hey guys,

i'll be picking up a set of Toda C cams soon for my B18C and was wondering if anyone has had problems running them. i'll have pretty much stock bottom end, but all toda valvetrain. probably going hondata or EMS if i'm lucky. IM and TB are stock; running SRI, Mugen header, Apex'i exhaust.

anyways, do i have to worry about the compression of my motor? can i run the cams without upping my compression?

Thanks for all the advice!!!!

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Mashimaro &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
anyways, do i have to worry about the compression of my motor? can i run the cams without upping my compression?

Thanks for all the advice!!!! </TD></TR></TABLE>

U can run that with your stock compression but most definitely you're going to get the most out of that cams. Those TODA, JUN cams, they all love compression. You will probably gain some if the car is tuned but other than that, id recommend getting a high comp piston...

 

also make sure you use bigger injectors(440cc) or your car will run lean....If you are going to use stock inject for now, turn up the psi.

 

440's will completely drown that motor. Thats ridiculous. I'm not a fan of Toda camshafts, if you reallt want to see the power out of them then I would put some jdm itr pistons in your block. They do make decent power, but they are more of a "bling" factor than anything. Don't expect to drop these in your motor and notice a HUGE increase in power......I think you may be dissapointed. I personally think you boil it down to what your personal goals are and what you have to spend, I can help you out from there immensley but I personally, without knowing you, think it might be a waste of money on your part. Either way, good luck

 

I definitely wouldn't go with 440 injectors at this point in your build up, especially if you're not positive you'll be running sometime of management. Was there a specific reason you chose C spec Toda cams? With your stock compression, you won't realize the full potential of these cams.

 

Your stock injectors should be fine for your setup. In order to fully extract the potential of any high performance cams, you need headwork, high compression pistons, very free flowing I/H/E/TB/IM combo and a good tuning device.
Most ppl would do all the bolt-ons before taking a setup further to engine work, the order is totally up to you.
Personally I would still go with the Toda Cs, simply because they will leave me room for future buildup.

 

one thing about the toda C's is that you might have to notch the rockers so they don't smack into the retainer when vtec engages

 

hey, since you're in vancouver

pm me with your msn. I ran Toda C's in my stock motor and i'll tell you how it was over msn

 

Thanks for the responses guys!

Anyways, i'm getting these cams cuz i found a pretty good price on a used set (so long as it checks out ok) and figured, "why not go toda C instead of B then!"

I use my car for mostly auto-x and possibly a track event this summer. i might even take it down the quarter hoping for a low 14sec pass. Other than that, it's my daily and i would like a bit more power without going turbo (even though the cost will be similar).

I should be fine running the stock GSR injectors rite? i'm guessing i may need an aftermarket IM and TB to maximize flow?

I was told that my comp. is already higher than a USDM GSR motor (i'm running a JDM B18C)..is that true? if so, should i go for thinner headgasket as well, or should i eventually put in some high comp. pistons (ie: toda, CTR, ITR...)?

Thanks for all the help guys, much appreciated.

 

i thought jdm b18c was type r??

 

JDM B18C can be either a ITR engine or GSR engine.

 

hows ur toda headwork feel?.. and tell us how ur toda spec c cams feel and all the good stuff.. i was thinkin about going all toda but i wasn't shore how i would end up

 

Running C's will overcam your motor. You'll most likely still have decent gains, but someone with a less aggressive cam and a stock block with the same "flow mods" will probably be able to hang with you. I'm going to have to agree with whoever said Toda's aren't the best option out there. I've got them, and IMO, for the money, there are better cams out there. I got a killer deal though, which was a deciding factor, as I'm guessing it is with you.

 

raise compression and upgrade IM and TB else you won't get the power the cams can give ya.
What they already said they love high compression.

 

I was running a set of Crower 402's in my ITR when the motor was stock. I had it tuned by P1 Auto in Charlotte NC. I then decided to go for the bigger Toda C's on the same stock motor and tuned it a month later. I lost power all of the way across the board. Toda C's will be too much cam for a stock motor. You can make more power with a smaller cam on a stock motor. Don't just buy them because they are good deal. You can get Skunk2 or Crower cams for less than the Toda's and make more power.

EDIT Here's a Dyno of the Crowers Vs Toda. This is a MUSTANG DYNO that reads very low....

 

I have had toda b and now have spec a and spec c.

The c's have me at 186whp on a baseline tune at 0,0 on the cam gears. Stock itr motor with bolt-ons.

The thing I like about them is the ability to rev to 9500-10k+ with the toda valvetrain.

I am able to maintain power and it doesn't fall as sharply as stock cams.

