Hi,

Currently I have on my 04 Honda Accord 4cyl are 215/65/15 Michelin HyrdoEdge with a set of Rota Subzero's 15x6.5 due in the mail tomorrow. Unforunately, after looking around the website a bunch, I feel like I should have waited and gotten thinner tires. The current tires are beefy as it is, and the thread design makes it even beefier, and the whole point of getting these tires was improved performance over the incredibly pathetic stock tires that came with the car (many other people agree with me).

If I wanted to make a size change to thinner tires, what should I get? 215/55/? or 215/50/? or a different width of tire such as 225? will this fit?. (question mark is for width of tire that fits accordingly im guessing after some research that its going to be 16 or 17). Keep in mind that I live in Florida so it rains quite often. How long would these tires last?

I researched some more and saw that 15x7 and 15x7.5 would fit on the wheel also.




Modified by msedacca at 6:53 PM 12/25/2005

 

I apologize in advance for the length of this post, but your question really requires a very long explanation. If you don't want to bother reading the whole thing, then just get Yokohama AVS ES100 tires in size 215/60-15 for your Rotas. Put those on your car and you will be amazed at the improved performance you will get.

Now... I think you're getting mixed up by two separate, but related, factors: tire size, and tire choice (make/model).

First of all, do you understand how tire sizes are specified? For example, if a tire is 205/65-15, that means:

- the tread is 205 mm wide
- the sidewalls are .65 times the treadwidth (.65 * 205); 65 is called the "aspect ratio"
- the wheel diameter is 15 inches

Usually, you want to select a tire size whose outer diameter is approximately equal to the original stock tire for your car, within 2 percent and preferably within 1 percent. (If, when you say "thinner" tires, you mean a smaller outer diameter, NO you should NOT get a smaller size, and as you will see below, that is not the cause of the poor performance of your tires anyway.) In your case, your Accord LX came from the factory with 205/65-15 tires, so you want to select tires that have about the same outer diameter as that size. The tire sizes you mention, like 215/55-15 or 215/50-15, have outer diameters that are MUCH too small for your car. You can use a tire calculator like this one to compare outer diameters of different tire sizes.

In selecting a tread width, you also normally want to select a tire size whose tread width is no narrower than, and no more than 20 mm wider than, your original stock size.

Now, the reason your car's performance has been mediocre is NOT the size of your tires. It's that the tires you have been using - both the original factory tires (Michelin Energy MXV4 S8 or Bridgestone Turanza EL41) as well as your replacement tires (Michelin HydroEdge) are all-season tires (and mediocre all-season tires at that). All-season tires are designed to give okay performance on snow and in cold as well as in warmer weather; they sacrifice warm-weather performance to provide that capability. Since you live in Florida, you don't need to accept the compromise of snow/cold performance, so you can get summer tires which will give you MUCH better performance, on dry roads as well as during your frequent rains. (I already told you this in an earlier topic; maybe you didn't bother reading my post there?)

The problem you are also going to run into - and this is where the tire size relates to the tire choice - is that high-performance summer tires are not typically available with aspect ratios as high as 65 or even 60. Good performance tires usually come with aspect ratios in the 35 to 55 range. This is why they are often called "low profile tires".

People who are looking for more performance from a car like yours that came with 65 aspect ratio tires normally do so by buying wheels that are one inch ("plus one") or two inches ("plus two") larger than stock. With the same outer diameter and a larger wheel, that means that the sidewall is shorter, hence the smaller aspect ratio. The shorter sidewall also improves handling by increasing the responsiveness of the tires. So if you're looking for significantly better performance from your car, you really ought to consider getting 16" or 17" wheels to do so, so that you can choose from an assortment of high-performance summer tires. For example, there are lots of good 16" tires in 215/55-16, and lots of good 17" tires in 215/50-17, for your car.

However, if you're really committed to those 15" Rotas instead of getting bigger wheels, I found one (and ONLY one) really good, high-performance summer tire in a size that will fit: the Yokohama AVS ES100 comes in size 215/60-15, for $83 per tire at the Tire Rack. 215/60-15 is 1.3 percent smaller than stock on an Accord LX, so it should work just fine. The ES100 is an excellent tire, and is well-regarded for its performance on dry roads, its wet-pavement performance, its relatively long life, and its relatively low price. (You should also be aware that high-performance summer tires don't last quite as long as all-season tires - maybe 30-50K miles, rather than 40-70K for all-seasons. But that's the trade-off in getting better performance from your tires.)



Modified by nsxtasy at 1:58 PM 12/26/2005

 

Thats a damn good read. Thank you nsxtasy.

Ali

 

Ok, now I have the correct lingo to talk so that you understand me, and the post was extremely beneficial to me.

First, I would like to get a tire with a thinner sidewall, such as an aspect ratio of 50 or 55, even if it meant going to a different diameter of tire. I would not be inadvertent to sending back the new Rota's I just got because I think I acted too quickly and didn't wait around to think about what I was doing. I can return them to the company I purchased them from for relatively the same price. So, what you are saying is that a 215/50/16 would be a good fit for my car with a 16x7 rim?

After doing some research, I saw that the Falken FK-451 GRB looked like a nice tire and they're selling at my local tire dealer for $119 a piece. (In a say 215/50/16 size?) And return the Rota's for a new set at 16x7? Any advice?

Thanks in advance

 

Yes, it took me a little while to figure out what you meant. Usually, when people use the words "wider" or "narrower" (or "thinner"), they're referring to the width of the tread. Words like "taller" or "shorter" usually refer to the height of the sidewall.

