Member at our local SCCA board posted this, he got it from one of the mailing list he is on.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">My wife just received a phone call at 9pm local from someone purporting to be a representative of the SCCA. This person thanked my wife for being a member this last year (she wasn't) and wanted to know if she'd like to renew her membership. The person offered to go ahead and take our credit card number right there over the phone to renew her membership and promised many discounts with many vendors. Hmmm...sounds fishy.

Has anyone else received a call like this? Sounds to us like someone is calling posing as the SCCA in order to steal credit card information.

Everyone beware!

David Fauth</TD></TR></TABLE>

Just a heads up for you guys.

 

SCCA simply doesn't do it that way.

If you get that call, its a fake.

Somebody got hold of a member list.
People are dicks.

 

I know, just don't someone unsuspecting to fall for it.

 

Wow, that spread fast. That guy is actually an autocrosser from the Colorado region. Several of us have been receiving these calls, but I haven't gotten mine yet. One of the other people that got a call noticed that his Caller ID said 541-864-1492 (Medford, Oregon). A quick Google search brings up an interesting thread over on Corner-Carvers.com: http://forums.corner-carvers.c...19989

Some people inquired about this to SCCA HQ and found that apparently they did contract some company to be making calls, but I still say this is way too fishy. I'll be renewing by mail.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 94accordsedan &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Member at our local SCCA board posted this, he got it from one of the mailing list he is on.

Just a heads up for you guys. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Hrm... I got one of those calls a month or two ago.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by rotten &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Hrm... I got one of those calls a month or two ago.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Same. The guy was very persistent.

 

Here's the word from headquarters...

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
The SCCA has for about the past six months been using an outside organization to contact former members about rejoining the SCCA, and has had good success with the program. The organization is Comnet Marketing, a company that specializes in working with membership and not-for-profit organizations like the SCCA.

If a former member of the SCCA is not comfortable with providing a credit card number over the telephone to Comnet or just prefers to pay by check, the option of being billed for the membership renewal is offered. About 60% percent of the people renewing elect to pay by credit card. Of the 40% who elect to pay by check, the percentage who actually complete the renewal process is much less than 100%

Colan Arnold

Vice President, Membership
Sports Car Club of America
PO Box 19400
Topeka, KS 66619
(800) 770 - 2055
(785) 862 - 7106
</TD></TR></TABLE>

 

I recieved one of these calls as well. I too was alarmed and requested that they mail the information to me. Sure enough I got a letter a few weeks later from the SCCA. It really does sound like a scam on the phone and think that it is kinda shitty that SCCA is resorting to this. If they identified that they are from such and such group that SCCA is using to recrute old members I think it would be a little better on their part.

Z

 

I also got a call. I told them I raced with NASA now.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Grumpy &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I also got a call. I told them I raced with NASA now. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Bahaha, that's exactly what I said as well. I also questioned them why they would not accept my NASA comp license as a valid race license. The ironic thing about the call was that I was on my way home from a weekend of racing with NASA down at VIR and I was driving the racecar.

Z

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Zephyr-The Subaru Guy &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
I also questioned them why they would not accept my NASA comp license as a valid race license. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Kind of off topic, but I asked a high ranking SEDIV SCCA official this question a few months ago at Road Atlanta when we were discussing the yearly SCCA school. His answer was a simple one...
"Because you can get a NASA race license without ever attending a race school and we aren't comfortable with that."

Make sense.

Scott, who got his NASA Race license without ever having attended a race school, taken a green flag, or running a practice race (and I'm not the only one).

 

Here we go again......

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Grumpy &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Here we go again......</TD></TR></TABLE>

No. Not really.
No **** slinging. Its all fact.

Zephyr asked a question. I answered it.

If someone wants to fight about it... Whatever.

Scott, who come to think of it is pretty sure someone will want to fight about it.

 

That is true. The scarier part about racing school is, anyone with money and a little sense will pass it. And get their license after all. There are no real test.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Catch 22 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Kind of off topic, but I asked a high ranking SEDIV SCCA official this question a few months ago at Road Atlanta when we were discussing the yearly SCCA school. His answer was a simple one...
"Because you can get a NASA race license without ever attending a race school and we aren't comfortable with that."

Make sense.

Scott, who got his NASA Race license without ever having attended a race school, taken a green flag, or running a practice race (and I'm not the only one).</TD></TR></TABLE>

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Andrie &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">That is true. The scarier part about racing school is, anyone with money and a little sense will pass it. And get their license after all. There are no real test.

