what would be better for the track. i would think the da but its like 500 pounds more and i dont know if thats enough to make a big notice or not on a car. teg would be boosted with a kit, and the hatch would have a b16a swap. sorry it so noob but in my mind its close and i want to get the better of the 2.

 

the non-boosted car, although boost is cool and all id do without because you WILL have issues and issues suck when you spent 300 dollars for track time and don't get all of it

 

why not get a da ...buy a b16a for 600-700 w/o the tranny and use the da stock tranny which works good for boosted b16a's

i have a 90 da with a b16a1 and it was only 1250 for the motor tranny ecu and it was an easy swap

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by divisionskate &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Total money in the daily driven killer track car fund - $348.24</TD></TR></TABLE>

That being the case, I'd just opt for the cheaper of the two and leave the car stock. Instead of mods, spend money on vehicle maintenance, good brake pads and fluid, and track time.

fast driver &gt; fast car

 

but first you need a car to drive to be a good driver. im barrowing my rents bronco right now and its a pos. soon enough ill have my car, i hope.

 

for tracking, the simpler the better.

i would just get a stock DA/DC/EG/EK and start driving it.

it's nice to have more power, more grip, more everything, but having a stock car on shitty tires is great for the learning curve. after you get some seat time in a stockish car, then you can think about what you want to do with the car, mod wise.

though, i'm sure you're saving money getting a pre-swapped used car, and i guess if you put a gun to my head, i'd take the ef hatch.

 

You're in CA, with a turbo or swap the smog testing is something to think about also.

 

Making boost work on the road course takes a lot more time and money than it does for street or drag. It's a blast once you get it to be reliable and not overheat, but it's far from being a simple matter of installing a bigger radiator. It is high maintenance, high cost, and doesn't make you much faster unless the driver is experienced. It will make an inexperienced driver even more sloppy, which is slow and potentially dangerous.

And if race classing doesn't exclude you entirely, it will put you in a pretty fast class, which requires a lot of time, money, and skill to be competitive.

 

Dude, you got a point there on the racing class ****. kinda answers a lot of questions.

 

skip the turblo and vtak - if you've got high miles on your teg pick up a b20 longblock and swap all of your LS parts.

The tq is very nice to have as is a low mileage dependable motor to run on

 

I have personal experience with both actually. My car is a 99 civic si mildly built naturally aspirated while my friend has a 99 civic si boosted with a greddy kit . Both have similar power but the turbo civic has more torque compared to mine. The turbo one takes alot of effort tuning wise to have it to run at the track without having overheating problems. the powerband isn't that smooth either and can sometimes upset the balance of the car when it spools specially on a turn, I'm not saying all but thats how my friends car was while we were at the track, maybe his car was poorly tuned. So i think your hatch would be a clear choice.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SioneSi &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I have personal experience with both actually. My car is a 99 civic si mildly built naturally aspirated while my friend has a 99 civic si boosted with a greddy kit . Both have similar power but the turbo civic has more torque compared to mine. The turbo one takes alot of effort tuning wise to have it to run at the track without having overheating problems. the powerband isn't that smooth either and can sometimes upset the balance of the car when it spools specially on a turn, I'm not saying all but thats how my friends car was while we were at the track, maybe his car was poorly tuned. So i think your hatch would be a clear choice.</TD></TR></TABLE>

You do have the modulate the throttle more than a NA car, and with more precision, since the power output is going to go up very quickly if you unleash the turbo. I run a small T3 (custom built for road racing) with a good partial and full throttle tune, and it has been very smooth and controllable on the road course. I found myself getting a little sloppy for a lap or two after turning up the boost for the first time, but I mostly just needed to adjust my shifting and braking points.

It can be a handful at an autocross, especially before I had an LSD. It takes some time to get the hang of the throttle modulation, as well as self-control, so it's not something I'd recommend for a novice, but it can work really well once you get used to it. Compared to a car with the same or higher peak HP, the fact that I'm running a lot of torque, low lag, and short gears often gives me a significant advantage... so much that I've been impeded by cars that would totally destroy me in a drag race. There's a lot of value is putting down more power sooner, just like there's a lot of value in having a high corner exit speed.

The problem with a lot of those off the shelf turbo kits is that they include cheap fuel management that is not at all tuned to the car... tuning isn't just for making peak power, it's also vital for reliability and driveability (ie smooth power band and throttle transitions). There are also a lot of people who like to run turbos that are too big for our little Honda engines (kicks in like a nitrous shot), as well as a lot of false information being spread about what's good in a turbo setup and how to tune it. Most people also only tune for full throttle and don't do much for partial throttle. While you don't have to go so far as to test various throttle levels on the dyno with a wideband, you definately should put some work into your partial throttle fuel map. You don't want to be running lean while you are at partial throttle coming out of a turn, because then your engine will be super hot for when you go full throttle down the following straight. We have the least cooling when we're in a turn, so it's not a real good time to be generating a lot of heat. Even if you don't have pre-ignition/detonation problems, heatsoak still kills the performance of a turbo car.

Just my 2 cents / rant...

 

seeing how i just turned 17 and my learning of cars grows by the day, i think ill just get a ef with a b16 and just wait for the power for a while. turbo will come one day but atleast not for a year or two after i get the b16 in. this is probly cus i read up on the whole r/s stuff last night and that kinda killed the whole ls/vtec-ls turbo idea. now im just hoping to find a cheap ef hatch soon so i can start doing the work that doesnt cost a arm and a leg, getting the thing clean.

 

I'd get the b16 and save up.