I have a GS-R tranny and am thinking of getting a Type-R or putting a Type-R LSD in. Anyone have any input, pros and cons of it. I know it causes the car to spin at a higher rpm on the freeway then the GS-R but by how much? and how much could I realistically take off from my 1/4 mile times? Or just put the LSD in the stock tranny..... Anyone know the cost of it? Thanks.

 

I was thinking the same thing about 20 minutes ago on the ride home man....

 

Input: ITR is by far a HUGE improvement over the GSR tranny because it has the LSD.

Pros: Good acceleration, excellent acceleration through turns.
Cons: Dont need LSD (really) for good 1/4 times. $$ and hard to find and trust used.

Suggestion: Spend your money elsewhere or get a 99-00 Civic Si tranny. Identical gearing less the LSD.

Revs: ITR tranny = beginning of 5th after redline (7000rpm) is about 96mph

Realistic Times: 0.2-0.4

Cost: JDM ITR/CTR 4.758 w/ LSD ~ $1620 shipped


[Modified by Crazy Bovine, 2:38 AM 3/29/2002]

 

I wouldnt reallly state that the honda LSD is the reason people are getting an ITR tranny...it is due to the shorter gearing which you already know about. The LSD that comes w/ the ITR tranny is ok but nothing to lose sleep over. For highway cruising you can retain your gsr 5th gear.

 

Cool... Thanks for the input.

 

What about a Sir2 tranny with LSD?

I'm sure they are going for way less than the type R tranny.

I'd never run a USDM B16 tranny from a 99-00 Si. I've heard too much bad stuff about them.

 

It is true that the 99-00 Si tranny is the SAME as the 97+ ITR tranny sans the Helical LSD. Below are a listing of all the Tegs and their respective gearing and tranny setups:

RS, LS, GS, SE/ RS, LS, GS, SE / GS-R Type R
(4-Speed Auto) (5-Speed Manual) (5-Speed Manual)
1st 2.722 3.230 3.230 3.230
2nd 1.468 1.900 1.900 2.105
3rd 0.975 1.269 1.360 1.458
4th 0.638 0.966 1.034 1.107
5th ------- 0.714 0.787 0.848
FD 4.357 4.266 4.400 4.400
R 1.954 3.000 3.000 3.000

Combine the ITR's closer ration gears AND the LSD and you get a tool for carving up the twisties. The USDM GSR and ITR have the Same FD 4.40.

It a straight line battle the jury is still out on the benefits outweighing the negatives for NA cars. With a FI, or SC car the closer gearing may be a consideration, BUT the addition of a higher Final Drive ratio which is a current trend amongst ITR owners would be a Bad idea... An LSD is good for turns And straights especially in launching situations.

I run a 4.929 FD in my ITR tranny and do Not feel any serious limitations or inconveniences as compared to the stock setup. RPM and gearing are just fine and the Power is amazing. Daily is good and with around town it is alot more fun. When in the twisties and at events the higher FD shines and lets you do things only dreamt of with stock ITR gearing. Plus it is Fast as Hell.

LSD helps you in a straight line AND the turns:

The Red car labeled ATS is the example of how a FF car reacts and is able to follow a more pure line into, through and out of a corner. The blue car ia a normal FF car without an LSD.

When dragging you can have more spin than wanted and even lose time it the power is not distributed evenly hence the single strip of rubber.

IMHO if you want the gearing, then the Si gears is a good idea. You will Not lose daily use or ability with just those gears.

For a serious setup the ITR/SiR gearing, higher FD"4.785 or 4.929", and LSD are a good bet.

Good luck,


Where we are now as import performace enthusiests doing different gear sets and FD's the Domestic guys have been doing this stuff for years.

A.


[Modified by 1GreyTeg, 7:27 PM 3/29/2002]

 

the only really big issue is that at 65mph, you'll be in the 4000rpm range, not too sure where but around there..which sucks for highway use..

 

No, you're wrong.

If you don't know for sure then please don't answer. Misinformation like this spreads and continues common misconceptions.

With ITR/Si/SiR tranny in 5th gear at 4K RPM you will be at 72.7MPH.

With the same tranny at 3580K RPM you will be at 65.1MPH perfectly acceptable for driving.

This does NOT suck for highway use. It is the stock gear ratios for the ITR and I'm sure if you spoke to many ITR owners, they will attest to the ratio being just fine or even a little tall.

I personally run an ATS 4.929 FD and cruise the freeway at between 4,250 RPM at 70 MPH or 4,500 RPM at 75 MPH, of course my redline is higher but, the GSR can still benefit from a closer ratio gearing AND an LSD!

A.

 

What would you guys think of a type-r tranny VS a GSR tranny for a turbocharged application... low boost now, high boost later? Is the shorter gearing going to be a good thing for the 1/4"? How much difference will the stock type-r LSD make for a drag application?

 

any thoughts?

 

i love my gearing , its just right,
highway rpsm only become an issue when gign real fast, 80 mph is about 4250 rpms or so .
on the highway its nice though becuase if someoens fuckign with you no need to really downshift, cuz your right ready to get in the pwoerband .

