Type R versus Type S
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Re: Type R versus Type S (.no tork.)
and just a little heads up, the 02-03 S are different than the 04-05 S.
the 04-05 have a bit more *****. i believe they have the jdm gear ratio in there.
can't remember.
when i ran on the track, i beat an 02-03 S stock, but couldn't beat the 04-05 S stock.
both were really close races though however.
the 04-05 have a bit more *****. i believe they have the jdm gear ratio in there.
can't remember.
when i ran on the track, i beat an 02-03 S stock, but couldn't beat the 04-05 S stock.
both were really close races though however.
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From: Siege Perilous
Re: Type R versus Type S (Amused)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Amused »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Did a search but no avail.
Had this discussion earlier today on whether or not a stock Type S will out perform my stock ITR.
Anyone ?</TD></TR></TABLE>
Assuming both cars are stock, a 2001 Type R vs a 2002 Type S, and assuming both cars are driven by the same person, who is a good driver on the typical 2.5 mile road course, and driving at 10/10ths, then the Type R will be the car he prefers.
Anything you do to alter than scenario will change the outcome, and there are many, many Type S drivers at track events who will pass ITR drivers.
The 2005 and 2006 Type S will perform better on the track because of the altered computer programming (which gives more HP and a wider torque band) and the introduction of the ITR/CTR axle ratio. The typical driver might very well end up preferring a 2006 Type S to a 2001 ITR.
Now...
If you're talking about all-out race cars driven in endurance races by aggressive drivers, then they're not going to like the Type S as much as they like their old ITR. The fully developed DC5 suspension will be very nice, but it will not allow the mind-boggling stability and predictability of the fully developed DC2 N1 suspensions. The only reasons the DC2 was retired from endurance racing were (1)it was beginning to be too old to continue to meet homologation and (2)the long history of successes in various series introduced many rules changes that made it harder to the ITR to compete effectively.
Had this discussion earlier today on whether or not a stock Type S will out perform my stock ITR.
Anyone ?</TD></TR></TABLE>
Assuming both cars are stock, a 2001 Type R vs a 2002 Type S, and assuming both cars are driven by the same person, who is a good driver on the typical 2.5 mile road course, and driving at 10/10ths, then the Type R will be the car he prefers.
Anything you do to alter than scenario will change the outcome, and there are many, many Type S drivers at track events who will pass ITR drivers.
The 2005 and 2006 Type S will perform better on the track because of the altered computer programming (which gives more HP and a wider torque band) and the introduction of the ITR/CTR axle ratio. The typical driver might very well end up preferring a 2006 Type S to a 2001 ITR.
Now...
If you're talking about all-out race cars driven in endurance races by aggressive drivers, then they're not going to like the Type S as much as they like their old ITR. The fully developed DC5 suspension will be very nice, but it will not allow the mind-boggling stability and predictability of the fully developed DC2 N1 suspensions. The only reasons the DC2 was retired from endurance racing were (1)it was beginning to be too old to continue to meet homologation and (2)the long history of successes in various series introduced many rules changes that made it harder to the ITR to compete effectively.
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From: chillin at yo mammy house, FL, usa
Re: Type R versus Type S (George Knighton)
i don't mean to speak off topic, but you really have 152k posts ... that f...king unreal ,
i would be inclined to listen to this guy /\/\/\/\ !!!!!
i would be inclined to listen to this guy /\/\/\/\ !!!!!
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From: Yokohama, Japan
Re: Type R versus Type S (hype r 555)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by hype r 555 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i have driven both pretty hard from a street standpoint and i wouldn't trade my r for an s ... love the handling in the r too much !</TD></TR></TABLE>
You haven't driven hard at all, if you've only driven on the street.
Take your ITR on a track and discover what driving hard is. 
You haven't driven hard at all, if you've only driven on the street.
Take your ITR on a track and discover what driving hard is.
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From: chillin at yo mammy house, FL, usa
Re: Type R versus Type S (Reid)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Reid »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">You haven't driven hard at all, if you've only driven on the street.
Take your ITR on a track and discover what driving hard is. </TD></TR></TABLE>
you would have to live where i live to see that some of the lonly roads around here are pretty close ! but i agree with ya i can only imagine what an open track would be like in my car ....
Take your ITR on a track and discover what driving hard is.
</TD></TR></TABLE>you would have to live where i live to see that some of the lonly roads around here are pretty close ! but i agree with ya i can only imagine what an open track would be like in my car ....
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Re: Type R versus Type S (Amused)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Amused »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Straight up, If it ain't an R, it ain't a car</TD></TR></TABLE>
Damn, what have I been driving all these years?
Damn, what have I been driving all these years?
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From: Los Angeles, CA, USA
Re: Type R versus Type S (hype r 555)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by hype r 555 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i don't mean to speak off topic, but you really have 152k posts ... that f...king unreal ,
i would be inclined to listen to this guy /\/\/\/\ !!!!! </TD></TR></TABLE>
that's why he's the "grandpa"
i would be inclined to listen to this guy /\/\/\/\ !!!!!
