I dont want any subs or amps in my ride.

 

budget?

 

get some good 6x9, infintys, polks are pretty good ones decent price

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Manolo &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I dont want any subs or amps in my ride.</TD></TR></TABLE>I don't have any subs or amps, I run an Alpine HU and 4 x 6.5" Eclipse, can't say they are the best speakers, but with proper install, they sound great and I get very good bass responce, I have had people tell me I must have an amp and sub hidden someplace, when I demo the system, [I am the install manager for a large electronics retailer, and have been an installer for over 30 years] the way a speaker sounds has a lot to do with the install of the speaker, just by replacing the stock plastic speaker mount with a custom MDF one will give you better bass, [with any speaker] installing the speaker in a proper cabinet will make a huge diff. in bass responce, You don't have to spend a lot of money on speakers but you do have to spend some time installing them to get the best sound out of them. Find an Eclipse dealer and have a listen to them I think you will like them. http://www.eclipse-web.com 94

 

Hey, cool, since we have a professional installer here (fcm), can you give some more advice on how to get the best bass response out of your speaker install? I'm in the same boat as Manolo. I'm really into this project and I'm willing to take every pain and detail to do this right the first time. TIA

Dan

P.S. This is not a thread hijack.

EDIT: Okay, I'm not quite in the same boat as Manolo. I'm amping my speakers with and Eclipse 50x4 RMS EA3422.

 

I'm going to try and save this as a draft or something so I can quote myself, so I don't have to type it up again, not that I mind repeating myself to people who can't find things when searching I have a hard time finding my own stuff when I want, and I still don't know how to "transfer" it hear Maybe someone can tell me how?
Anyway....... The basic rules to follow to get the best "bass" out of your speakers are.
The Daaaaaaaa rule, make sure the speaker you have is capable of going as low as you want it to, [not going to get a lot of bass out of a pr. of 3.5" speakers].
Ok rule one, and it applies to all speaker installs
1- Mount the speaker to an absolutely flat surface, [even a little bending or twisting of the basket can cause problems with cone movement and VC alignment]
Rule two, less important at higher frequencies, but crucial for lower frequencies.
2- Have an absolutely airtight seal between the front and back of the speaker, [one of the reasons you want a flat surface, although it can be hard to do in cars, try and get a seal as far out from the edge of the speaker as you can, a 6.5" speaker should have as a minimum of 6.5 inchs of airtight surface out from the speakers edge, a proper sized speaker cabinet would be the best. Sealing up the holes in the car doors inside skin, at least around the speaker, with Dynamat type matereals is a way to get that seal, and no, DO NOT plug the drain holes on the bottom of your doors, they are air leaks you will want to live with]
Rule three, at high frequencies it really does not apply, but as the frequencies drop the rule comes into play, and at low frequencies it's a must.
3- The more mass the speaker is mounted to the better, [you will get more output out of a speaker that does not move, as it takes a lot of power, to make bass, if you waste power moving the speaker backwards when the speaker cone moves forward, it makes sense that you have to lose something, you know, an action has an opposite and equal reaction, very easy to tell at the lowest frequencies, take two 10" sub, a pr. of any 10" subs, dirt cheap or expensive as hell, install one in a an off the floor pre built box, and to even it out a bit lets say the box is to big so we "use up" the extra space with bracing, so now the box is the proper size for the speaker, we will also run a silicon bead along all the seams so they are airtight, we even spray/paint a sealer on all inside surfaces of the box, again to help with the seal, install the sub with a gasket , now do the same with the other sub but this time you build a box with 1" MDF and use 1.5" MDF baffle, do the bracing and sealing, mount the sub, and see/hear for yourself what mass can do for you.
There is also the Ohhh rule, a speaker mounted to wood will sound better then the same speaker mounted to any other material.
I guarantee, [if you replace the plastic speaker mounts our cars come with, with custom MDF ones, made as big as you can, (mass) cut the proper sized mounting hole in the "absolutly flat" mounting surface that you would have, use a gasket to get a good airtight seal on the speaker, mount that custom MDF speaker mount to a door you have sealed as good as you can, did I mention not to plug the drain holes] you will get as much low frequency response, [bass] as you need out of that speaker 94

 

WOW it worked 94

 

Dude that was awesome! Some stuff though, like having a front baffle the width of your speaker, isn't really possible with stock mounting points.

Okay, now it's time for questions so I'll raise a hand:

WTF is MDF?

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by fcm &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The Daaaaaaaa rule, make sure the speaker you have is capable of going as low as you want it to...</TD></TR></TABLE> What kind of spec low-frequency response do you think is necessary?

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by fcm &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">There is also the Ohhh rule, a speaker mounted to wood will sound better then the same speaker mounted to any other material. </TD></TR></TABLE> Weird. So if I made a wood rear deck for above the back seats, coated it in deadening material and mounted the speakers to it, it would be a big improvement?

Also, would coverting to 6x9 instead of 6.5 in back help out a lot?

Thanks,

-Dan

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by LudemanDan &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Dude that was awesome! Some stuff though, like having a front baffle the width of your speaker, isn't really possible with stock mounting points.

Okay, now it's time for questions so I'll raise a hand:

WTF is MDF?

What kind of spec low-frequency response do you think is necessary?

Weird. So if I made a wood rear deck for above the back seats, coated it in deadening material and mounted the speakers to it, it would be a big improvement?

Also, would coverting to 6x9 instead of 6.5 in back help out a lot?

Thanks,

-Dan</TD></TR></TABLE>Hint..... the baffle does not have to be flat, it can wrap around corners, as on sub box's you don't have a 36" wide and high baffle for a 12" sub, even the sides the back of the box count, infinite baffle = a sealed enclosure with an internal volume bigger then the Vas of the speaker, http://www.the12volt.com Glossary
MDF= Medium Density Fiberboard or the most cost effective good material to make box's with or mount speakers to
What the frequency response of the speakers need to be will depend on how low you want to play them, if you are running a sub in the car you probably don't need a speaker that goes below 75 or 80 Hz as the sub will take care of that, not a biggy most 5.25" or 6.5" components have a frequency response lower then that according to the spec sheets, even a set of JL XR400-CX 4" w/ off board x-overs will go down to 57Hz so say the specs. But if you wanted a set of 4" speakers to go down to 50Hz, the JLs are not the ones for you.
Installing a MDF baffle as big and massive as practical to mount the speakers to will be a great help, sealing things off as much as you can will also help a lot, as for changing to 6x9s, [bigger speakers] anytime you go to a bigger speaker, [properly installed and powered] it's a good bet you will improve bass response. 94