Grounding Issue
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From: Roy, UT, USA
Grounding Issue
Ok I am at the end of my rope. I have a Grounding issue.
Issue - Ground Hum and Whine from Sub. It does not matter if the car is on or off. If i jump the remote to power I get a Warble(SP). This is with the car off.
What I have done - Replaced ground. Switched Ground locations. Changed Valve cover ground with 6 gauge wire. Sanded down on block and body ground mounts. Changed t o2 wire gauge from battery to chassis ground. Recrimped and replaced the HU ground to a different point.
Does anyone know what it can be? I really dont want to take it to a Stereo place. I think it may jsut be something simple I am missing. I have no idea.
Issue - Ground Hum and Whine from Sub. It does not matter if the car is on or off. If i jump the remote to power I get a Warble(SP). This is with the car off.
What I have done - Replaced ground. Switched Ground locations. Changed Valve cover ground with 6 gauge wire. Sanded down on block and body ground mounts. Changed t o2 wire gauge from battery to chassis ground. Recrimped and replaced the HU ground to a different point.
Does anyone know what it can be? I really dont want to take it to a Stereo place. I think it may jsut be something simple I am missing. I have no idea.
Thread Starter
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From: Roy, UT, USA
Re: (B18C_EJ8)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by B18C_EJ8 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Could be an interference problem with RCA's... What happens when you unplug the signal wires from the amp? Does it still hum?</TD></TR></TABLE>
It gets louder. Remeber teh car is OFF when its Hum/Warbleing.
Cut what ground? One of them Valve? Amp? BAttery? Trans? Harness? HU? What one would I cut?
It gets louder. Remeber teh car is OFF when its Hum/Warbleing.
Cut what ground? One of them Valve? Amp? BAttery? Trans? Harness? HU? What one would I cut?
Old Fart
Joined: May 2004
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From: kelowna, bc, canada
Re: (B18C1 '96 Coupe)
What is the gain control on the amp set at, is it turned all the way up?
What is the make and model of the amp?
IMO, if the problem gets worse when you unplug the RCAs, [from the amp], and as long as the gain on the amp is not "pinned" it is a grounding problem, [as the RCAs signal return, (outside shield) is a common ground] and will add ground potential to the amp, not very much because the ground tracers on the PC boards of the amp and HU can't carry much of a load, that said, I believe the problem is in the amp itself, assuming that the amp ground and power are OK, an amp that is "idling", [no signal to amplify, RCAs unplugged] needs very little currant, so any power or ground should work, and there should be no noise at all, [no signal to speaker] other then maybe a slight movement or "turn on thump" when amp is triggered on.
94
What is the make and model of the amp?
IMO, if the problem gets worse when you unplug the RCAs, [from the amp], and as long as the gain on the amp is not "pinned" it is a grounding problem, [as the RCAs signal return, (outside shield) is a common ground] and will add ground potential to the amp, not very much because the ground tracers on the PC boards of the amp and HU can't carry much of a load, that said, I believe the problem is in the amp itself, assuming that the amp ground and power are OK, an amp that is "idling", [no signal to amplify, RCAs unplugged] needs very little currant, so any power or ground should work, and there should be no noise at all, [no signal to speaker] other then maybe a slight movement or "turn on thump" when amp is triggered on.
94
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Old Fart
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From: kelowna, bc, canada
Re: (B18C1 '96 Coupe)
I have not had that problem with any of the MTX amps, [we are a MTX dealer] but I have run into it with other amps, in all cases it was a grounding problem in the amp itself.
If it wasn't for the fact that you said the problem is worse when you unplug the RCAs I would have guessed it was one or both of the ground tracers, [RCA signal return] had burnt, [blown like a fuse] when amp was turned on and volume was up a little and for some reason the amp lost it's main ground, [amp will try an "draw" a ground through the RCAs] because the tracers are so thin, they can't carry the currant and they blow like a fuse, [sometimes in the amp and sometimes in the HU]
Back to your problem, with the gain only 1/2 way up, your not over saturating the amps input stage, and definitely not when the RCAs are unplugged, and as I said before if the ground and power are ok, you are left with a problem in the amp itself, probably a grounding problem.
