Took the ITR to Hookups to let Chris test the Sparks Racing stainless header against the Hytech header that's on the car. The Sparks header is a tight fit with A/C-some FAL fans would be nice. Peak power with the two headers was comparable, within 1 hp. In the mid range the Sparks header beat the Hytech by a good 14 hp. RPM pick up was problematic, so no torque graph, but the Sparks made about 10 more ft-lbs. of torque at 6,400. Graph:

 

damn those look pretty close.

 

setup and conditions?

 

Damn, sparks header killed the hytech in the midrange

 

b19coupe how would u discribe the quality and fitment of the sparks header compared to the hytech

 

haha..o wow. hytech got owned by the sparks?
that's alotta midrange whp for a lot less money.

good stuff todd

 

Damn thats a decent improvment!
Did you do any tunning changes??

 

to Dave of SMSP for designing a great header

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Innovation &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> to Dave of SMSP for designing a great header</TD></TR></TABLE> lol

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Innovation &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> to Dave of SMSP for designing a great header</TD></TR></TABLE>

SMSP didnt design it . its not his exclusive design.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by project dc2 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

SMSP didnt design it . </TD></TR></TABLE>

Any pictures out there of this design before the date on the pic? Oh, this picture was taken with a VHS-C video recorder and then freeze framed on the computer, so sorry for the quality of the pic.



<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by project dc2 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">its not his exclusive design. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Not anymore, you are right, because I can't count how many times it's been copied in the last 5 years.

 

i thought Hytech was the first to design it.

i mean **** everyone makes the design now a days.

 

How about some pictures of the header and where can you buy them: can you buy them now?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by project dc2 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i thought Hytech was the first to design it.

i mean **** everyone makes the design now a days. </TD></TR></TABLE>

look a little closer to the pairings of the primaries

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ChaseIntegra &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">How about some pictures of the header and where can you buy them: can you buy them now?</TD></TR></TABLE>

http://www.sms-products.com

 

hytech and sms are VERY different designs, but u know i am betting that hytech needs a little bit of a different tune to notice the power of the header


so wheres vtec x over on this motor?

also i notice only 5 pulls done on the engine between header swaps, any AFR curves?

 

nice to know

 

so tell me why does the sparks header hit vtec first??
set both vtec crossover points the same and see what happens

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by hybridvteceg &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">setup and conditions?</TD></TR></TABLE>
Block-sleeved ITR. Stock crank.
IB Wiseco 81.5mm 11:1 pistons.
Stock ITR head.
Something a little different here-Skunk2 Stage2 intake cam, but a Toda C exhaust cam.
Hytech header-Mugen cat back
3" short ram.
78.5 degrees F.--29.66 in-HG.--humidity 44%-- SAE CF 1.03

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by street dreams &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">b19coupe how would u describe the quality and fitment of the sparks header compared to the hytech </TD></TR></TABLE>

Close, I would give the Hytech the edge in quality. The Hytech bolts right up, the Sparks comes much closer to the radiator-the A/C fan had to be removed.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 5thgenallmotor &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Did you do any tuning changes?? </TD></TR></TABLE>

We just made minor tweaks to the A/F after switching headers. It was pretty close with the car tuned for the Hytech.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ChaseIntegra &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">How about some pictures of the header and where can you buy them: can you buy them now?</TD></TR></TABLE>




https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=1251289

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by johnzm &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">so wheres vtec x over on this motor?

also i notice only 5 pulls done on the engine between header swaps, any AFR curves?</TD></TR></TABLE>

VTEC at 6127.
Chris would have to provide the A/F charts, they are on his dyno computer.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Speedz &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">so tell me why does the sparks header hit vtec first??
set both vtec crossover points the same and see what happens</TD></TR></TABLE>

VTEC is at 6127 for both headers-the way the graph climbs earlier with the Sparks is a function of the header dynamics, not VTEC.

Here is the chart with the cursor set right at the VTEC x-over:



I have a question for dynojet experts: how does ramp time affect readings? I lost about 12hp going from R&D to Hookups-playing with the graphs I noticed that my R&D charts are about 4 seconds longer than the Hookups charts:





Modified by b19coupe at 11:47 PM 6/17/2005

 

I'm still skeptical. It looks to me like the Sparks header picked up hp faster in the midrange due to the earlier VTEC engagement. Plus in a NA full race car, the top end of the Hytech was superior from 9000-9500. And once again i see a hook-ups dyno without tq numbers. Ill definately pass on this product.

-Dave

 

it sholdnt matter since the dynos *should* be setup properly, all they do is measure the amount of time it takes to accelerate the roller from one speed to another. but if the dyno's were improperly setup it could be a big difference...

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by EG92 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I'm still skeptical. It looks to me like the Sparks header picked up hp faster in the midrange due to the earlier VTEC engagement. Plus in a NA full race car, the top end of the Hytech was superior from 9000-9500. And once again i see a hook-ups dyno without tq numbers. Ill definately pass on this product.

-Dave</TD></TR></TABLE>

LOL, who ******' cares. and, i thik you meant 90-95 mph, not 9000-9500rpm.


Modified by B16C1 at 10:42 AM 6/18/2005

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by EG92 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I'm still skeptical. It looks to me like the Sparks header picked up hp faster in the midrange due to the earlier VTEC engagement. -Dave</TD></TR></TABLE>

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by b19coupe &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
VTEC at 6127.
.
.
.
VTEC is at 6127 for both headers-the way the graph climbs earlier with the Sparks is a function of the header dynamics, not VTEC.

</TD></TR></TABLE>

Being skeptical is a part of life but at least learn how to read and not let your skepticism be guided based on the assumptions of others.

I could care less about the test but some of you people need to get all the facts before denying someone elses first hand experience.

 

lol-You can't please all of the people, ever. There is little question that Dave's (SMSP) designs work. This header is a copy of one of his designs-I doubt that there is much dispute about that. The graph is posted for information only-people can take it however they want to. I think that with more tuning, the Sparks copy of the SMSP would have made even more power. I would have loved to have had an RMF and more time to tune; the results would have been even more interesting

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Innovation &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> to Dave of SMSP for designing a great header</TD></TR></TABLE>