For the last 6 months I've been researching the possibility of replacing my USDM shafts with TODA, JUN or JDM ones in my 98ITR.
I know that TODA and JUN will give me more horsepower at the top-end but will loose power on the low-end and I've heard that JDM will give me a little horsepower on the low-end but have no changes to the top-end.
With this in mind I would like to hear what everyone knows or thinks would be a better investment. I like to drive fast, and I will, but have not gone to the track. Since it is my everyday mode of transportation I would like to have the power in the low-end, considering I do not and may not have a chance to rev to 9000RPM on the streets.
I've read somewhere before where aftermarket shafts were installed and that there was a loss of power in the low-end, but it also mentioned that the power was regained after adjusting the AFC.

How much truth is there in that?
If I install TODA or JUN cams can I get the best of both worlds?
and finally
What is the hp gain between USDM and JDM cams?

Any thoughts?

 

I thought the JDM and USDM ITR cams are the same!?

 

Get a jun 2 intake cam... Search for details

 

I am have not looked into the details of USDM vs JDM but I have been told that they are sligthly different and that JDM will give me more power.

 

The cams Found IN the CTR have 3 deg more duration than the 97-98 spec ITR cams, however there is some debate over the fast the the 00-01 cams are the same as the CTR cams, Get a JUN 2 intake cam, and leave the stock ITR exhaust alone, you will be happy for the street

 

How come I don't need to get the exhaust cam?
Not even if I have ported JDM headers?

 

you will be fine

 

you should get the JUN2 exhaust cam as well as a better header.

 

This is a dyno plot Tody b compared to stock cams:


So where is the loss at low end ?

 

Ok, I'll help you out with my very limited knowledge based on experience and observation:

toda and jun cams will give you gains up top as well as down low. No loss anywhere in the rpm band, and gains in the rpm band depending on which profile cam you run... This is provided you install at the very least an upgraded header, exhaust, cam gears, and a fuel controller. Don't expect any gains without tuning.....



This regaining of power is because of tuning. Are you sure you want cams? Maybe a more agressive final drive or a supercharger are in order for you - it sounds like you just want more low-end torque, which is severely lacking in most honda motors.....



The difference between the jdm itr, usdm itr, and jdm ctr cams (depending on year) aren't worth the trouble of swapping.....

Is the best of both worlds possible? Yes. And now I must give you the mandatory "do a search."

 

I was supposed to lose power in the low end with Spec B's? Hmm. Mine must be defective

 

Ditto, I gained almost 25 wheel hp before VTEC on a dyno with the B's. Hmm...

 

oh yeah, Maijk can you give us more info on what happened with that dyno plot?

What changes were made (assuming same motor)? I like the gains!

 

I saw a dyno plot at importreview.com that compares JUN, TODA and TYPE R.
This graph shows great gains top-end, but obviously not for the TYPE-R. But around 5K to 6K the TYPE-R has more power. I see that this car has alot of bolt ons, which would probably show up differently on a stock R, but it was the only data I had to go by, until now.

Will I need to get the springs and retainers, is it recommended or neccessary?

 

Depends on how high you want to rev. I ran he spec B’s on my 98 R and beat the snot out of it, revving to 8900 all day long. I was using the stock valve train. When I first had the cams, Toda (AKH Trading actually) said that you didn’t need a new valve train if you had Type-R springs and retainers. Now, all of the sudden, I go to their website and they are recommending an upgrade on anything above the spec A’s. One thing I have to say about AKH is that they are constantly changing their minds. Every single time I would call and talk to those guys down there they would tell me something different. I still liked the spec B’s though. A word of advice on them though, send your head to Portflow, and raise that compression too. You have to if you want to make any power.

 

As far as I can recall, Toda has *always* recommended new springs and retainers for all their cams but Spec A's. But you can run B's with the stock valvetrain, as long as you don't plan on upping the rev limiter. Mine have been fine for 6k miles now on the stock valvetrain

*Note - I'd still recommend upgrading the valvetrain with B's, but I'm a cheap bastid

 

Last year I asked Toda exactly this question:
"Can I run Toda b`s if I do not plan to raise the redline ?"

The answer: "No. If you`re running B`s you must do a valvetrain upgrade"

The reason: "The small lobe is much bigger than the stockcams which puts more stress on the valvetrain, no matter how high you plan to rev."

 

Crap. Guess my car doesn't run anymore.

*Note - Again, it's a GOOD IDEA to upgrade the valvetrain for B's, but you do not have to.

 

Just posting what I was told by akh-trading

 

I was told a wide variety of things by AKH Trading. It was almost as if I was learning with them. And yes, the website has changed in regard to upgrading your valve train with the use of Spec B's. I have an old printout on file at home from about the time I bought mine.

 

I saw a dyno plot at importreview.com that compares JUN, TODA and TYPE R.
This graph shows great gains top-end, but obviously not for the TYPE-R. But around 5K to 6K the TYPE-R has more power. I see that this car has alot of bolt ons, which would probably show up differently on a stock R, but it was the only data I had to go by, until now.

Will I need to get the springs and retainers, is it recommended or neccessary?

 

Will I pass Smog check with Toda B's and or Jun II?

 

1. importreview's dyno is of ls/vtec and 2.0l vtec motors. Definitely not numbers you'll see on a b18c or b18c5... In every motor I've seen with pretty much stock block, the jun 3's made more peak but the spec b's made more midrange. Both did as well or better than the stock itr cams across the board. I'm guessing Jeff tuned for highest peak #'s with each set of cams on his dyno. Trade-off's, y'know? I gained both peak and midrange on my spec b's.....

2. Yes, with spec b or c you'll need to upgrade valve springs and you might as well go with Ti retainers while you're at it. Same goes for jun 2 or 3, and skunk 2 or 3...

3. Yes, you can pass emissions with spec b's, c's, jun 2 or 3's... Obviously, you'll have to detune your car and run a cat to pass, but then plug in your old settings and you're good to go again.

 

cat?

 

Shove a cat in your exhaust and you'll pass. Only the black and white ones though. Must weigh at least 10 pounds.
Seriously: Cat = Catalytic Converter