</TD></TR></TABLE>

I agree totally. I have done both an SCCA school and a 3 day Skip Barber. I thought that both were too easy to pass and I saw people signed off at both that I don't think needed to be signed off.

That said, at least they are going into their first W2W races having actually done some race starts and running on a track with total open passing.

In short, I think SCCA is too easy, and NASA is even easier than that.
JMO, having done both.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Catch 22 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Kind of off topic, but I asked a high ranking SEDIV SCCA official this question a few months ago at Road Atlanta when we were discussing the yearly SCCA school. His answer was a simple one...
"Because you can get a NASA race license without ever attending a race school and we aren't comfortable with that."

Make sense.

Scott, who got his NASA Race license without ever having attended a race school, taken a green flag, or running a practice race (and I'm not the only one).</TD></TR></TABLE>


Come on now. What is really the difference? The SCCA "school" which I attended was no more than a 2 day event with open passing. The fact that I knew more than my instructor was a very bad sign to me. I also was not impressed by the fact that the slowest people still passed.
The race track during a race is not the place to build speed. It's not the place to learn to drive at the limit. That is what HPDE is for.
At least with NASA, it's a little more in depth as far as "who" can take the class.

I think it would help to define "race school". The NASA program is just as much of a "race school" as the SCCA super school I got my license with.

I think all 3 options put people on track during race conditions that just should not be out there. Sure, you can be a safe slow driver. But, again, building speed should not be done during races.

 

you know i really don't know what its like in other regions, but i have been impressed with the way my areas program is ran. I like the pace car side by side laps, black flag, yellow flag, red flag situations that sometime get put out there. The man who acutall tests people seems to do a good job. But i have seen people in both nasa and SCCA who i thought to my self "i don't think they should be out there". (let that hold whatever mert you put to it). Unlike jeremy i think its ok to be slow on the race track, some cars out there will be slow in comparision to another car out on the race track, but the person should know what they are doing.

 

Bottom line is SCCA is a bunch of crotchety old farts who want to sit on their high horse and frown down upon other national organizations. They'll accept an EMRA license and it's even more of a joke to get a license from them than anyone else. When I took my NASA comp school it was a dedicated school with twelve rookies and on track instructors. Every session had a different drill that had to be performed. Some drivers did not pass without further evaluation. Prior to comp school I had attended well over 40 track days, autocrossed my *** off and before that raced motocross which is very very helpful for wheel to wheel racing.

The bottom line is that SCCA could easily look at a drivers current NASA log book and at their overall experience and make the decision to wave the required two schools which costs a lot of money for most racers. At this point in time I'm in no rush to rejoin SCCA as there is no benifit for me to as NASA is providing an excellent venue for racing. Some may say that NASA is small time or a bunch of amatures but for the amount of fun I get out of a weekend I'll continue racing with them and continue crewing for my friends at SCCA events wearing a NASA shirt and rockin the We Drive Harder sticker on the back of my cars.

Z

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Zephyr-The Subaru Guy &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The bottom line is that SCCA could easily look at a drivers current NASA log book and at their overall experience and make the decision to wave the required two schools which costs a lot of money for most racers. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Forget the money aspect of it. What I refuse to do is take the school and go wheel to wheel with somebody who potentially has never been on a track before! I wanted to try a few SCCA races this year because my schedule was such that I didn't think I could race at the Glen this year any other way. I contacted them, explained that I've been racing with NASA and EMRA since 2001, that I graduated Skip Barber, that I instruct with NASA, PCA, and a few other organizations, that I formerly held an SCCA liscense when I graduated Skip Barber..... and they came back and said that I had to do the liscensing schools. The expression "kiss my hairy ***" came to mind.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by speedracer33 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

What I refuse to do is take the school and go wheel to wheel with somebody who potentially has never been on a track before! </TD></TR></TABLE>

Dude, I totally forgot about that part of it too! That is the most retarded aspect of the SCCA schools. Yes you have to do two of them but the fact that some of the other drivers out there could have never turned a wheel on track before scares the **** out of me. The worst part of it is that 9 times out of 10 they are driving a car that is way too much car for the driver too. I'm going to have to have to do some serious talking to SCCA prior to running with them. Of course that is if I decide to ever run with them.

