Checklist before welding up SS304 Turbo Manifold
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From: Davie, Florida, USA
Checklist before welding up SS304 for the EXPERTS ONLY! :-)
Before I ruin a perfectly good set of stainless Weld-El's, I wanted to ask the forum experts.
I am going to experiment on some of the material first before attempting a manifold. I think I have everything I need but heres a checklist;
SS304 Weld-El Schedule 40 (.133" thick)
Acetone to wipe them clean prior to welding
2% thoriated and pointed tungsten, What size should I use here?
I am using a 3-phase Tig, water cooled torch, I am thinking 50-70 AMP setting? I have a foot pedal.
I want to use this "solar B flux" but I am unsure of the results in a exaust manifold. Will it work? Or should I just backpurge. I would prefer to use the flux, though.
I have different filler rods to choose from, I read that the 308L would be correct, but I dont know. What filler would you recommend? This is my main question.
Using 100% argon, I am going to turn it up to about 15CFH, 10CFH (recommended) wasnt working out on MildSteel. I dont have a gas-lense, I will get one, though.
what am I forgetting? I want to weld these for the most part, Flat. but that means no backpurge (I guess)
Forgive me, but I've only been welding aluminum to death for the last few weeks, never tried SS. The method I am thinking on using is first a stringer root pass, then a weave cap pass, laying down the filler over the top and weaving over it. This I am told will give it the excellent strength characteristic, but it wont be as pretty as a pure stringer (dab move dab move) pass.
Modified by Kingtal0n at 1:31 PM 3/30/2006
I am going to experiment on some of the material first before attempting a manifold. I think I have everything I need but heres a checklist;
SS304 Weld-El Schedule 40 (.133" thick)
Acetone to wipe them clean prior to welding
2% thoriated and pointed tungsten, What size should I use here?
I am using a 3-phase Tig, water cooled torch, I am thinking 50-70 AMP setting? I have a foot pedal.
I want to use this "solar B flux" but I am unsure of the results in a exaust manifold. Will it work? Or should I just backpurge. I would prefer to use the flux, though.
I have different filler rods to choose from, I read that the 308L would be correct, but I dont know. What filler would you recommend? This is my main question.
Using 100% argon, I am going to turn it up to about 15CFH, 10CFH (recommended) wasnt working out on MildSteel. I dont have a gas-lense, I will get one, though.
what am I forgetting? I want to weld these for the most part, Flat. but that means no backpurge (I guess)
Forgive me, but I've only been welding aluminum to death for the last few weeks, never tried SS. The method I am thinking on using is first a stringer root pass, then a weave cap pass, laying down the filler over the top and weaving over it. This I am told will give it the excellent strength characteristic, but it wont be as pretty as a pure stringer (dab move dab move) pass.
Modified by Kingtal0n at 1:31 PM 3/30/2006
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From: Davie, Florida, USA
Re: Checklist before welding up SS304 for the EXPERTS ONLY! :-) (Kingtal0n)
Well since I dont have any follow-ups, Ill make one:
I made a pass on it without the flux, very light, trying to get a root stringer between the pieces.
It came out good but didnt discolour the way I was hopeing, maybe just need more heat. was hopeing someone would chime in with their "experience"
I made a pass on it without the flux, very light, trying to get a root stringer between the pieces.
It came out good but didnt discolour the way I was hopeing, maybe just need more heat. was hopeing someone would chime in with their "experience"
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Re: Checklist before welding up SS304 for the EXPERTS ONLY! :-) (Kingtal0n)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Kingtal0n »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
SS304 Weld-El Schedule 40 (.133" thick)
/i]</TD></TR></TABLE>
If they are 1.5" s/40 the wall thickness is actually .145". This may not matter to you but just figured I'd throw it out there.
SS304 Weld-El Schedule 40 (.133" thick)
/i]</TD></TR></TABLE>
If they are 1.5" s/40 the wall thickness is actually .145". This may not matter to you but just figured I'd throw it out there.
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Re: Checklist before welding up SS304 for the EXPERTS ONLY! :-) (RC000E)
mcmaster.com
They seem to carry nearly everything.
First site I found that had them, Im sure there is a better place to get them from, though.
They shipped it out like 5 minutes after I ordered it too, amazing.
Im getting a gas lense tomorrow, I just picked up some rubbing alchohol to mix with the Solar B flux, I couldnt find the time today to do anymore welding though (yet) We will see what happens.
They seem to carry nearly everything.
First site I found that had them, Im sure there is a better place to get them from, though.
They shipped it out like 5 minutes after I ordered it too, amazing.
Im getting a gas lense tomorrow, I just picked up some rubbing alchohol to mix with the Solar B flux, I couldnt find the time today to do anymore welding though (yet) We will see what happens.