</TD></TR></TABLE>that's why he's the "grandpa"
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From: blavica
Re: Type R versus Type S (hype r 555)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by hype r 555 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i don't mean to speak off topic, but you really have 152k posts ... that f...king unreal ,
i would be inclined to listen to this guy /\/\/\/\ !!!!! </TD></TR></TABLE>
He's a mod, I'd hope he'd have more post than most of us.
A do agree though, the 04+ S's are a litte more to contend with than the 02's. IIRC there was an introduction of LSD's to the S's as well. That combined with the new gears makes the car a little more fun.
Me though, I'd still prefer my R.
i would be inclined to listen to this guy /\/\/\/\ !!!!!
</TD></TR></TABLE>He's a mod, I'd hope he'd have more post than most of us.
A do agree though, the 04+ S's are a litte more to contend with than the 02's. IIRC there was an introduction of LSD's to the S's as well. That combined with the new gears makes the car a little more fun.
Me though, I'd still prefer my R.
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From: Siege Perilous
Re: Type R versus Type S (Dave_B)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Dave_B »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
IIRC there was an introduction of LSD's to the S's as well.</TD></TR></TABLE>
The influx of K20A* drivetrains into the USDM might make you think that there is an LSD but there is not. The K20A* drivetrains that were installed in the DC5 ITR will all have LSD, but no USDM model DC5 has an LSD as it comes or came to the showroom.
Putting an EP3 CTR or DC5 ITR LSD into a USDM DC5 is a relatively inexpensive thing to do, however, and that would certainly make the car much more attractive as a track vehicle.
IIRC there was an introduction of LSD's to the S's as well.</TD></TR></TABLE>
The influx of K20A* drivetrains into the USDM might make you think that there is an LSD but there is not. The K20A* drivetrains that were installed in the DC5 ITR will all have LSD, but no USDM model DC5 has an LSD as it comes or came to the showroom.
Putting an EP3 CTR or DC5 ITR LSD into a USDM DC5 is a relatively inexpensive thing to do, however, and that would certainly make the car much more attractive as a track vehicle.
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From: Siege Perilous
Re: Type R versus Type S (hype r 555)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by hype r 555 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i would be inclined to listen to this guy /\/\/\/\ !!!!! </TD></TR></TABLE>
Be careful assuming that the number of posts means that somebody knows what he's talking about.
</TD></TR></TABLE>Be careful assuming that the number of posts means that somebody knows what he's talking about.
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From: Siege Perilous
Re: (Dave_B)
The only USDM Acuras I'm aware of that include an LSD are the TL six speed and the RL SH AWD.
To some extent, in regular daily road use, the VSA in the TSX and other Acuras is a substitute for an LSD, controlling traction in full throttle acceleration and in unusual cornering manoeuvres. It's no substitute for an LSD on a road course, though.
I don't see a mention of VSA in the online marketing material for the RSX, however.
To some extent, in regular daily road use, the VSA in the TSX and other Acuras is a substitute for an LSD, controlling traction in full throttle acceleration and in unusual cornering manoeuvres. It's no substitute for an LSD on a road course, though.
I don't see a mention of VSA in the online marketing material for the RSX, however.
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From: Somewhere in the vacinity of, Betelguese
Re: (George Knighton)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by George Knighton »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The only USDM Acuras I'm aware of that include an LSD are the TL six speed and the RL SH AWD.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Don't ferget the CL-S six speed, Gramps
Don't ferget the CL-S six speed, Gramps
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From: Siege Perilous
Re: (Ford Prefect)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Ford Prefect »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Don't ferget the CL-S six speed, Gramps</TD></TR></TABLE>
I meant to be perceived as speaking in the present tense. Sorry.
Out of curiosity, did the CL-S six-six also include VSA?
I'm interested in getting personal testimony about how LSD and VSA work together in the same package.
I met somebody at Summit Point who was driving a TL six-six and he left the VSA on all the time, saying he did not feel it was interfering. This would indicate to me that the LSD is more aggressive than the VSA in that particular car.
If that's true, then there might be several VSA systems in use, because the VSA in my Accord six-six activates rather aggressively on full throttle acceleration. I guess this could be more a function of the horrible hard compound all weather Michelins, though.
Don't ferget the CL-S six speed, Gramps
</TD></TR></TABLE>I meant to be perceived as speaking in the present tense. Sorry.
Out of curiosity, did the CL-S six-six also include VSA?
I'm interested in getting personal testimony about how LSD and VSA work together in the same package.
I met somebody at Summit Point who was driving a TL six-six and he left the VSA on all the time, saying he did not feel it was interfering. This would indicate to me that the LSD is more aggressive than the VSA in that particular car.
