im building ls/vtec and im wondering which head would be better... i also would like to know a few things about the b16 head... what is the combustion chamber sze of the 16 head???? and what are the intake and exhaust valve sizes also.. i have both heads and i know the combustion chamber on the gsr is 45cc and the intake is 33mm and the exhaust is 28mm.. please help!!!

 

The B16 head is better.

 

what makes it better??????? does it flow more air??? i dotn wanna know opinions i want to know actual numbers......

 

well its a PR3 head which is the same as the type r, except the b16 does not flow as good as the R. It flows better than the gsr. 95% sure!

 

The port design is better, you have the ability to run better manifolds.....the differences are not huge, but given teh choice I'd go with teh B16 head.

Sorry bud, I can't give you flow numbers stock vs stock....I'm sure the search feature would get you the answers though.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by AMECustom &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">well its a PR3 head which is the same as the type r, except the b16 does not flow as good as the R. It flows better than the gsr. 95% sure!</TD></TR></TABLE>


The Type R head is a B16 head with an OE porting job on it.....

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by xEnderx &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">


The Type R head is a B16 head with an OE porting job on it.....</TD></TR></TABLE>

Don't forget the cams!

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by xEnderx &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">you have the ability to run better manifolds</TD></TR></TABLE>


From the research I did I came to the conclusion that a GSR head out flows a B16 head SLIGHTLY in the midrange. Also due to the design of the GSR Combustion Chambers the GSR Head will bump up your compression .2 over the B16 head.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by AMECustom &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Don't forget the cams!</TD></TR></TABLE>

I said the HEAD buddy. That doesn't mean the camshafts and valve train.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by THEUSED &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

From the research I did I came to the conclusion that a GSR head out flows a B16 head SLIGHTLY in the midrange. Also due to the design of the GSR Combustion Chambers the GSR Head will bump up your compression .2 over the B16 head.</TD></TR></TABLE>


.2....seriously? That a pretty big jump.

I'd still stick with teh B16 head though.

 

xEnderx, youre giving advice on which cylinder head to choose and you didnt even know the GSR has smaller combustion chambers than the pr3?

Stock vs Stock GSR wins hands down. It flows just as well up high as the b16 casting, and better in the midrange. There are plenty of well designed manifolds out for the gsr head now as well, AEBS, Skunk2 pro series, blox etc. etc.

Smaller combustion chamber increase compression the right way. Which is not by adding a huge dome to a piston impeding flame front, or by decreasing headgasket thickness and sealing effectiveness.

 

thanks alot.. i wanted to hear a real answer... the gsr head def. has my vote now.. i think everyone likes the b16 head cause its mildly ported on the type-r.. o well..

 

everyone has the B16 head b/c it makes the most sense..

there is an acticle on a site...i forget what it is...but i read on it *SEARCH*

they tested the flowing on the P72 head and the Pr-3 head...
in almost all the tests the GSR head flowed the best in the mid range only..
the b16 down bottom and up top flowed more efficently and more...

Finally the maker of that note said that the B16 head would be a more effiecent head b/c of manifold choices and b/c most of us honda builders wouldn't be spending most of our time in the mid range anyway! Getting the GSR mani for midrange sorta makes no sense....but if thats what your looking for then so be it

Pr-3

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by b16delteg &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">everyone has the B16 head b/c it makes the most sense..

there is an acticle on a site...i forget what it is...but i read on it *SEARCH*

they tested the flowing on the P72 head and the Pr-3 head...
in almost all the tests the GSR head flowed the best in the mid range only..
the b16 down bottom and up top flowed more efficently and more...

Finally the maker of that note said that the B16 head would be a more effiecent head b/c of manifold choices and b/c most of us honda builders wouldn't be spending most of our time in the mid range anyway! Getting the GSR mani for midrange sorta makes no sense....but if thats what your looking for then so be it

Pr-3 </TD></TR></TABLE>

Yeah, that was the angle I was coming from.

 

I know what I would chose.

 

and that would be which one?....

 

Honda!

 

....mmhmm

pr-3 you mean hahah

 

this subject has been beaten to death.
stock for stock b16 flows better and make more high rpm hp
gsr make more mid range because of the dual runner intake manifold.

b16a has a 42.7 cc combustion chamber and holds more cc's of air at one time simple put.
gsr has a 41.2 cc ??? combustion chamber and gives you .2 compression more.

i like b16a heads personally. but someone will disagree with me.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by rainforest &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">this subject has been beaten to death.
stock for stock b16 flows better and make more high rpm hp
gsr make more mid range because of the dual runner intake manifold.

b16a has a 42.7 cc combustion chamber and holds more cc's of air at one time simple put.
gsr has a 41.2 cc ??? combustion chamber and gives you .2 compression more.

i like b16a heads personally. but someone will disagree with me.</TD></TR></TABLE>

i'm not going to disagree with that

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by b16delteg &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
everyone has the B16 head b/c it makes the most sense..</TD></TR></TABLE>

No i believe its because theyre cheaper and plentiful.

The odds are in your favor that if you get a p72 head, it will be a better casting. Like i stated in my post, stock vs stock i like p72 heads because of the increase in compression they yeild without having to go with a thinner gasket of a bigger dome on the piston. The difference in flow was very minimal from flow charts i have seen and is more than offset with smaller chambers and perhaps flat faced valves.

Remember the import tuner wd-40 shootout a while back?

 

stock for stock? i know the creator of this thread and his head is not staying stock..he's changing slugs & everything...i made my point....if the flow is so minimal and the compression is so minimal lets just agree that its based on preference and availability...but 9/10 people would go with a b16 head i'd put money on it

 

9/10 people probably go with the b16 head, youd win your money.

However, every single engine builder in the wd-40 shootout used a p72 casting. I think they know just a bit more than the average joe on the street.

 

why can't we be friends.....why can't we be friends...


oh well.....i like the pr-3....you like the p72...

someone has to disagree with me and someone has to disagree with you

 

Haha, dont take it too seriously, its just internet banter, and youre right, the differences are so small it comes down to opinions.