I really don't have a clue if this will work , but if it can I would be one VERY PHUCKING KICK *** motor :-

there is alot of talk going around about boring the B18C to 84-86mm , this seems to pump out decent power ! True ?

On the other hand there is the person who likes to get a Stroker Crank , which would put them in the same region of Displacement as the bored motor guys !

Now if some how you can now take the Stroked motor and then bore that out to say 84-86mm then displacement should be in the region of 2100-2250 cc .

The thing I am wondering about is if this is possible ?
Reliability , how does this factor ?
Rod-Stroke ratio , how would this be affected ?

I estimate that doing this with the following setup should net you with about 240+ whp :-

P&P head
3-5 angle valve job
JUN 3 / TODA C cams
JUN / TODA valve springs
cam gears
JG / SMS / TODA / Hi-tech / JUN header
aftermarket intake manifold / Indivisual Throttle bodies
310+ injectors
DFI / TEC / Hondata / Zdyne ECU
Cold Air Intake + 68-70mm throttle body ( with aftermarket intake manifold )
12.0 CR pistons
forger rods

Drop some oppinions on this ! God know if it will work , I have no idea !

 

Stroking sucks. It destroys your RPM capability! It increases side load from the pistons and stresses the sleeves. Basically it is a bigger crankshaft and longer rods that mount higher in new pistons.

Now, leaving the stock stroke and increasing the bore size does nothing to your RPM capabilities and increases displacement. The only side effect is heavier pistons (since they are bigger).

Pro's bore and stroke there racing engines however, they can afford to rebuild them and only travel 1/4 of a mile. reliability sucks.

 

yeah all of this is true .

Eagle has a forger crank , using this ( being lighter ) helps with RPM to rise . using this with forged rods and pistons and Golden Eagle sleeves. the motor should be pretty strong. and with these lighter parts your RPM should be fine !

Any opinions ?

Plus say you build this motor , you can drive your car daily ........... I don't think you rev your car to redline every time you move , so the engine should mot be under any extreme load .

 

sounds like a fun setup to me. massive stress to the sleeves considering the borring. but fun! i would also like to change the valvetrain and ecu setup to a mid range power, seeing as how i would not like to break the car reving to the moon.

 

Thanks , well at least someone thinks it'll be cool ! !
There will be stress , but that could be combated by using stronger ductile sleeves from Golden eagle !
the use of cams (maybe JUN / Skunk ) and a V-AFC can be used to tune out the VTEC point and give insane mid-range power

yeah it should be fun , and once it is built , it will be WICKEDLY FAST , 11secs all day .

I WILL make this my next project ! ! !

drop some opinions

 

Yes, we already have plans for a 2156cc engine, with a r/s ratio of 1.62

Can you say Torque and Revs?

Sure you can.

Estimated cost of our new project - $3500 (bottom end only)

 

ok i understand the whole obsession with n/a power... but honestly... why not just start with an h22? and then if you still want power with a b18 why not just pressurize? honestly... this seems like alot of money wasted on "over-engineering".

 

1.62 damn sweet , is your setup similar to mine ?

yeah I can say torque and revs , but I can also use adjectives :- NUFF FACKIN TORQUE AND NUFF FACKIN REVS

now can you say 11secs

that is alot of crumbs , but it will be well worth it

 

Starting with the H22 is the lazy way out IMO ! To go to the track and destroy every thing you battle , then to say with that you did it with a motor you sat down and engineered , is alot more fun !
Dont get me wrong , a H22 is Fackin fast , but you factor in weight you have a front heavy car that is hard to turn into corners !

you get where I am coming from ?

 

you could stroke it by adding an ls crank instead of all these after market parts and then add high comp pistons and forged rods of a diff length to get a better r/s ratio.


[Modified by sa21199, 12:43 AM 2/16/2002]

 

Stroking does not necessairly increase rod length. If you use the LS crank in a B18C1, the LS rods that you would actually use are shorter.
As for RPM capabilities, that depends on how much stroke you add, and how well the block is assembled.


Jason

 

if your going to spend the $$$$ to make a b18c a 2.2 why would use a vafc??? you would have to use at least an AEM stand alone ITB's and 440cc's , i thought about this setup with my b18c block but i went with the b20 instead (87 mm sleeves are for next winter, along w/ a little billet oops i meant secret headwork hahaha )

 

The LS is not made for high RPM , there fore the crack would not be as strong as a VTEC crank. So using the LS crank would be useless .