 

i plan on a n/a setup with a honda lsd in my gsr tranny. already have the lsd, waiting till i cna buy a light chromoly flywheel and then i'm gonna throw both in at the same time. anyone have any idea how much aamoco would charge to do this work with the tranny still on the car? as far as a turbo or super charger setup with an lsd i think i would stick with gsr tranny becasue that turbo will spool right throught e itr gears and leave you lacking in the top end power area.


[Modified by au-gsr, 9:32 AM 12/19/2002]

 

i would love to prove you wrong , where are you located ?
For the vtec motors the trannys are shorter gearing for a reason , to stay in vtec between gears. now if the gears are too long your gonna lose Boost between shifts where as the tighter gearing you wont.
i think R , Si and GSR gearing is more thna fine for the boost. they are all similar somewhat gearing .
but if you find someone with an LS with the same amount of power i will be pushing next week when its boosted, , , , we'll see who puls on who and put it to an end there.
or get someone in your area with these cars to try it and see what happens.
I haev a good idea, but i want to see it proven

 

i have no problem staying in the range of the secondaries with a stock gsr tranny in fact it never drops below 5800 if i go to 7800, all i'm syaing is that the gsr has a tller gear and if i were building a car with a turbo or n/a setup , i wouldn't want it to be jsut a staright line puller, i would like it to be a top speed monster. and if you have a taller final drive gear like what is i nthe gsr or ls tranny you will be able to go faster . hope that makes sense. but remebe this board isna'tabout proving people wrong. if you feel you have a different opinion state it don't try to start a mtch up between one opinion and another take it for a grain of salt and maybe thinkof it as an alternative way of thinking that, evidently, you hadn't thought bout yet.

 

im sorry i didnt mean it like that , i just want to see some results, becuase everyone has their opinions , but i want to see an outcome .
i didnt mean to diss, dont take it that way .

the final drive in the R's and the GSr are pertty damn close though . and the Si i think at least from what i noticed from where the tach sits at what speeds.

 

top speed really isn't much of a concern for me... 1/4" time is. I don't have enough power to reach my top speed through the traps, so that isn't the limiting factor. I think that it would take massive amounts of power to redline in 5th through the traps....

I'm building a streetable drag monster... what would you guys recommend I do? ITR or GSR with LSD (eventually)? Which ITR would be better... the '98 or otherwise?

 

I've been in an ITR hatch putting around 280fwhp. The tranny helps. Taller gears = slower car, NA, turbo, SC, whatever.

 

we even had an ls in one of our CRX's and went from the ls tranny to an si tranny on the LS and even on that almost stock set up with the Si tranny felt alot better and the guy liked it alot . his girl cracked the tranny thoguh and we had to put an ls tranny back in cuz we didnt have any more Si. and its not the same .

 

But who drives at 65 mph? In CA, only big rigs travel that slow. Here, it is mostly 80mph if there is no traffic and that means 4000 rpm in a GSR which can be very irritating.

 

How much does this FD effect your top speed? Though for drag and twisties it would be awesome, but doesn't it have an adverse effect on your top speed?

And what (if there is) the difference between the USDM ITR Tranny and the JDM ITR Tranny?


[Modified by Jiz101, 12:39 PM 12/19/2002]

 

well i am gonna start with what i have already and then maybe do the final gear IF, BIG IF, necessary.

 

so, a JDM ITR final drive setup would be good for drag?

 

LISTEN TO THIS PEOPLE

I see people with 1,2, & 3k posts that are talking out of their *****

dont say something unless you can back it up with factual data or experience

to the original poster:
what are you trying to accomplish?
what is your budget?

since your gsr tranny is in good shape, find an ITR lsd (400-500) plust jdm fd (400) or ats fd (725)
and itr tranny can be had for 1200 with a 4.4fd. it is 1400 for itr tranny with 4.785

so far your choices are:
gsr tranny
-itr lsd
-ats fd
-labor to put it in (400)
$1500

but, if you get an r tranny with 4.4fd
-tranny
-ats fd
-labor
$2200
MINUS selling your gsr tranny ~500-800
looking in the $1500 range

In my gsr, I personaly went with selling my gsr tranny and got the best setup I could afford
itr tranny (4.4fd)
added ats fd
comptech 6lb flywheel w/ exedy clutch

then sold my tired gsr tranny (140kmiles) @ 400 bux

the itr setup costed a little more, but I like the setup alot.


and even with lots of commuting and driving around, I dont mind the high rpms on the freeway. I would just make sure you get a quiet exhaust setup. my comptech exhaust was way too much

 

depends upon your whp.
at the end of the quarter mile you want to be at the exactly the end of the last gear

so if you are hitting 90mph traps.
you want to be in 3rd gear, which in a gsr tranny will be at 8100-8300 rpm
if you are hitting 100mph traps, then you might want the ats fd in an r tranny. because at the end of 4th I end at around 105-109 mph

if i was using a stock gsr or itr tranny that it would be slower, only because I had to stay in 4th, even though it does not end till 115-121 mph in either tranmissions.

just need to calculate your speed, and maximzie the use of changing and optimizing your gears