....I rev my ish to 9K....Yo! I dont make power up there but my ish sounds like a F1 car in da Tunnel Yo!"

So as far as being in gear and throttling to 9K a healthy motor should be able to handle it on occasion.....of course the higher you rev the more wear and tear.....the higher you rev the faster that piston is moving and everything with it.....things are more likely to overheat/break/fail.....especially if you are low on oil, or coolant, or both.....

So basically I'm saying not to be a dumb *** and think you are cool to rev the **** out of the motor on the street. Especially if you treat the motor like the ugly step child and dont maintain it. If you maintain it well and it's fresh....by all means if you feel the need to rag on the car....its your money not mine.

Now.......if it is during a downshift.....that is a different story...if it is a rev matched down shift bringing the needle to 9K then well I would say that can also create problems....but I've never done that myself so I wouldn't really know.....All I know is that people that mis-shift usually don't have time to react and step on the clutch and thats when revs go past 9K and people either bend valves or pop pistons

 

Well it's always best to shift after the power is starting to drop off a little bit....so on a completely stock ITR that would be around 8200-8400 in that area to get the most out of it.....Coincidentally that is where Honda set the stock redline.....Honda is not dumb....they know what they are doing with these cars

 

If it helps I will post one of my dyno charts and show you exactly where power is dropping off and when to shift...although my car is not stock....but even my car with a few mods does not warrant shifting past 8400.....the car still does not make power that high

 

As you can see on my previous tune the motors power was leveling off starting at around 8K.....then it kind of tapers off......the hump at the end is due to the clutch being pressed in and does not mean my car was about to make more power past that.....so just look at where the power just starts to fall off

 

well i an not saying that i want to rev my pretty much stock itr to 9k, if you click ont he link in the op and look at the pics of the motor i was asking if the parts should have failed at 9k rpm.

Click and look at the pics its serious head damage!

I know it is pointless to rev to 9 if you dont have cams to make power that high thats not why i asked the question.

Thanks for the replies though.

i am also very **** about maintence on my engine, i cant even stress how mcuh i baby it!

Also i have experienced what an overrev on a downshift can do to an engine i destroyed a mint 00 gsr motor becasue of a transmission problem (bent shift fork to be exact). Went from 5th to 2nd instead of 5th to 4th. Bent 14 valves and did a nasty number on the sleeves. Mainstream Performance in Atl, Ga did the rebuild on it, cost out the ***!!! When i looked a the needle it was burried way past where the tach numbers stop and the guy at mainstream said from his calculatiaons it probablly revved somewhere around 14k!!!

So i'm not saying i'm gonna rev my mad jdm typr R with VTAk to 9k i just want to know what the oem parts are capable of handling.

 

Well let's hypothetically say that everything is in good working order....no compression leaks....no oil leaks....perfect maintenance on a strong healthy motor.....then yes it should be able to handle it.

The fact happens to be though that no matter how much we baby the motor....it will never be flaw proof and in the event that something does fail...it will more than likely be in that upper range

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by jdmspoonitr &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Well let's hypothetically say that everything is in good working order....no compression leaks....no oil leaks....perfect maintenance on a strong healthy motor.....then yes it should be able to handle it.

The fact happens to be though that no matter how much we baby the motor....it will never be flaw proof and in the event that something does fail...it will more than likely be in that upper range</TD></TR></TABLE>

Well i have no oil leaks, no comp variances 240 on all 4, an overall good healthy motor.

I realize that it wont be flaw proof its a mechanical device they are never perfect! My main question that i still dont think you are getting is are the stock parts rated to be able to handle 9k rpm or not?

 

Well to answer your direct question....I don't think Honda will ever "rate" the parts to go to 9k rpm just because of liability issues. Even if the parts may well be able to handle it. Keep in mind they always leave a little room for play....meaning that if they rate our motors to be handle 8400....more than likely it can go to 9k rpm but at that point you are on your own.

Honda doesn't want to rate it at 9K and then people go and do that every day and blow it up.

 

ok let me rephrase it one more time, are the parts structurally sound enough to be able to withstand 9k rpm if power is made that high. Are the springs stiff enought to hold the valves shut and are the retainers strong enough to hold the springs. Also what is the block balanced to factory. What are the rods and rod bolts able to take?

 

I would say yes....but dont quote me on that....After seeing Len rev a ITR motor to 11000 rpm with the AC on I think I can say that Honda meant for these parts to take a lot of abuse.

 

haha...thats crazy 11k, was this the toda one?!? may be thinking of someone else.

Any input on what the block is balanced to from the factory?

 

someone post that video because I find that **** hilarious......

 

theres a vid? Yeah lets get a link or something i wanna see this!

 

Yah a video of Len laFFinG his *** off because the AC is on and they are waiting for it to blow up

 

its time for my dyno graph
still making power at 9 k where we set the rev limit.




Modified by ITR 1102 at 8:14 PM 6/22/2006

 

I would like to inform everybody that the motor posted in that thread belonged to me and I don't remember giving the OP of that thread permission to post those pictures. It wasn't rod bolt failure that caused the demise of my old motor as it was something else. It was a bad combination of parts that shouldn't have been, never go with the biggest this or the stiffest that. Just go with what works and is reliable.

Now i am onto a bigger motor with a better setup. however the thought of blowing up my previous 2 motors in my mind still linger and i'm scared to rag on the new motor cause I fear it going down on me because of my past luck with this car

 

itralex: I told the op of that thread several times that that wasnt caused by a rod bolt. Sorry about your car i've been in that position before so i know how it feels. Did you ever actually determine what caused the failure?

I feel you on being leary to beat on it, this is also my third motor so i'm tryin to baby this one!

itr1102: Your car doesnt make it all the way to 9k and at the end the curve drops off, unless there was another contributing factor it doesnt look to me lke you were making power that high.

I see peak hp was 215 so i'm assuming the engine wasnt stock. A mod list would be nice. Also were stock valvetrain components used?

 

I have an N-1 ecu and the rev limit is high as hell i have hit 10k a few times with a rather high pucker factor... the power plant is still together and runs well.. Lucky.. more than likely but it did it and lived to tell. It was still making great power up there as well so...

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Rene M &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I have an N-1 ecu and the rev limit is high as hell i have hit 10k a few times with a rather high pucker factor... the power plant is still together and runs well.. Lucky.. more than likely but it did it and lived to tell. It was still making great power up there as well so... </TD></TR></TABLE>

A stock engine making power at 10k?!? I'd love to see the dyno charts, i know for a fact that the itr cams dont make power at 10k.

You are a lucky person 10k and it didnt sling apart ! Any compression or leakdown test results for your motor? Just wondering if there were and detremental effects on the engine after revving it like that.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by mr_gs-r &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">itr1102: Your car doesnt make it all the way to 9k and at the end the curve drops off, unless there was another contributing factor it doesnt look to me lke you were making power that high.

I see peak hp was 215 so i'm assuming the engine wasnt stock. A mod list would be nice. Also were stock valvetrain components used? </TD></TR></TABLE>

I am most definately making power that high.
My other dyno printouts show it going all the way to 9k where the redline is set.
I have stock valvetrain components and completely stock internals on the bottom end as well.... I just have a few bolt ons - stock exhaust manifold and cat, apex-i world sport catback, AEM CAI, Hondata IM gasket, and Hondata s200.


ok, and a JRSC at 7psi