Hey Guys,
I'm going to be buying a car at the start of the summer and I wanted your input. I'm going to be doing the NASA HPDE program this summer and some other track days hopefully. I've been into hondas for a long time so naturally I've been looking around for a CRX of some sort with not a lot of engine mods but some decent suspension stuff but I've been looking at a few other cars too.

My only other choice really would be a neon, a 95-98 one to be specific. I would look around for a nice used DOHC neon which can be had for less than 1500 in really good mechanical shape. I would then build it up like a spec neon car and do some track racing with it. Mods for neons arent that extensive but spec neon is pretty retrictive so its all good.

One of the things I'm taking into account is that a neon would prob be more comfortable than most of the CRXs I could find meaning its most likely their not going to have AC which is really important to me since im gonna be driving around south carolina. Any imput would be greatly appreciated, especially if you have driven a spec neon prepared car and a nicely modded CRX. Thanks a lot guys.
Matt

 

Are you asking a question? I can't really find one in your post. Not sure what input you're looking for. I have an '88 CRX. It's fun and cheap. I don't have any experience with Neons on track or SN, but if you're looking for a street car that you can eventually turn into a race car you won't go wrong with a CRX. It's a fun HPDE car and I would think a fun street car. FWIW - I drove my friend's (then new) neon back in like '96 or something (I had a '91 prelude at the time) and I didn't think it was anywhere near as fun as my prelude.

 

I'm currently working my way through the NASA schooling system. I drive a 1990 CRX Si... i have ricer bolt ons like intake and exhaust... but you dont need to worry about that to start (hell you dont even need it)... I ran all events with a stock D16A6 with intake exahust... Azenis for tires (14 inch on factory wheels) and Carbotech XP9 brake pads. Thats it. Thats all you need to go out and really get the education... brakes and good tires, not the best tires mind you... just good ones.

 

The Neon is a good choice for a "disposable" car - cheap to buy, most reliability issues are well documented (head gasket), and they are fairly peppy. Catch has one that he and his family use for STS autocrossing. AFAIK, they haven't done any in-depth development of the car, but still manage to clean up at local events.

I'd look for a first-gen ACR. The ACR sedan has the SOHC, the coupe has the DOHC. In stock form, the engines perform pretty similarly. The ACR gets you a usable 5th gear, Koni shocks (except the first year, which had Alvins, IIRC), and adjsutable camber.

The R/T trim has most of the ACR goodies, is nicely trimmed out for daily use, but weighs more and costs more. DOHC was also available in the R/T sedan.

http://www.neons.org has a good FAQ with the differences between trim levels and years. The forum is ok - much like HT.com - some of the autocrossers/HPDE guys know what they're doing, but most of the rest of the forum is hit or miss.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by FlyZlow &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Are you asking a question?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Not so much a question, I'm just loking for input from you guys about thich car you would recommend. At this point I'm looking for a rex but I just want to make sure I'm going to be happy with the choice later on. Thanks for the advice so far.

I've been on neons.org a lot lately and another thing im not a big fan of with the neons is how liable the 1 gen rotors are to crack when a lot of heat is put in them.

 

I think either car is a good choice. As you've mentioned, the neon may turn out to be a better value.

Finding a CRX in good shape that hasn't been bastardized can be quite difficult. My advice would be to avoid the temptation to dump a bunch of money into either car. There is plenty to learn in either of them relatively, or completely, stock.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by madhatter07 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I've been on neons.org a lot lately and another thing im not a big fan of with the neons is how liable the 1 gen rotors are to crack when a lot of heat is put in them.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I had that problem with my Spec RX-7.

But the solution was pretty simple..
- Always use high qualify rotors, Brembo etc. The generic brand stuff always cracked faster. Some people swore by the cryo-treated rotors, I never bothered.
- Always take full advantage of the cool-down lap. Don't use the brakes at all. If you don't get a good cool-down lap, then do a lap or two around the paddock or access roads.
- After the car sits a few minutes, roll it forward or back a few inches - stop one part of rotor staying hot (under the pad/caliper) while the rest cools.
- Make sure you have ducting in place - and aimed properly.

Also, making sure you have good braking technique can help a lot - no dragging the brakes at all, make sure you get on them hard, then off again as soon as possible to maximize cooling time during lapping.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by JeffS &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">As you've mentioned, the neon may turn out to be a better value.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

Not doubt in my mind of this. The Neon not only costs less, but is potentially five years newer. Less rust, less major parts needing replaced, interior is likely in better condition, etc.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by JeffS &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Finding a CRX in good shape that hasn't been bastardized can be quite difficult. My advice would be to avoid the temptation to dump a bunch of money into either car. There is plenty to learn in either of them relatively, or completely, stock. </TD></TR></TABLE>

My plan was to do only bolt on and then concentrate just on the suspension and braking peices of the car, I think in the long run it will help make me a better driver if i learn how to carry speed and not rely on the engine to pull me out.

