Ground-control/Koni setup help
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Joined: Sep 2001
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From: VanCity, BC, Canada
Ground-control/Koni setup help
Hey,
I've read alot of the topics and searched most of your posts about the GC/Koni combo setup.
Now, i've been researching into full coilovers and something for my 98 Integra for a while now. I've ran TEIN HA's in the past and H&R full roadrace special coilovers as well.
I'm in the market for another suspension setup for my car again and wanted to make sure that i'm making the right decision first.
So here goes:
My car has been a project car for a long time, and this time, I want to do things right so that I don't have to fix things. I live in Vancouver, BC, Canada and daily drive my car all year round.
I plan to drop in a built B18C motor into the car in a couple of months to go along with alot of other goodies as well.
Now, i've autoX'd in the past and plan to start up again and hopefully hit the track and road race as well.
So here's what I want:
-something that won't seize up and rust on me, has to make it thru winters and salt, the elements, etc....
-something that won't be too crazzzzy stiff that i'll hate daily driving my car
Right now I have a JDM ITR 23mm rear sway bar with a custom reinforcement kits and bushings, front upper strut bar, rear upper strut bar, c pillar bar, and i'm planning to put in a rollcage as well.
What GC setup would you suggest that I run with? I was looking at their site and i'm not sure which would be better. The GC coilover kit made for Koni shocks, so that it'll mount on the Koni perches. Or the GC roadrace coilover kit. As well, what spring rates do you suggest? I have ran 12k 10k with the TEIN HA's that I had, and 16k 14k with the H&R roadrace coilovers.
Now onto the Koni shocks, should I just pick up a set of the Koni Yellows? Or should I get revalved ones done? And how well are the adjustments on the Koni's for daily driving and switching to adjust it firmer for track use?
I'm sorry for all the questions, just wanted some last minute input before I make my purchase and buy my suspension setup.
Thanks
I've read alot of the topics and searched most of your posts about the GC/Koni combo setup.
Now, i've been researching into full coilovers and something for my 98 Integra for a while now. I've ran TEIN HA's in the past and H&R full roadrace special coilovers as well.
I'm in the market for another suspension setup for my car again and wanted to make sure that i'm making the right decision first.
So here goes:
My car has been a project car for a long time, and this time, I want to do things right so that I don't have to fix things. I live in Vancouver, BC, Canada and daily drive my car all year round.
I plan to drop in a built B18C motor into the car in a couple of months to go along with alot of other goodies as well.
Now, i've autoX'd in the past and plan to start up again and hopefully hit the track and road race as well.
So here's what I want:
-something that won't seize up and rust on me, has to make it thru winters and salt, the elements, etc....
-something that won't be too crazzzzy stiff that i'll hate daily driving my car
Right now I have a JDM ITR 23mm rear sway bar with a custom reinforcement kits and bushings, front upper strut bar, rear upper strut bar, c pillar bar, and i'm planning to put in a rollcage as well.
What GC setup would you suggest that I run with? I was looking at their site and i'm not sure which would be better. The GC coilover kit made for Koni shocks, so that it'll mount on the Koni perches. Or the GC roadrace coilover kit. As well, what spring rates do you suggest? I have ran 12k 10k with the TEIN HA's that I had, and 16k 14k with the H&R roadrace coilovers.
Now onto the Koni shocks, should I just pick up a set of the Koni Yellows? Or should I get revalved ones done? And how well are the adjustments on the Koni's for daily driving and switching to adjust it firmer for track use?
I'm sorry for all the questions, just wanted some last minute input before I make my purchase and buy my suspension setup.
Thanks
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Joined: Mar 2000
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From: Lancaster, PA, USA
Re: Ground-control/Koni setup help (Integra_B18B)
I know you are not going to like this but...
Going with coilovers and then running them through salt and snow is just a waste of money. Sooner or later they will seize and become non-adjustable. Like other race parts (expensive brake fluid and race brake pads come to mind), coilovers require extra maintenance and care, do not stand up to the rigors of daily driving as well as stock parts, and involve some comfort and/or drivability compromises.
