What would be better, I would deffinately sleeve either of these motors just for the sure sake of reliability, but I am wondering what would be better, turning my b16 into a b17 because I know it can reach higher rpm's or would it be better to go with a b20 vtec? and for both of them, how high would I want to have the compression just to make sure I make a good amount of power?

or does someone have a better idea?

 

b17 or b20...I would recomend the b17 more. If you want to take the motor to high RPM's then make sure you get aftermarket Rod studs. 11:5 compresion is pretty good to get decent ammount of power.
Anything after 11.5:1 would have to be 94 ocatane I belive and that's going to be more tunning for a high compression motor above 11.7+

Reason I'm not recomending the b20 is because they have weak sleeves for when you want to rev high. You can try to get a block guard and that should help out.

 

B17 IMO, is porbably the best motor to have period. THere awesome motors, and if you want to rev high safely then stick with a vtec motor definately. And b20vtec/LSvtec just arentwhat there cracked up to be ive had 3 :/

 

No matter what I do I'm sleeving the block just to make sure it stays strong for a long time.

 

would a b17 turbo set up be pretty good then too, I'm not entirely sure what I want to do quite yet, I might experiment and do a little of both, I just want some raw power and some serious torque.


Modified by Hatchorama at 12:14 PM 5/31/2005

 

but yeah, thanks for the help guys.

 

if your gonna be building it up anyways, get the b20vtec and resleeve it... its easier to make hp w/ more displacement

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Mr.RHTuner &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">b17 or b20...I would recomend the b17 more. If you want to take the motor to high RPM's then make sure you get aftermarket Rod studs. 11:5 compresion is pretty good to get decent ammount of power.
Anything after 11.5:1 would have to be 94 ocatane I belive and that's going to be more tunning for a high compression motor above 11.7+

Reason I'm not recomending the b20 is because they have weak sleeves for when you want to rev high. You can try to get a block guard and that should help out.</TD></TR></TABLE>

no need for upgraded rod bolts on the B17 unless you plan to go well beyond 9k rpms.

You can run more then 11.5:1 without 94 octane. I ran 12.3 in California summer heat with 91 and had no problems.

He plans to resleave, forget the torqueless B17, get the B20. I WILL be must faster in the end.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Hybrid93Eg &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">You can run more then 11.5:1 without 94 octane. I ran 12.3 in California summer heat with 91 and had no problems.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Sorry about that...I've heard so much info on when you shouldn't run 91 octane on what compression, etc...

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Mr.RHTuner &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Sorry about that...I've heard so much info on when you shouldn't run 91 octane on what compression, etc...

</TD></TR></TABLE>

It has a lot to do with tunning. If you just slap in some CTR pistons (I don't recommend this btw) and then run it off a stock ECU, then yeah, you are going to have some issues.

 

I would stick with the B17 and build her like a B16.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Dougie Pants &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I would stick with the B17 and build her like a B16. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Just because the B17 is "rare", everyone in this thread rides it like its a god. I had one. Trust me, displacement will come out the winner in the end. If he plans to sleeve it, then you can all go home with your "weak sleeves" argument. Hands down, the 2.0 will make more power across the WHOLE rpm band. And yes, it will take the 8,000rpm trips just like the B17.

 

I agree with the b20. theres no replacement for displacement especially since hes resleeving it he has no worries

B20

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Hybrid93Eg &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Just because the B17 is "rare", everyone in this thread rides it like its a god. I had one. Trust me, displacement will come out the winner in the end. If he plans to sleeve it, then you can all go home with your "weak sleeves" argument. Hands down, the 2.0 will make more power across the WHOLE rpm band. And yes, it will take the 8,000rpm trips just like the B17.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I'm not saying it is a god by any means. I mean for god sake it is the Joke Engine of the B Series family. Make no power stock and parts are some what hard to get. But if you already have the engine then why not stay with it? That is why I suggested it

 

I dont understand why everyone thinks the b20 sleeves are as brittle as a sheet of ice. My b20vtec has been running 9000-9500rpm's for the last 2 years. And the weak sleves are even bored out .5mm with no block guard. I would go with the b20/vtec the torque is perfect for just driving around.

 

Yeah, I'm going with the B20 vtec, I'll sleeve it, build the internals, eagle rods and je pistons or something and run 10lbs of boost on it too probly, this is my first project and I want to be a mechanic for honda and I'm still in high school, so this is just a learning experience and to whoop some shitsubishi *** at the track.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Dougie Pants &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

I'm not saying it is a god by any means. I mean for god sake it is the Joke Engine of the B Series family. Make no power stock and parts are some what hard to get. But if you already have the engine then why not stay with it? That is why I suggested it</TD></TR></TABLE>

They make plenty of power considering the rediculously low compression ratio they have stock. Parts are not hard to find. Acura sells everything you would need for it. Minus the crank, rods, and pistons, the rest of the parts off a B16 will work just the same for it.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Hybrid93Eg &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">They make plenty of power considering the rediculously low compression ratio they have stock. Parts are not hard to find. Acura sells everything you would need for it. Minus the crank, rods, and pistons, the rest of the parts off a B16 will work just the same for it.</TD></TR></TABLE>

So then why not sleeve it and bore it out to a 84mm, and higher cc forged piston and put forged rods in it. you have a 2.0L and all in the same engine he already has. this saving money in the long run

 

because the b17 doesn't have a 89 mm crank

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Dougie Pants &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

So then why not sleeve it and bore it out to a 84mm, and higher cc forged piston and put forged rods in it. you have a 2.0L and all in the same engine he already has. this saving money in the long run</TD></TR></TABLE>

Sure, it will have the 2.0l displacement, but it will still lack something a B20 has.. STROKE.. You want to make make torque, you need not only bore, but also stroke. Very important.

 

One more thing. If you are already planning on resleeving, just get an LS block. You can get a complete LS shortblock at the local Pick-And-Pull for about $75. And after resleeving, it will be no different from starting with a B20 block.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Hybrid93Eg &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Sure, it will have the 2.0l displacement, but it will still lack something a B20 has.. STROKE.. You want to make make torque, you need not only bore, but also stroke. Very important.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Displacement is the key here. Stroke is not. Having it a 2.0L this way allows to the ability to still rev just as high all of the time if not higher to help make more power. I mean look at how F1 cars are built. You don't always need torque to win the race. After the engine is build it all depends on how you get it to the ground and are able to use it.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Dougie Pants &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Displacement is the key here. Stroke is not. Having it a 2.0L this way allows to the ability to still rev just as high all of the time if not higher to help make more power. I mean look at how F1 cars are built. You don't always need torque to win the race. After the engine is build it all depends on how you get it to the ground and are able to use it.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Why is it that everyone thinks that the B17 will "allow" you to rev higher? Who says you need to rev something to the moon to make power? Fact is the B20 would have a BROADER powerband over an 84mm B17 and would STILL be quicker on the street. We aren't building an F1 engine here, we are building a street engine. You sound like one of those "rod to stroke ratio" bandwagon riders. Remember, a more "ideal" rod to stroke ratio means your powerband is moved that much higher in the rpm range. On the street, this isn't something you want unless you want to be victim of ricer flybys and people who slingshot you in races. This is what makes the LS/Vtec and B20/Vtec's so good on the street. Its harder to be cought outsie of your powerband.

Oh, and you said you don't need torque to win a race. Go and study what horsepower is... Maybe also try to learn what its calculated from. Then you might understand.