im looking for a front sway bar for my 98 hatch which has no holes in the front lower control arms for a sway bar. i hear that suspension techniques makes a front bar for civics without original front bars. i shopped around for both this kit and used oem bars with lcas, and the price is the same for the most part. this means if i go with the suspension techniques bar, it will save me all the work of swapping lcas n all the crap with the ball joints and forks and what not. so im wondering if anyone has had this kit before and what kind of expierience they had with it, quality wise n all that. lemme know guys, thanx

 

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My experience with ST was with their rear sway/tie bar. Totally unrelated but I would still avoid those jerk-offs like the plague. I sent thiss almost a year ago and have had no response, so here ya go. Read on if you care to find out how their product almost killed me...

September 9, 2004
Engineering Department Manager


I am contacting you regarding your 22mm anti sway/tie bar for the ’96-00 Honda Civic. I purchased this product from Stillen in December of 2001. I installed the piece with a friends help on my 2000 Honda Civic Si. I had my brother and father inspect the installation after following all reassembly procedures laid out in your instruction manual using my Haynes manual as a reference.

Recently I ran into a severe problem. My car suffered what I would call a catastrophic failure of the rear sub frame. I identified the problem while checking my air pressure. As you can see in the included photos, the damage is quite extensive. The damage is concentrated to the area covered by the red reinforcing plates. These plates, I imagine, were designed to spread the stress created by the larger anti sway bar to a larger area. What they ultimately did was remove the sheet metal underneath them, almost completely. Understand that the car did not strike any objects. This damage was caused by everyday driving over a 30 month period.


I feel that there are two identifiable flaws in the design of your product:

1. Oversized lower control arm hole. I believe that this hole was left oversized so that the plates could easily accommodate any variance in the geometry of the vast number of cars it was designed to fit. Does not the adjustable center portion address this? This is a problem because it does not provide a static location for the rear end of the lower control arm bolt. This allows the bolt to pivot for the other side within the plate.
2. The plate does not seat up against the sheet metal underneath it. The rear portion of the lower control arm mounting point is concave; the back of the plate is flat. This creates what appears to be a .375” gap. Even when the lower control arm bolts are properly torqued, a gap remains. This means that there is no pressure on the back side of the lower control arm mounting point, thus it can move relatively freely.

These two flaws combined allow the lower control arm to manipulate the back side of the lower control arm mounting point via the lower control arm bolt. This manipulation is compounded by the fact that the bolt supplied in the kit is longer than the stock bolt, thus the forces applied by the lower control arm are even greater.

The failure caused by this was tremendous. On the passenger’s side of my car, the back side of the lower control arm mounting point was completely ripped away. The bolt that is welded to the front side of the mount at the factory was broken free and became loose so much that it was only threaded on by half of its thickness. The driver’s side faired little better. The back side of the lower control arm mounting point was still attached by approximately 1” of metal.

It happens that this damage was in the works for some time but remained unseen up to one month prior to the day I noticed it. The night prior I had driven 200 miles on the freeway. The weekend prior I had driven 1000 miles to California. The next day I was supposed to travel 100 miles though mountainous roads. I am still in shock that I identified this damage by coincidence and I narrowly avoided the unthinkable.

I have since made repairs to my car. These repairs were at a great cost to me and required the efforts of several mechanics and fabricators. Attached are copies of all of the receipts for expenses incurred in the repairs made to my Civic and the additional bracing necessary to safely accommodate your product. Despite getting tremendous discounts on labor and material, the repairs cost me $ 2,124.31 and I was without my vehicle for eight days total.