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Re: Checklist before welding up SS304 for the EXPERTS ONLY! :-) (RC000E)
Well they are 1" Sch40 pipes, so Mcmaster listed them as .133",
I didnt know that the Sch40 designation was varied in thickness based on pipe diameter. Then again, I didnt even know what Sch40 was an
actual word or what it meant about 7 days ago.
And since im adding useless (technically) length to this thread with jibber jobber,
who knows where I can buy a already made SS304 flange (T25, T3, T4, whatever) For my project,
And who knows where I can either get a Flange for the head cut, or buy an already made
flange for the head? the stuff I will be making will be on either RB26(and25)DETT, SR20DET, or KA24DE(T) Designation motors.
I didnt know that the Sch40 designation was varied in thickness based on pipe diameter. Then again, I didnt even know what Sch40 was an
actual word or what it meant about 7 days ago.
And since im adding useless (technically) length to this thread with jibber jobber,
who knows where I can buy a already made SS304 flange (T25, T3, T4, whatever) For my project,
And who knows where I can either get a Flange for the head cut, or buy an already made
flange for the head? the stuff I will be making will be on either RB26(and25)DETT, SR20DET, or KA24DE(T) Designation motors.
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Re: welds
Ok here are the welds that I made late last night. It was 4AM, i was tired as hell, but I wanted to get the pics up today. Didnt come out very good,
I had something set wrong, Im sure. I got a lot of perosity, an indication of low gas shield but it was turned up to 16CFH.
I also had a hard time getting a root pass on it, I couldnt get the tungsten low enough in the bevel to get the arc to stay between the two, and I couldnt use the constant feed method on the filler or cap pass it would just melt the filler away too quickly.
Keep in mind I've never welded stainless before, in my life.
I have some 347L Filler thats thicker, wondering about using that instead.
Root pass:
Fill & cap pass:
I had something set wrong, Im sure. I got a lot of perosity, an indication of low gas shield but it was turned up to 16CFH.
I also had a hard time getting a root pass on it, I couldnt get the tungsten low enough in the bevel to get the arc to stay between the two, and I couldnt use the constant feed method on the filler or cap pass it would just melt the filler away too quickly.
Keep in mind I've never welded stainless before, in my life.
I have some 347L Filler thats thicker, wondering about using that instead.
Root pass:
Fill & cap pass:
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Re: (TurBros)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by TurBros »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Contaminated....</TD></TR></TABLE>
.... as expletive!
If you don't have a lens yet make sure to get one. They always help out a lot. Try turning your gas up to about 25 and if you are not using a lens stuff the tungsten as far into the cup as you can while still being able to see enough to weld.
edit: forgot one part. Since you can't keep the arc between the two pieces for a root pass you probably have some contamination on the base metal itself that is making the arc wander. I doubt it's enough to make the weld that porous so it's only part of your problem.
.... as expletive!
If you don't have a lens yet make sure to get one. They always help out a lot. Try turning your gas up to about 25 and if you are not using a lens stuff the tungsten as far into the cup as you can while still being able to see enough to weld.
edit: forgot one part. Since you can't keep the arc between the two pieces for a root pass you probably have some contamination on the base metal itself that is making the arc wander. I doubt it's enough to make the weld that porous so it's only part of your problem.
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Re: Checklist before welding up SS304 for the EXPERTS ONLY! :-) (Kingtal0n)
I didnt dissapear guys, Im just waiting for the local welding shop to get a few supplies in before I waste any more of these expensive weld-els.
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cut one apart about 1/2" from where your HAZ ends and try again.
turn your heat down, and your gas down as well, make sure you are welding in an area where there is no wind. 16cfm seems a little high to me, you could be bringing more oxygen into the weld zone with more argon, just be aware of that. also if your heat is too high you will bring porosity from the back side of the weld, so unless you are backpurging your ****, leave the heat down as low as possible. if you have problems getting the tungsten into the area sharpen it more and extend it slightly from the gas cup. should help you get a cleaner weld.
keep cutting those pipe joints apart and welding them back together, it's all about practice, you're not going to use those anyways so you might as well get practice out of them.
maybe try some 309L filler rod too instead of 345 since it flows a lot nicer.
turn your heat down, and your gas down as well, make sure you are welding in an area where there is no wind. 16cfm seems a little high to me, you could be bringing more oxygen into the weld zone with more argon, just be aware of that. also if your heat is too high you will bring porosity from the back side of the weld, so unless you are backpurging your ****, leave the heat down as low as possible. if you have problems getting the tungsten into the area sharpen it more and extend it slightly from the gas cup. should help you get a cleaner weld.
keep cutting those pipe joints apart and welding them back together, it's all about practice, you're not going to use those anyways so you might as well get practice out of them.
maybe try some 309L filler rod too instead of 345 since it flows a lot nicer.