I dont understand your last statement :- "As for RPM capabilities, that depends on how much stroke you add, and how well the block is assembled. "
Do you mean that the more you stroke a motor the lower RPM you will be able to rev to ?

 

Not true, there are many people who have used a LS crank in a GSR block with no problems.

If you stroke a motor, you're making the Rods shorter, which in turn lessens the engines ability to rev higher and freely. The smaller the r/s ratio, the more stress you're putting on the cylinder walls, thus the need for a lower RPM rev limit.

 

Sweet thanks , I follow ya , but from what i heard the LS crank was weaker ..... oh well thanks for the info !
So if i use a stroker crank my rod-stroke ratio decreases ?

I though that if i increase the stroke - the rod length drops , the ratio should work out to close to the same and stock ! Due to the increased stroke compensating for the loss of rod - length !

But strenghtening the cylinder walls with ductile sleeves would allow you to keep a high Rev limit ? isn't this true ?

 

Yes

r/s ratio=
the lenght of the rod / size of the crank

138mm(GSR) / 87.2mm (GSR) = 1.5825

Or

137mm (LS) / 89mm (LS) = 1.5393

Crv is the same as an LS

Very true. The sleaved cylinders can withstand more stress.


[Modified by B18C-EJ1, 2:47 PM 2/16/2002]

 

but what if you added different rods to give it a better r/s ratio so withstand the high revs???..Im talking about the ls crankshaft


[Modified by sa21199, 2:44 AM 2/17/2002]

 

Yo B18C-EJ1 ,

I just did some calculating :-

If I run say a 95 mm stroker crank and I want a r/s ratio of around 1.5 , I 'll need a 140+mm rod .

So to run a rod that length 1 of two things got to happen :-
Heck height has to adder
OR
the piston pins position has to be relocated

IMO this sucks a*s*s ,


Anyhow .......... what is the stroke of an LS crank?
Can you think of anyway that a motor can be stroked and have a good r/s ratio ?

*****Just curious but what is the r/s ratio on say B20-VTEC and LS-VTEC motors ?********

 

137mm (LS) / 89mm (LS) = 1.5393

Crv is the same as an LS

LS/VTEC and CRVTEC are the same as above. You are still using the CRV/LS internals, so all bottom end dimensions remain the same.
As for RPM capabilities, I am running the LS Crank and Eagle LS rods in my B18C1 block and turning 9200 with no problems. Some of the secret to RPM capabilities is how tightly balanced the rotational assembly is...


Jason

 

Thanks Jason ,
much appreciated !

How much more displacement does the LS crank in the GSR block give ?
Did the mod make a noticeable power increase ?

keep the post coming !


[Modified by Short_Shifter, 10:15 AM 2/17/2002]

 

i know that the gridle on the gs-r wont fit the ls crank. but i dont know if you can use the gs-r rods because they are a little longer. it would be cool if you could because of the higher compression. just for thought, the b16b uses a b18 block with really long rods and super domed pistons. this setup has better flow than the b16a. only differece is the rod length really. how does the rod length help? i remember seeing this question on another board but can remember if it was answered.

 

Made the most difference in torque. Not a lot of extra peak power, but a lot in the 5000-8000 range.
As for the girdle, I was able to retain it with the LS crank and Eagle LS rods, in the B18C1 block.
If you use the GS-R rods, your pistons will exit the bore.


Jason

 

Yep, but I'm not running a 85 bore, nor a .75" deck plate.

 

Deck plate :- now that is alot of work ! those Damn things got to be welded on and sh*it !

B18C-EJ1 what setup r u running ?
So the LS crank is a better bet to use rather that the 93/95mm ( really can't remember size ) Eagle Forged crank ?

*** Ok by what i understand , the smaller rod ratio prohibits you from running high RPM ? Ture ? But if you build the motor and it CAN run high RPM will it make power all up there ?***

but i always though that if you build a bottom end that is completely forged and lightened and strengthened in all aspects, the ability to run High RPM will be more likely ! Isn't this true ?

I really would like to build this project , so sorry is i sound persistant , but i would like the most info i can ! So far it seems buildable but to ability not to be able to run high rpm ( bad R/S ratio ) seems to be the biggest setback ............ just need a way to combat this other that adding a deckplate !

Keep the oppinions coming !
thanks guys lets see if we can find a way to work this biaaaatch

 

ttt