Is the amp new or used, did it ever work properly?
Was it installed at an MTX dealer, or did you install it yourself? 94
If it wasn't for the fact that you said the problem is worse when you unplug the RCAs I would have guessed it was one or both of the ground tracers, [RCA signal return] had burnt, [blown like a fuse] when amp was turned on and volume was up a little and for some reason the amp lost it's main ground, [amp will try an "draw" a ground through the RCAs] because the tracers are so thin, they can't carry the currant and they blow like a fuse, [sometimes in the amp and sometimes in the HU]
Back to your problem, with the gain only 1/2 way up, your not over saturating the amps input stage, and definitely not when the RCAs are unplugged, and as I said before if the ground and power are ok, you are left with a problem in the amp itself, probably a grounding problem.
Is the amp new or used, did it ever work properly?
Was it installed at an MTX dealer, or did you install it yourself?
94
Thread Starter
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From: Roy, UT, USA
Re: (fcm)
yes it worked properly on my nissan 200sx SE-R. So it is used and has in the past worked flawlessly.
It was installed by myself. After 10 of these installs I wouldnt think its my install. But there is a first time for everything, as this is the first time im experiancing this issue.
It was installed by myself. After 10 of these installs I wouldnt think its my install. But there is a first time for everything, as this is the first time im experiancing this issue.
Old Fart
Joined: May 2004
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From: kelowna, bc, canada
Re: (B18C1 '96 Coupe)
That is also a problem I have run into, [it was working in one car and the problem showed up when moved to another car] the problem, [something going wrong inside the amp] happens as soon as you disconnect power, [a cap or something blows] I have had customers come in with problems like that and they swear all that was done was the batt. was changed, [sometimes at a batt. shop].
If you can, install the amp temporarily into another car with a system that is working, if there is no noise, then the problem is the install, if the noise is still there, you know the problem is in the amp.
BTW Have you tried plugging in another sub, [to eliminate it as the problem]?
94
If you can, install the amp temporarily into another car with a system that is working, if there is no noise, then the problem is the install, if the noise is still there, you know the problem is in the amp.
BTW Have you tried plugging in another sub, [to eliminate it as the problem]?
94
Honda-Tech Member
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From: Beavertown, OR
You said you have a hum with the car off correct?
Is it a constant hum? Can you try plugging something else into the amplifier like a walkman or something.
It kinda sounds like you have blown the RCA level outs on your deck and are supplying a dc voltage to the amplifier. Depending on the deck it's a fairly easy fix if you can solder. There is a capacitor in series with the level out this blocks the DC bias voltage from leaving the deck. When you blow the ouputs this cap usually gets damaged.
Is it a constant hum? Can you try plugging something else into the amplifier like a walkman or something.
It kinda sounds like you have blown the RCA level outs on your deck and are supplying a dc voltage to the amplifier. Depending on the deck it's a fairly easy fix if you can solder. There is a capacitor in series with the level out this blocks the DC bias voltage from leaving the deck. When you blow the ouputs this cap usually gets damaged.
Old Fart
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 26,173
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From: kelowna, bc, canada
Re: (nsxxtreme)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by nsxxtreme »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">You said you have a hum with the car off correct?
Is it a constant hum? Can you try plugging something else into the amplifier like a walkman or something.
It kinda sounds like you have blown the RCA level outs on your deck and are supplying a dc voltage to the amplifier. Depending on the deck it's a fairly easy fix if you can solder. There is a capacitor in series with the level out this blocks the DC bias voltage from leaving the deck. When you blow the ouputs this cap usually gets damaged.</TD></TR></TABLE>
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by B18C_EJ8 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Could be an interference problem with RCA's... What happens when you unplug the signal wires from the amp? Does it still hum?</TD></TR></TABLE> I think that was checked.....
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by B18C1 ’96 Coupe »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
It gets louder. Remeber teh car is OFF when its Hum/Warbleing.
Cut what ground? One of them Valve? Amp? BAttery? Trans? Harness? HU? What one would I cut?</TD></TR></TABLE> That's what gets me, the problem is worse with no signal at all
94
Is it a constant hum? Can you try plugging something else into the amplifier like a walkman or something.