And crack monkey thank you for your advice on the brakes, I'll do that anyway no matter what car I end up with, it's always better safe than sorry. I'll do a search for brake ducting now.

There may be a CRX im really interested in for sale so I'll post up some pics when i get them. Really good advice so far guys

 

The other thing to consider is packing a CRX - will four tires, tools, tent, etc fit? When I drie my RX-7 to/from events, I had to use a roof rack for the spare tires, and the hatch area and passenger seat were full. For my current Miata, I bought a small utility trailer for wheels and tools. A Neon probably has more space for packing stuff and might even leave the passneger seat free.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Crack Monkey &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The other thing to consider is packing a CRX - will four tires, tools, tent, etc fit? When I drie my RX-7 to/from events, I had to use a roof rack for the spare tires, and the hatch area and passenger seat were full. For my current Miata, I bought a small utility trailer for wheels and tools. A Neon probably has more space for packing stuff and might even leave the passneger seat free.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I would say this depends on if he is going to have a roll bar/cage in the car. If it does not have one, I can tell you the CRX can hold a ton of stuff. I use to put 4 tires lined up across the rear hatch and had enough room for jack, tools, equip, clothes for a weekend trip. All this while having a passenger as well. The car is amazing how much it can hold.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Crosser &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I would say this depends on if he is going to have a roll bar/cage in the car. If it does not have one, I can tell you the CRX can hold a ton of stuff. I use to put 4 tires lined up across the rear hatch and had enough room for jack, tools, equip, clothes for a weekend trip. All this while having a passenger as well. The car is amazing how much it can hold.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Yeah, I knew it was cavernous back there, wasn't sure if the rollbar took enough width out to make 4 tires across impossible. When I had the RX-7, I always carried 6 wheels, so there was not way to get them all in the hatch (5 on roof, 1 in hatch).

 

I FlyZlow, what trim was your friend's Neon? It makes a huge difference. The ACR wasn't just a set of Konis... they also threw in a bigger front bar, a rear bar, stiffer front springs, and a steering rack with about 2.8 turns lock to lock versus 3.2 or so for the standard Neon. The R/T and '95-'96 Sport Coupe got all those parts, save the Konis, as well. I had a '95 Sport Coupe and it was quite the handler when the suspension was actually in good shape.

The suspension/chassis aftermarket isn't big, but what you need is still out there.. and dirt cheap. Mopar Performance's "high rate" springs cost less than any aftermarket supplier. Same with their 22mm rear bar.

The car's major weakness in track use are the front hubs. ACRs came with slightly thicker hubs, and there's a way to use the heavier hubs and spindles from a Shadow/Sundance. Both upgrades are legal (actually, required) for Spec Neon.

The second biggest weakness is front suspension travel, but there's not much you can do there for SN. SN specifies the softer of the two sets of Mopar springs and the stock front swaybar as well as OTS Konis so... learn to love your bumpstops.

As a daily driver, it's more comfortable than people give credit. I don't comment on noise since most of us are used to loud gutted cars, but the headlights do suck the big one. The HVAC is typically overbuilt as you'd expect from an American car; the A/C is Nunavut in January cold. Most ACRs don't have it, though, so if A/C is a priority, buy an R/T.

The headgasket issue only affects early '98 and older cars. Many of them have been fixed already... look for tabs with rivets through them poking out from between the head and block in between the intake runners, that's the newer steel gasket.

 

I actually found an ACR with AC thats not too far away from me. What does the car sound like it it a cheap american buzz? I know CRXs arent exactly luxury cars but i think their plenty comfortable.

 

The stock intake is what makes it sound buzzy. The Iceman intake is the de facto standard for making bolt-on power with the Neon motor. Avoid the AEM and any other intake that puts the filter behind the engine... they do nothing. There's also some way to rig the intake tubing from a 3.0L V6 Dodge minivan into a decent cold air setup. Seriously. Search for "3.0 intake" on neons.org.

Mostly what I meant by noise is the considerable wind noise from the frameless glass, especially on pre-'97 cars which had an inferior weatherstrip design. Neons also don't have much insulating tar... a good thing in my book.

The stock exhaust is actually an excellent piece of work for performance. It's 2.25" stainless with smooth bends, no resonator, and a big free-flowing muffler. Unless you're modifying the engine beyond ITA/SN spec, the only reason to change the muffler would be to drop weight as it is somewhat heavy.