IIRC your NASA region will pay you a small amount for every SCCA event that you run so you do not have to cover up your NASA stickers since at that point they would be a sponsor.

Screw Flanders. I mean SCCA.

Z

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Zephyr-The Subaru Guy &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">IIRC your NASA region will pay you a small amount for every SCCA event that you run so you do not have to cover up your NASA stickers since at that point they would be a sponsor. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Where did you hear that?!?

 

I'll IM you about it. Don't want to post names.

Z

 

Won't matter. Other racing sanction's names must be covered, sponsor or not.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Grumpy &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Won't matter. Other racing sanction's names must be covered, sponsor or not.</TD></TR></TABLE>

And both organizations do this.

And Matt... So you'd rather take a race start next to a guy who's never done it before than do a race school with a guy who never been on track?
I find that odd, given that the start and first few laps are tha hairiest part of any race.

And Zephyr... Great. You took a NASA comp school and did comp school stuff. Thats wonderful and the way it should be. But a bunch of current NASA license holders never did. And they still do it that way, there were several guys driving around in the Advanced DE group at Road Atlanta getting"observed" for their race licenses.
So how is SCCA expected to determine who is schooled and who isn't among NASA license holders?

Finally, just like NASA, each SCCA region holds its own schools. I'm sure, like NASA, they vary. At the biggest school here in the SE (Roebling), its 3 days. During that time you will have about 6ish hours of seat time. This includes open passing, pace laps, flag drills, race starts, and several short (5 lap) practice races at the end of the school. Its a very full program, that covers at least once pretty much everything most of us will ever see in a race. Getting "observed" at an HPDE doesn't even remotely come close to doing this. Actually its pretty much a joke.
I got observed for my NASA license and at the time I was a complete rookie and didn't know any better. I thought it was awesome to get a race license so cheap and easy (I didn't even have to pay, I was instructing!!! Wooo Hooo!!!)... Screw those SCCA guys and their $300 3 day school... Right?
Well, now that I've been racing for a few years, I've completely changed my mind. HPDE in no way prepares you for racing. None. You might get lucky and have your first race with 20 cars with drivers that are just as green as you, but if your first race is 65 really fast and really aggressive cars at Road Atlanta... Trust me, that DE experience will likely only keep you from wetting yourself. Maybe.

But, you do what you want. Avoid those crotchety old folks at SCCA like the plague. We'd love to see some of you die-hard NASA folks come try some races, but at the end of the day, SCCA is still often getting 200 to 300 race entrants per weekend and the crotchety old farts will get along just fine without you.

 

oy! there goes another round of NASA vs. SCCA bullshit. Let me jump into the fray with my opinions and experiences.

1- the SCCA's schools have been in place for a long time. There didn't use to be any accessible way to do HPDE (a NASA, name, btw) to gain experience on track, at speed. Therefore, the SCCA schools have historically been where some people get their first chance to drive on track. Some morons chose a GT-1 car at their first school, and it's annoying to have someone blast you down the straights and park it in the turns.

2- look at it as good practice avoiding slow drivers, idiot drivers, and general asshats. They are present in BOTH sanctions, regardless of licensing requirements.

3- Like everything else, your school experience with SCCA will vary from region to region. I can only speak of the ones I attended: Washington region at Summit and the ohio region at Nelson Ledges. They were both very well run, VERY well organized, and both my instructors were very (20 years) experienced racers who taught me a lot about racing.

4- you don't NEED a super comp school with NASA to get a license. You can just do a bunch of HPDEs and be observed. That means you may get a license having never done a start. Rolling or standing. It's not so much the start, it's the traffic jam at turn 1 where the **** usually hits the fan. If you've never epxerienced it, you are likely to expletive it up the first time and cause a wreck.

5- HPDEs have widely varying cars and speeds. I have never been in a HPDE situation where I was actually RACING with someone for position. Because, hey, it's against the rules, it's discourages, and it's not what HPDE is all about. In a SCCA school, you'll be racing against other cars. For position. No comparison.

So quit the bullshit slinging between the two sanctioning bodies. Doing HPDEs and a comp school through NASA can be a good way to go. Doing SCCA schools is also a good way to do it.
And you know what? There WILL ba asshats who will plow their EVOs in the pit wall, foot to the floor - or morons in their GT-1 cars, scared of the power who will punt you off. Can't avoid it, regardless of what you do.