It kinda sounds like you have blown the RCA level outs on your deck and are supplying a dc voltage to the amplifier. Depending on the deck it's a fairly easy fix if you can solder. There is a capacitor in series with the level out this blocks the DC bias voltage from leaving the deck. When you blow the ouputs this cap usually gets damaged.</TD></TR></TABLE>
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by B18C_EJ8 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Could be an interference problem with RCA's... What happens when you unplug the signal wires from the amp? Does it still hum?</TD></TR></TABLE> I think that was checked.....
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by B18C1 ’96 Coupe »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
It gets louder. Remeber teh car is OFF when its Hum/Warbleing.
Cut what ground? One of them Valve? Amp? BAttery? Trans? Harness? HU? What one would I cut?</TD></TR></TABLE> That's what gets me, the problem is worse with no signal at all
94
Honda-Tech Member
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From: Beavertown, OR
Re: (fcm)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by fcm »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
I think that was checked.....
That's what gets me, the problem is worse with no signal at all 94</TD></TR></TABLE>
I don't see where he states it still hums with the RCA's disconnected.
If you get a constant hum and it goes away when the RCA's are unplugged, then your outputs on your deck are blown.
I think that was checked.....
That's what gets me, the problem is worse with no signal at all
94</TD></TR></TABLE>I don't see where he states it still hums with the RCA's disconnected.
If you get a constant hum and it goes away when the RCA's are unplugged, then your outputs on your deck are blown.
Old Fart
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 26,173
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From: kelowna, bc, canada
Re: (nsxxtreme)
B18C_EJ8 asked him.....
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by B18C_EJ8 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> What happens when you unplug the signal wires from the amp? Does it still hum?</TD></TR></TABLE> and B18C1 '96 Coupe answered.....
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by B18C1 ’96 Coupe »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">It gets louder. </TD></TR></TABLE> I assumed he meant that he unplugged the RCAs at the amp and the problem got worse. 94
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by B18C_EJ8 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> What happens when you unplug the signal wires from the amp? Does it still hum?</TD></TR></TABLE> and B18C1 '96 Coupe answered.....
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by B18C1 ’96 Coupe »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">It gets louder. </TD></TR></TABLE> I assumed he meant that he unplugged the RCAs at the amp and the problem got worse.
94
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: Jan 2002
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From: Beavertown, OR
Re: (fcm)
*shrug* don't know, I think we may have some errors in the trouble shooting skills.
Info given is contradicting, there isn't enough of a load from the ouput of the deck to cause a decrease in hum when it gets plugged in. Unless you have a blown deck and a blown amp.
If the amp had a bad transistor it might put out DC and cause a hum but it wouldn't be affected by the RCA's.
Info given is contradicting, there isn't enough of a load from the ouput of the deck to cause a decrease in hum when it gets plugged in. Unless you have a blown deck and a blown amp.
If the amp had a bad transistor it might put out DC and cause a hum but it wouldn't be affected by the RCA's.
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From: mesquite, tx
Re: (nsxxtreme)
i remember i had this problem back in the day. my problem was i was using the high pass on the amp to get the singal and one of my wires came loose man it was a pain in the ***. so i called around to a couple of shops they told me good luck in finding it yourself. i went out popped my trunk and one of the wires was loose. THis was before they made line converters
Old Fart
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 26,173
Likes: 18
From: kelowna, bc, canada
Re: (nsxxtreme)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by nsxxtreme »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">*shrug* don't know, I think we may have some errors in the trouble shooting skills.
Info given is contradicting, there isn't enough of a load from the ouput of the deck to cause a decrease in hum when it gets plugged in. Unless you have a blown deck and a blown amp.
If the amp had a bad transistor it might put out DC and cause a hum but it wouldn't be affected by the RCA's.</TD></TR></TABLE>I agree, but I have no reason to disbelieve him when he says the "Hum/Warbleing" gets louder when the RCAs are unplugged, as I have run into the symptom myself, [as unplugging the RCAs from an amp is one of the first things I do when troubleshooting noise problems]
I can only assume that the noise is lower with the RCAs plugged in because of the ground the amp would get from the HU through the RCAs, the last time, [about a year ago] that I ran into this problem/symptom, the problem was a circuit board to chassis ground in the amp itself, [cracked tracer on circuit board] 94
Info given is contradicting, there isn't enough of a load from the ouput of the deck to cause a decrease in hum when it gets plugged in. Unless you have a blown deck and a blown amp.
