Is there Anyone that could tell me what/how much to machine off the girdle OR main caps? I don't want to mess up a critical part of the motor. Thanx a whole lot.

 

You have two options:

1. Machine the #3 main cap to the same height as the others (recommended).

2. Machine the GS-R aluminum girdle to accept the taller #3 main cap of the LS.

I just machine the #3 main cap of the LS or CR-V.

If you look at the GS-R #2, #3, #4 maincaps and girdle assembly that is how Honda designed it.

Good luck.

-kenji

 

Kenji:

Thanx that was really informative. I know that I can just take a file to the arrows onthe 2 side caps. 2 mm sounds about right for the height on them. I was really needing to know the amount that need to be taken off of the center cap or the middle "foot" on the girdle. Now i'm good to go as soon as my parts get here.


Here is what i've searched and found

About the best way to do it is by milling the center "foot" down 14mm on the GS-R girdle and then filing away the casting arrows on the 2 side main caps. Will provide a proper fit without having to align bore the block:

~~~ I'm going to use the pics from your site, HX-Guy, to show my point. Let me know if this bothers you Val, and i'll edit the post. ~~


Look at the center "foot" here, you can see that it has been milled down to sit correctly.


Here you can see the casted "arrow" on the main cap that need to be filled down. Although HX_Guy had the girdle milled down 2mm in the center section to accomidate the casting mark(s)

Hope this is as informative to everyone else as it is to me. Thanx for the wonderful pics HX_Guy

~Steven


[Modified by Speed PHreak, 8:48 PM 3/27/2002]

 

i know kenji summed it up but if you wanna see pretty pics of how it's done check out del's how-to.. http://www.diyracing.com/B20girdlemod.html

 

Anyone know a cheap way to mill down the center cap? The shop I took it to said 2 hours, @ $55/hour. Any other process (laser?) that I should suggest to strictly machine shops as opposed to the engine shop that I took it to?

Thanks
Ben

 

damn 2 hrs it took my shop 30mins and he was taking his time and b.s.ing

 

On the DIY site (http://www.diyracing.com/B20girdlemod.html) it says that milling the girdle make it weaker. I guess this is true, but by milling the girdle as opposed to the cap you are replacing weaker aluminum (girdle) with stronger steel (from the cap). It seems like you'd actually end up with a stronger girdle/cap assembly by milling the girdle to accomodate the big (strong) center cap. And milling aluminum is much cheaper!

Thanks
Ben


[Modified by Bnjmn, 12:11 AM 4/2/2002]

 

ttt...someone else confirm my thinking please.

Ben

 

Heh. I second your thinking Bnjmn. I'm prolly gonna have have girdle milled down. Since i've found out the exact amount it needs to be taken down there won't be any need for me to remove the caps. Just drop out the LS components(oil pan, windage tray pickup), bolt-up the girdle and the rest of the GS-R components. My Girdle ought to be here some time this week.

 

Is the GSR oil pan really needed? I thought the parts list was GSR oil pickup, windage tray, girdle, and main bolts.

Thanks
Ben

 

Yup. Here are the parts you need to do the conversion. All have the stock Acura part # beside them in case you have the hook-up at a dealership. Or just give Mike K a call. He's the man. I got all my stuff for 300 bones brand friggin new....shipped

GS-R Block Stiffener -- 11950-P73-J00
GS-R Main Bolt(6) -- 90007-PAA-T01
GS-R Oil Pickup -- 15220-P72-000
GS-R Windage Tray -- 11221-P72-000
GS-R Oil Pan -- 11200-P72-010

You can re-use your LS oil pan gasket.

Also...it's has been brought to my attention that new rod bearings and ARP rod bolts may be in order. This would be best to insure that you don't "spin" a bearing and the the rods are as rigid as possible.

Due to my turbo setup I have lower than normal oil pressure so....I may have to worry about that in the higher RPMs. A good solution would be to get a B20 oil pump. But for now I may just give it a shim to bump the oil pressure back up.

Suggestions would be good on these issues.

 

** Update **
I got my all my GS-R girdle conversion parts in yesterday(thurs). Off to the machine shop the gridle went this morning. Machining it down to the required depth only cost $20 bux at a local shop. Guy did some great work and gave me props on my Rex, even tho V8 d00d.

Now i've got to tap that brand new GS-R oil pan for an oil return bung for my turbo. Then i'll be ready to install this junk. To bad my cams aren't here yet.

 

This has all been very helpful info since I'm in the finishing stage of building my b20vtec, and the thought of a gsr gridle has been on my mind to add to the build since I have spare internals for a gsr block that was hydro locked so the casing and #1 cyl are toast. Anyways I have a few questions to clear things up for me. How much do I need to machine off the gsr girdle and where on the girdle? Or will I be able to tell when I assemble my crank into place and bolt in my main caps? As far as main bolts with the girdle I'm to use the gsr 6 main/girdle bolts right? Thanks for the insite.

 

Even though it's more expensive, it'd rather machine the mains. Removing material from the girdle won't help its rigidity any, however machining the mains shouldn't affect the mains strength. When I had mine finished, It looked almost exactly like stock and since honda uses a shorter main, I don't think it would hurt our application either. HTH

 

$100+ for machining the caps vs. $20 for machining the girdle. When you machine the girdle you are replacing the relatively weak girdle "foot" with much stronger steel. While the girdle is getting a little weaker by machining off the foot, the girdle/main unit is at least as strong, if not stronger.

Ben

 

great info

 

how come everybody uses the gsr girdle?

do the del sol vtec b16a2 engines have the girdles? would it be the same to sue it from the b16a2 if they did have it? (newbie question, i just hear everyone using gsr girdle)

 

The b16 has a much better rod/stroke ratio,side wall loading, & piston speed so it doesn't need the block girdle. However, if you got money burning a hole in your pocket go for it.

edit: grammer


[Modified by bruthaboost, 10:36 PM 7/16/2002]

 

You may be a newbie, but good use of the SEARCH, it's good to see a thread come back from the dead. I have a good how-to on the girdle swap for an LS on my website.


I IM'd you AzN_Flava. The GS-R/ITR/CTR all use gridles. The LS/B20 and B16 blocks lack a gridle. LS/B20 have no real need for one in stock from, but you start adding power(turbo) or swapping heads(ls/V) and a girdle makes the bottom-end a little more happy when you're revving the **** out of it.

Bruthaboost is right, no real need for a girdle on the B16, but the B16B has one(since it's a destroked ITR) so I guess it serves some point. I *think* BOOSTED HYBRID runs a girdle on his B16A, but then again his B16 puts out a good bit of power.


[Modified by Speed PHreak, 2:17 PM 7/17/2002]

 

Heve's a pic of the girdle with the #3 main milled down. Looks just like stock.

http://photos.yahoo.com/jjeffm

It's pic number 25 and 26

 

Nice, not the same way I did it though.


[Modified by Speed PHreak, 4:42 PM 7/17/2002]

 

I researched this long ago, I have some things to add.

Ben, this a sound idea but your not really replacing the weak cast AL with stronger steel. In "engineering land" it just doesn't work like that. Plus you are altering a cast AL part (which isn't very "strong" in the first place) by machining it. You will be weakening this part, I don't care what opinions others will speak....you will weaken it.

Steven, the girdle is just along for the ride (without adding much rigidity) if it is not dowled to the #2, 3, 4 main caps. Machineing is required for that and you should have the crank bore checked and align honed. Addition of a girdle in this manner changed the clamping design, things will change.


[Modified by SLPR, 10:38 AM 7/17/2002]


[Modified by SLPR, 10:41 AM 7/17/2002]