So - forgive me for double-checking - what I think you mean is, you would like to get a tire with a lower profile and shorter sidewall, such as an aspect ratio of 50 or 55, even if it meant going to a different diameter of wheel.

Yes, I really think that would be a good idea. You can exchange them for a wheel with a larger diameter, such as 16" or 17". That will enable you to choose from many different tires. And most people like the looks with the bigger wheel and shorter sidewall. (That's why the EX version of your car came with 16" wheels.)

Since you're getting tires with the same outer diameter as your stock tire, the bigger the wheel, the shorter the sidewall. 205/65-15 has a sidewall that is 5.2 inches tall; 215/55-15 is 4.7 inches tall; 215/50-17 is 4.2 inches tall.

No. I'm saying that a 215/55-16 would be a good fit for your car with a 16x7 rim. 215/50 is too small. (215/55-16 has an outer diameter that's 0.7 percent smaller than stock, which is fine. 215/50-16 has an outer diameter that's 4.0 percent smaller than stock, which is too small.)

I think there are better tires on the market at a better price. How much you spend depends on what level of performance you're looking for. The FK-451 is a budget performance summer tire. It's not terrible, but it's not as good as the best tires in that segment of the market. In 215/55-16, you can get the Kumho Ecsta SPT for $72 per tire, and it is better than the Falken FK-451. Other, similar tires that are not bad (not as good as the Kumho, but better than the Falken) are the Avon Tech M500 for $73 per tire, and the BFGoodrich g-Force Sport for $74 per tire. Any of these is a lot less money than the Falken, with slightly better performance. If it were my car, though, I would try to get the Kumho SPT if possible.

If you wanted to get 17x7 rims, then you could get 215/50-17 tires, such as the Yokohama AVS ES100, which is $115 per tire in that size. Larger wheels are more expensive, and the tires for them are more expensive, too. But a lot of people like the looks of a larger wheel. And on an Accord, 17" is not unusually large, if you don't mind spending the extra money. (Otherwise, the 16" is fine too.)

BTW, these tire prices are from the Tire Rack; maybe your local dealer can match their prices. Alternatively, you can order the tires from the Tire Rack and use one of their local installers to install them on your rims; they have installers all over the country, and you can find the nearest one on their website here. Or, check other companies if you like, like Discount Tire, which also sells from their website as well as through their stores.

It's also worth asking the place you're ordering the wheels from if they will sell you the tires along with the wheels. Many places do this, and when they do, they mount the tires onto the wheels and balance them. When you get them, you just need to jack up your car and put them on. This way, the mounting and balancing is free (most shops charge $15-25 per tire for mounting and balancing) although you pay a bit more for shipping due to the added weight.

If you have more questions, please don't be afraid to ask. I'm happy to help.

 

Yes, I think I am definetely going to go with the different setup for a "lower profile" look then I guess I'm going with the 17 inch wheels/tires.

As far as the tire selection, what would work best for the 215/50/17 (I'm not saying that I'm sticking with those specs, I could go to a 225 treadwidth, but I don't think I should go any lower than a 50 aspect ratio, depending on what would fit my car the best. My friend has 215/50/16 on his Acura TSX and they look a little thin, but that is what came stock so I imagine they are fine.

As far as tire pricing, if I could get a tire under 90 bucks with that size, or around it, that would be great, because I only have a limited budget and I'm sacrificing a new exhaust system for different wheels and tires (which I don't mind doing).

I usually get all my wheel/tire work done at Tire Kingdom, with free balancing and installation as well as the Honda Service Center. If you give me the name of the tire that would best fit my car, I'll give them a call and see if I can get it because the Michelin tires on my car aren't very old and I can get some money back on them. <TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by nsxtasy &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
So - forgive me for double-checking - what I think you mean is, you would like to get a tire with a lower profile and shorter sidewall, such as an aspect ratio of 50 or 55, even if it meant going to a different diameter of wheel.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

Yes, whatever specs will work, is great, thanks for the help because I am a novice as far as cars go. Please feel free to message me on AIM or email me.

PS one last question, I don't think I have the right offset on my car, what is the proper offset for a 2004 Accord LX 4cyl 4 door?


Modified by msedacca at 7:04 PM 12/26/2005

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by msedacca &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">As far as the tire selection, what would work best for the 215/50/17
.
.
.
As far as tire pricing, if I could get a tire under 90 bucks with that size, or around it, that would be great, because I only have a limited budget and I'm sacrificing a new exhaust system for different wheels and tires (which I don't mind doing).</TD></TR></TABLE>

Well, tires for 17" wheels are just a lot more expensive. As I mentioned, the Yokohama AVS ES100 is an excellent tire at an excellent price ($115 per tire). Other alternatives are the Avon Tech M500 ($105) and the Fuzion ZRi ($91), which are both basically similar to the ES100 in performance and price. Anything else is going to be a big step down in performance.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by msedacca &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I don't think I have the right offset on my car, what is the proper offset for a 2004 Accord LX 4cyl 4 door?</TD></TR></TABLE>

I really don't know, sorry...

 

Speaking of which, does anyone know what the right offset for the wheels on my 2004 Honda Accord LX 4cyl 4dr is?

 

i have 16 are too small on accords. 17x7 rota subzero will do good.

 

thanks for bumping a month and half dead topic

i already put 17x7.5 rota subzero's with Yokohama ES100 215/50/17. The dry traction and grip is very good, and the wet traction is much better than what I expected it to be. Overall an outstanding tire.