If the amp had a bad transistor it might put out DC and cause a hum but it wouldn't be affected by the RCA's.</TD></TR></TABLE>I agree, but I have no reason to disbelieve him when he says the "Hum/Warbleing" gets louder when the RCAs are unplugged, as I have run into the symptom myself, [as unplugging the RCAs from an amp is one of the first things I do when troubleshooting noise problems]
I can only assume that the noise is lower with the RCAs plugged in because of the ground the amp would get from the HU through the RCAs, the last time, [about a year ago] that I ran into this problem/symptom, the problem was a circuit board to chassis ground in the amp itself, [cracked tracer on circuit board]
94
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From: Roy, UT, USA
Re: (fcm)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by nsxxtreme »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">*shrug* don't know, I think we may have some errors in the trouble shooting skills.[QUOTE=nsxxtreme]
What more would you like me to do? What Error could it possibly be? Care to elaborate?
[QUOTE=nsxxtreme]Info given is contradicting, there isn't enough of a load from the output of the deck to cause a decrease in hum when it gets plugged in. Unless you have a blown deck and a blown amp.[QUOTE=nsxxtreme]
What is contradicting? Care to elaborate again? The Deck is not hooked up when I am getting the Hum. I remove RCA's. I jump Power to Remote causing the amp to turn on because Battery is constant +12. Then I hear a Warble/Hum. So All that is hooked up would be Chassis Ground(Bumper Bolt) and +12V from the Battery. Plus a jump wire from +12V to Remote on amp.
The Hu/Deck is not in the equation. Neither is any of the cars Electric Functions as the Key is off, and in my pocket.
[QUOTE=nsxxtreme]If the amp had a bad transistor it might put out DC and cause a hum but it wouldn't be affected by the RCA's.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Im beginning to think its the AMP. All signs point to amp. I am seeing around if some one has an amp to borrow.
I guess I could crack open the Amp and see if the board is gone. I doubt MTX would Warranty a 3 year old amp.
Thank you all for your input. I will keep you posted as soon as i find a spare amp.
What more would you like me to do? What Error could it possibly be? Care to elaborate?
[QUOTE=nsxxtreme]Info given is contradicting, there isn't enough of a load from the output of the deck to cause a decrease in hum when it gets plugged in. Unless you have a blown deck and a blown amp.[QUOTE=nsxxtreme]
What is contradicting? Care to elaborate again? The Deck is not hooked up when I am getting the Hum. I remove RCA's. I jump Power to Remote causing the amp to turn on because Battery is constant +12. Then I hear a Warble/Hum. So All that is hooked up would be Chassis Ground(Bumper Bolt) and +12V from the Battery. Plus a jump wire from +12V to Remote on amp.
The Hu/Deck is not in the equation. Neither is any of the cars Electric Functions as the Key is off, and in my pocket.
[QUOTE=nsxxtreme]If the amp had a bad transistor it might put out DC and cause a hum but it wouldn't be affected by the RCA's.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Im beginning to think its the AMP. All signs point to amp. I am seeing around if some one has an amp to borrow.
I guess I could crack open the Amp and see if the board is gone. I doubt MTX would Warranty a 3 year old amp.
Thank you all for your input. I will keep you posted as soon as i find a spare amp.
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From: Beavertown, OR
Re: (B18C1 '96 Coupe)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by B18C1 ’96 Coupe »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">What is contradicting? Care to elaborate again? The Deck is not hooked up when I am getting the Hum.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
The part where you say the hum gets louder when you disconnect the RCA's. I'm not saying it isn't happening it is just very odd.
If you take the amp apart you might check the connection where the rca connector plugs into the circuit board. Look for cracked solder joints exspecially around the ground lead.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
The part where you say the hum gets louder when you disconnect the RCA's. I'm not saying it isn't happening it is just very odd.
If you take the amp apart you might check the connection where the rca connector plugs into the circuit board. Look for cracked solder joints exspecially around the ground lead.
94
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