If that's true, then there might be several VSA systems in use, because the VSA in my Accord six-six activates rather aggressively on full throttle acceleration. I guess this could be more a function of the horrible hard compound all weather Michelins, though.
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From: Tampa, FL
Re: Type R versus Type S (hype r 555)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by hype r 555 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
you would have to live where i live to see that some of the lonly roads around here are pretty close ! but i agree with ya i can only imagine what an open track would be like in my car .... </TD></TR></TABLE>
I live and have driven all over florida, and have never found a road that would compare in any way to a racetrack.
Luckily, there are plenty of events in FL so you can actually take your car to the track.
you would have to live where i live to see that some of the lonly roads around here are pretty close ! but i agree with ya i can only imagine what an open track would be like in my car ....
</TD></TR></TABLE>I live and have driven all over florida, and have never found a road that would compare in any way to a racetrack.
Luckily, there are plenty of events in FL so you can actually take your car to the track.
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From: asdf, asdf, asdf
Re: Type R versus Type S (Amused)
Type S CAN NOTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT OUT PERFORM a Type R(in stock form or with equal mods).
I dont know wtf most people in their type S's are thinking. I think they just go online and read storys on clubrsx and think their cars are better then they actually are.
I have gotten alot of **** from stupid Type S owners and its fun proving them wrong. But to answer your question, Type R is better in EVERYWAY (except theft rates) Then a type S.
Oh yaa, and this is about a 2006 Type S
I dont know wtf most people in their type S's are thinking. I think they just go online and read storys on clubrsx and think their cars are better then they actually are.
I have gotten alot of **** from stupid Type S owners and its fun proving them wrong. But to answer your question, Type R is better in EVERYWAY (except theft rates) Then a type S.
Oh yaa, and this is about a 2006 Type S
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From: Chicagoland, usa
Re: Type R versus Type S (George Knighton)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by George Knighton »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Be careful assuming that the number of posts means that somebody knows what he's talking about.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Aw, I wanted to say that! Glad I read through the thread
For tunability (parts/cost/engine management etc..., I'd prefer the R. (this is just personal preference)
Aw, I wanted to say that! Glad I read through the thread
For tunability (parts/cost/engine management etc..., I'd prefer the R. (this is just personal preference)
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From: Somewhere in the vacinity of, Betelguese
Re: (George Knighton)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by George Knighton »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Out of curiosity, did the CL-S six-six also include VSA?
I'm interested in getting personal testimony about how LSD and VSA work together in the same package.
I met somebody at Summit Point who was driving a TL six-six and he left the VSA on all the time, saying he did not feel it was interfering. This would indicate to me that the LSD is more aggressive than the VSA in that particular car.
If that's true, then there might be several VSA systems in use, because the VSA in my Accord six-six activates rather aggressively on full throttle acceleration. I guess this could be more a function of the horrible hard compound all weather Michelins, though.</TD></TR></TABLE>
The 6 speed and the VSA are mutually exclusive on the 2001-2003 CL-S/TL-S, AFAIK. I don't know about the newer TL.
I'm interested in getting personal testimony about how LSD and VSA work together in the same package.
I met somebody at Summit Point who was driving a TL six-six and he left the VSA on all the time, saying he did not feel it was interfering. This would indicate to me that the LSD is more aggressive than the VSA in that particular car.
If that's true, then there might be several VSA systems in use, because the VSA in my Accord six-six activates rather aggressively on full throttle acceleration. I guess this could be more a function of the horrible hard compound all weather Michelins, though.</TD></TR></TABLE>
The 6 speed and the VSA are mutually exclusive on the 2001-2003 CL-S/TL-S, AFAIK. I don't know about the newer TL.
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From: Warning, gRand Return imminent,, NY, USA
Re: (George Knighton)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by George Knighton »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
If that's true, then there might be several VSA systems in use, because the VSA in my Accord six-six activates rather aggressively on full throttle acceleration. I guess this could be more a function of the horrible hard compound all weather Michelins, though.</TD></TR></TABLE>
I'm experiencing the same in my TSX. Only gotten on it a few times, not even 7/10's. The other day in the rain my tires began to break loose, VSA kicked in and stabilized me. Personally I don't like the feeling, I like being in full control of my cars and working my way out of problems.
I also had the pleasure of breaking in my ABS in the same rain storm with the rock hard card board Michelins that are standard on our cars. Not a pleasant happening.
If that's true, then there might be several VSA systems in use, because the VSA in my Accord six-six activates rather aggressively on full throttle acceleration. I guess this could be more a function of the horrible hard compound all weather Michelins, though.</TD></TR></TABLE>
I'm experiencing the same in my TSX. Only gotten on it a few times, not even 7/10's. The other day in the rain my tires began to break loose, VSA kicked in and stabilized me. Personally I don't like the feeling, I like being in full control of my cars and working my way out of problems.
I also had the pleasure of breaking in my ABS in the same rain storm with the rock hard card board Michelins that are standard on our cars. Not a pleasant happening.