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From: Lincoln, Ne, USA
Re: (cua0)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by cua0 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">cut one apart about 1/2" from where your HAZ ends and try again.
turn your heat down, and your gas down as well, make sure you are welding in an area where there is no wind. 16cfm seems a little high to me, you could be bringing more oxygen into the weld zone with more argon, just be aware of that. also if your heat is too high you will bring porosity from the back side of the weld, so unless you are backpurging your ****, leave the heat down as low as possible. if you have problems getting the tungsten into the area sharpen it more and extend it slightly from the gas cup. should help you get a cleaner weld.
keep cutting those pipe joints apart and welding them back together, it's all about practice, you're not going to use those anyways so you might as well get practice out of them.
maybe try some 309L filler rod too instead of 345 since it flows a lot nicer. </TD></TR></TABLE>
16cfm is very high! 16cfh however, should be fine. I use 308L rod on those weldels and it works fine. 309L for welding the pipes to a mild steel flange.
turn your heat down, and your gas down as well, make sure you are welding in an area where there is no wind. 16cfm seems a little high to me, you could be bringing more oxygen into the weld zone with more argon, just be aware of that. also if your heat is too high you will bring porosity from the back side of the weld, so unless you are backpurging your ****, leave the heat down as low as possible. if you have problems getting the tungsten into the area sharpen it more and extend it slightly from the gas cup. should help you get a cleaner weld.
keep cutting those pipe joints apart and welding them back together, it's all about practice, you're not going to use those anyways so you might as well get practice out of them.
maybe try some 309L filler rod too instead of 345 since it flows a lot nicer. </TD></TR></TABLE>
16cfm is very high! 16cfh however, should be fine. I use 308L rod on those weldels and it works fine. 309L for welding the pipes to a mild steel flange.
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Re: (k24em2)
So if I use a 3/32 2% thoriatedtungsten
what size gas cup should I use
should I still get a gas lense
and only run 16CFH? Man I was up to over 22CFH just to keep the crap out of it. Something may be wrong, somewhere. say, A/C balance doesnt do @(*@ for DC welding right? just curious.
ah, another question. I notice if I let the material cool off without the argon on the red-area for at least 12 seconds it turns black. If the argon stays on the area it will remain pretty and colorfull.
Problem is, as you move along with your welding, you uncover the previous area that you welded and they cool without the argon (and turn nasty black) and right where I end my welding seam and post-flow over it I have a shiny spot. What gives?
what size gas cup should I use
should I still get a gas lense
and only run 16CFH? Man I was up to over 22CFH just to keep the crap out of it. Something may be wrong, somewhere. say, A/C balance doesnt do @(*@ for DC welding right? just curious.
ah, another question. I notice if I let the material cool off without the argon on the red-area for at least 12 seconds it turns black. If the argon stays on the area it will remain pretty and colorfull.
Problem is, as you move along with your welding, you uncover the previous area that you welded and they cool without the argon (and turn nasty black) and right where I end my welding seam and post-flow over it I have a shiny spot. What gives?
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Re: (cua0)
A new question:
How come stainless Steel Weld-Els are cheaper than plain Steel?
Part#: 45605K514 (http://www.mcmaster.com/) $8.53 = 304L Stainless 1 1/4" Weld-el
Part#: 43425K141 $9.36 = Plain Steel Weld-El, Same size.
What gives?
How come stainless Steel Weld-Els are cheaper than plain Steel?
Part#: 45605K514 (http://www.mcmaster.com/) $8.53 = 304L Stainless 1 1/4" Weld-el
Part#: 43425K141 $9.36 = Plain Steel Weld-El, Same size.
What gives?
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Re: (Kingtal0n)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Kingtal0n »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">A new question:
How come stainless Steel Weld-Els are cheaper than plain Steel?
Part#: 45605K514 (http://www.mcmaster.com/) $8.53 = 304L Stainless 1 1/4" Weld-el
Part#: 43425K141 $9.36 = Plain Steel Weld-El, Same size.
What gives?</TD></TR></TABLE>
Stainless is made in China.
Plain Steel is made in USA.
How come stainless Steel Weld-Els are cheaper than plain Steel?
Part#: 45605K514 (http://www.mcmaster.com/) $8.53 = 304L Stainless 1 1/4" Weld-el
Part#: 43425K141 $9.36 = Plain Steel Weld-El, Same size.
What gives?</TD></TR></TABLE>
Stainless is made in China.
Plain Steel is made in USA.
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From: Santa Ana, California 92704
Re: (k24em2)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by k24em2 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Stainless is made in China.
Plain Steel is made in USA.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Our import steel fittings are also more than our import stainless steel fittings. It's been that way for a year or more now.
Country of origin does not always play a role in cost.
Plain Steel is made in USA.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Our import steel fittings are also more than our import stainless steel fittings. It's been that way for a year or more now.
Country of origin does not always play a role in cost.