I suggest Koni Yellows OTS and ITR stock springs. The stock ITR springs are low low maintenance and give you a 1" drop as well as nice spring rates for the street and track. You can do this suspension for under $900 US and it will last forever.
regards,
Alan
Going with coilovers and then running them through salt and snow is just a waste of money. Sooner or later they will seize and become non-adjustable. Like other race parts (expensive brake fluid and race brake pads come to mind), coilovers require extra maintenance and care, do not stand up to the rigors of daily driving as well as stock parts, and involve some comfort and/or drivability compromises.
I suggest Koni Yellows OTS and ITR stock springs. The stock ITR springs are low low maintenance and give you a 1" drop as well as nice spring rates for the street and track. You can do this suspension for under $900 US and it will last forever.
regards,
Alan
be professional
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 14,842
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From: Pittsburgh, PA
Re: Ground-control/Koni setup help (00R101)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 00R101 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Going with coilovers and then running them through salt and snow is just a waste of money. Sooner or later they will seize and become non-adjustable.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Unless you get a set of these: http://www.kwsuspension.com
Unless you get a set of these: http://www.kwsuspension.com
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 2,472
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From: HP, NC, USA
Re: Ground-control/Koni setup help (00R101)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 00R101 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
I suggest Koni Yellows OTS and ITR stock springs. The stock ITR springs are low low maintenance and give you a 1" drop as well as nice spring rates for the street and track. You can do this suspension for under $900 US and it will last forever.</TD></TR></TABLE>
That's good advice...I second that. I ran a stock ITR spring/Koni yellow set up for a while and thought is was perfect for agressive street driving. When I started tracking the car on road race circuits, I went with a GC kit and 400/500 springs. That set up was a very good street/track compromise. In live in NC, so corrosion was not a concern.
I suggest Koni Yellows OTS and ITR stock springs. The stock ITR springs are low low maintenance and give you a 1" drop as well as nice spring rates for the street and track. You can do this suspension for under $900 US and it will last forever.</TD></TR></TABLE>
That's good advice...I second that. I ran a stock ITR spring/Koni yellow set up for a while and thought is was perfect for agressive street driving. When I started tracking the car on road race circuits, I went with a GC kit and 400/500 springs. That set up was a very good street/track compromise. In live in NC, so corrosion was not a concern.
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Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 96,311
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From: Siege Perilous
Re: Ground-control/Koni setup help (Track rat)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Track rat »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
When I started tracking the car on road race circuits, I went with a GC kit and 400/500 springs. That set up was a very good street/track compromise. </TD></TR></TABLE>
I drove an ITR w/Koni Yellow and 400/500 GC for quite a while on the street. I agree that it's a decent compromise for a daily driver that's on the track quite a bit.
500# is also about the most you can put on OEM Koni Yellow w/out having to think about revalving or moving on to their racing shocks.
I'm on revalved Koni and 500 F / 750 R right now and it's a little tough on the public roads.
Scott Lear drives around with 1000# on the rear. No idea how he does that.
When I started tracking the car on road race circuits, I went with a GC kit and 400/500 springs. That set up was a very good street/track compromise. </TD></TR></TABLE>
I drove an ITR w/Koni Yellow and 400/500 GC for quite a while on the street. I agree that it's a decent compromise for a daily driver that's on the track quite a bit.
500# is also about the most you can put on OEM Koni Yellow w/out having to think about revalving or moving on to their racing shocks.
I'm on revalved Koni and 500 F / 750 R right now and it's a little tough on the public roads.
Scott Lear drives around with 1000# on the rear. No idea how he does that.
HT White Ops
Joined: Apr 2004
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From: Rochester, MN, US
Re: Ground-control/Koni setup help (George Knighton)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by George Knighton »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Scott Lear drives around with 1000# on the rear. No idea how he does that.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Must a masochist.
Must a masochist.
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From: US
Re: Ground-control/Koni setup help (Integra_B18B)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Integra_B18B »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
-something that won't seize up and rust on me, has to make it thru winters and salt, the elements, etc....