The solutions that my mechanics and fabricators came up with to address the shortcomings of your product include:

1. Replacing the rear sub frame.
2. Reinforcing the rear sub frame by stitch welding 10 gauge gussets to each side and plates down the middle forming an H structure.
3. Spot welding the new sub frame from both the bottom and top of the car.
4. Stitch welding the new sub frame to unit body rail joints on the left and right most portions of the sub frame.
5. Machining steel sleeves to fill the oversized hole in the plates of the tie bar.
6. These sleeves also allow the lower control arm bolt to apply its torque to the back side of the lower control arm mounting point, just as it is supposed to.
7. Welding in a 1.5” tubular brace that spans the rear unit body rails underneath the trunk.
8. Running adjustable braces that mount between the above mentioned brace and the anti sway bar brackets on your product.
9. Installing a new, smaller muffler that accommodates the additional bracing required.

To say that I am disappointed in your product is an understatement. I feel that you have a moral obligation to correct these flaws and to notify immediately, all consumers that you have sold this product to, that they need to have their vehicles inspected immediately for damage, and to remove your product until a suitable replacement can be had or a refund is issued. As it is, you’re your product is a safety liability for anyone driving or near someone who is driving a car equipped with said product.

I understand the tremendous inconvenience that this would cause, but understand this: Had I gone out on that mountain drive the next day, I might very well be dead. The rear suspension was, literally, one inch away from falling off completely. I look forward to your response.

 

wow..what can i say, but im sorry to hear that, and thatnx for looking out for others. im also not the type to say i told you so, and i guess i cant because i dont know you nor have i ever told you so...but dude...tell me you got a sway bar without doing any sort of reaserch about your suspension. and between you and me...i know how you drive...so that "everyday driving" stuff might work on company people...you cant fool people with the same car. i know you love those turns...im the same way...but i run a progress rear sway, also 22mm. and theres a big difference. overall though, thanx for lookin out. have a good one ..good luck with your car too.

 

No doubt, I don't drive like my parents. However, the car only saw two seasons of Auto-X, which equates to maybe 45 minutes of hard "parking lot driving. The rest was me driving to work, school, home, etc. I do push it but it is nothing beyond what is advertised as within the limits. I am not into street competitions or public endangerment. I have a steep driveway, and I am certain that had an effect, but the flaw is in the design.

Yes I researched, and at the time, the ST was the hot ticket, well the Comptech was too but they "seemed" comparable. I knew of the subframe weaknesses and that is why I went with a braced sway bar. I am really concerned because I keep seeing these cheap ST knock-offs that people think are great (Megan, Invida, etc) they are all garbage and will all fail, give them time.

If you look at how it installs it is obvious. I wish I would have not been so excited when I bought it and followed my "WTF is wrong here?" gut when I was bolting it up. I intalled it anyway and paid the price. They don't seem too interested in the problem, and so they too shall pay the price in bad reviews by me. The car handles great though. Can't complain about that. I just can't see giving them money when there seems to be better products out there (Comptech, ASR). Good luck with your car too.

 

yeah that megan crap is garbage, i got in a dispute with a buncha people here who were sooo loyal to **** companies, and its amazing. id love to roll with comptech but its pretty expensive and i can say im fairly happy with the progress bar i have. the car has also seen many autoX events over the last 2 years and i have no tie bar at all, and the car is perfectly fine. i cant complain really. just still wondering about the front bar from ST. seems like a the only way of having a front sway on a hatchback without having to replace LCAs and forks.

 

One more thing, I am going to stand by my contention that I subjected my Si to everyday driving. Afterall, I posted this on H-T, not Motor Trend. Nobody here drives their car like a Camry and ST cannot expect their customers to do the same. I am passing my experience on to those that have similar driving habits to mine. Thus H-T, ClubSi, etc...

 

ye man, i completely agree, id rather have people like yourself sharing expieriences n stuff, than a buncha idiots supporting rice crap and not know what the hell theyre talking about. so thanx man..i appreciate it.

 

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I have the ST front bar on my 97' EK. Meaning this is the kit that includes brackets to mount the bar when the car is not equiped with a factory sway bar.. I like the kit overall, the directions that came with the kit sucked, but I found better ones on overboost.com.

 

finally..someone that has it...all i want to know is what you think of it...like overall how is the quality and what was your impression...and did handling improve significantly? just any helpful info really...