This is important to me because I can stay in gear and shift at 9500, falling to 7200 and keep pulling hard.

I have no experience with crower cams, so I can't comment on why Brad made more power with them. Different day, different variables, who knows? Perhaps they are better, but I have also seen firsthand crowers breaking in the head and destroying the entire motor. That is not something I am willing to risk. I don't fall into that crowd who says you're "overcamming" a motor. Sure, they're bigger than what you need right now, and yes they're made for higher compression motors. So what? Will they make power when you install and tune them? Yes. Will they make power with higher compression? Yes.

I have no idea what motor you have, and the price point is moot because you're supposedly getting a good deal on them.

I say get them. They hold their value very well as a commodity, so if you should decide to sell them, you can get close to what you paid for them.

+1 for spec c.

I'm biased though, because I'm a toda *****.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Mashimaro &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">hey guys,

i'll be picking up a set of Toda C cams soon for my B18C and was wondering if anyone has had problems running them. i'll have pretty much stock bottom end, but all toda valvetrain. probably going hondata or EMS if i'm lucky. IM and TB are stock; running SRI, Mugen header, Apex'i exhaust.

anyways, do i have to worry about the compression of my motor? can i run the cams without upping my compression?

Thanks for all the advice!!!! </TD></TR></TABLE>

Any long duration cam will make you lose compression.

That is why you need to upgrade to higher compression pistons. Throw CTR pistons in there and it will scream on 93 pump gas. Make sure you tune. If you're putting pistons in don't be a cheap *** and get a decent set of lightweight rods while you're in there.

 

Toda Spec C's are great cams if used properly. They are designed to work on a modified engine runnning 11.5:1 compression or higher. Having a high flow TB, ported intake manifold, and head would ensure the most power out of these cams. We did exactly as mentioned on a B18C and got 38hp to the wheels.
It goes to show how the proper combination of modifications will provide positive results.

 

BLUE LINE; 220.9 HP, 141.7 TQ =JUN 3
RED LINE; 208.3 HP, 141.1 TQ =Type-R
GREEN LINE; 215.2 HP, 135.6 TQ = Toda C



geez look around some guys.

toda C (IMO) over priced, over hyped, and under researched.
have u notice that toda uses 4ag TB's for their itb stacks? and u pay as much as a set from jenvy/hayward, whcih are tons better in every aspect.
for some people its the only way, for others, there are better ways.
i hope the dyno helps your desision some, thats a high whp motor and it still isint takeing advantage of the huge lift and duration nunmbers the C's have.

 

What motor, compression and mods?
Thanks.

 

no clue

ripped it from another thread that was posted like 2 dys ago.

 

Damn, didn't know there are so many ppl from the 604 who post on HT.

If you get the C, expect to throw in some more money to get it tuned in order to get the most out of them. Otherwise it would be a waste IMHO. Anyway, good luck with your purchase and pls keep out updated on how it runs.

PS, should have a 604 HT gathering sometime

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by baxter04 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">What motor, compression and mods?
Thanks.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Motor setup for the dyno above
http://www.importreview.com/re....html

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 97L-esVeeTeg &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Motor setup for the dyno above
http://www.importreview.com/re....html</TD></TR></TABLE>

That set up would be better with an actuall port and polished head, not just reshaped ports for the intake. Also, go to a larger Tb like a 68 or 70mm. I didn't see anywhere what pistons and compression was....VERY IMPORTANT when comapring cams.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by johnzm &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
toda C (IMO) over priced, over hyped, and under researched.
have u notice that toda uses 4ag TB's for their itb stacks?
</TD></TR></TABLE>

Yes I've noticed that Toda uses Toyota TB's, as well as J's Racing, and a number of other companys as well.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by johnzm &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
for some people its the only way, for others, there are better ways.
i hope the dyno helps your desision some, thats a high whp motor and it still isint takeing advantage of the huge lift and duration nunmbers the C's have

....no clue, ripped it from another thread that was posted like 2 dys ago
</TD></TR></TABLE>


I'm not sure how the dyno would help his decision, as you're not even sure of the motor set up.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by johnzm &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
geez look around some guys.

toda C (IMO) over priced, over hyped, and under researched </TD></TR></TABLE>

Price isn't an issue, as he's stated more than once that he's getting them for a low price;

Here's a dyno of a B series motor using the "overhyped" Toda ITB's and "under researched" spec C's. The motor itself is a 2.0, that was only revved a little above 8k due to small injectors that were maxed out.

246/178



You see how just throwing dyno numbers out there doesn't really help very much, unless his set up, or future set up, is going to be anything like the motor you're comparing numbers with?