-something that won't be too crazzzzy stiff that i'll hate daily driving my car
Right now I have a JDM ITR 23mm rear sway bar with a custom reinforcement kits and bushings, front upper strut bar, rear upper strut bar, c pillar bar, and i'm planning to put in a rollcage as well.
Now onto the Koni shocks, should I just pick up a set of the Koni Yellows? Or should I get revalved ones done? And how well are the adjustments on the Koni's for daily driving and switching to adjust it firmer for track use?
</TD></TR></TABLE>
I've put the Koni/GC combo through three Chicago winters coupled with rarely washing the car, and haven't had any problems with corrosion/rust at all. I've been running 400f/450 rear the whole time, and while it can be a pain on very rough roads, it handles great on the streets and at the track. Gravels/dirt roads I tend to avoid.
Oversteer doesn't happen unless I want it to, and when it does it is easily controlled. Change the shock setting bias to the rear for the track, and the car rotates on demand.
The only possible issue I've come across with the rear bias setup is the front end's tendency to dive more under heavy (ex: from 105-55 mph at Gingerman T11) braking (feels like it causes the weight transfer time to dwell longer... I can't find the words to articulate it properly...)
Anyhow, the Koni/GC combo can hold up to just about anything you throw at it. I've abused this setup quite a bit and have no issues.
-something that won't seize up and rust on me, has to make it thru winters and salt, the elements, etc....
-something that won't be too crazzzzy stiff that i'll hate daily driving my car
Right now I have a JDM ITR 23mm rear sway bar with a custom reinforcement kits and bushings, front upper strut bar, rear upper strut bar, c pillar bar, and i'm planning to put in a rollcage as well.
Now onto the Koni shocks, should I just pick up a set of the Koni Yellows? Or should I get revalved ones done? And how well are the adjustments on the Koni's for daily driving and switching to adjust it firmer for track use?
</TD></TR></TABLE>
I've put the Koni/GC combo through three Chicago winters coupled with rarely washing the car, and haven't had any problems with corrosion/rust at all. I've been running 400f/450 rear the whole time, and while it can be a pain on very rough roads, it handles great on the streets and at the track. Gravels/dirt roads I tend to avoid.
Oversteer doesn't happen unless I want it to, and when it does it is easily controlled. Change the shock setting bias to the rear for the track, and the car rotates on demand.
The only possible issue I've come across with the rear bias setup is the front end's tendency to dive more under heavy (ex: from 105-55 mph at Gingerman T11) braking (feels like it causes the weight transfer time to dwell longer... I can't find the words to articulate it properly...)
Anyhow, the Koni/GC combo can hold up to just about anything you throw at it. I've abused this setup quite a bit and have no issues.
Joined: Dec 2001
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From: HP, NC, USA
Re: Ground-control/Koni setup help (artifex)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by artifex »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The only possible issue I've come across with the rear bias setup is the front end's tendency to dive more under heavy (ex: from 105-55 mph at Gingerman T11) braking (feels like it causes the weight transfer time to dwell longer... I can't find the words to articulate it properly...)</TD></TR></TABLE>
I noticed the same issue with my old Koni 400/500 setup; I even rug-burned a low clearance header on the pavement under braking . Once I committed my ITR to track-only use and went to 700/1100 the dive is virtually gone. Of course, those rates are not real streetable.
I noticed the same issue with my old Koni 400/500 setup; I even rug-burned a low clearance header on the pavement under braking
. Once I committed my ITR to track-only use and went to 700/1100 the dive is virtually gone. Of course, those rates are not real streetable.
Thread Starter
New User
Joined: Sep 2001
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From: VanCity, BC, Canada
Re: Ground-control/Koni setup help (artifex)
THANKS for all your input and posts!!!
With the maintenance for the GC coilovers, its not like i'm not gonna clean them and make sure they are clean after winter use.
I've been really debating with the difference between a GC/Koni combo and going with a full out coilover.
It seems like going with the GC/Koni combo would be better for me.
Now, any suggestions on what spring rates I should pick up? I noticed alot of people going with the 400/500 setup. But i've adjusted my driving style and with my other suspension mods, I already get a little oversteer. So I was thinking about going with a 500/400 or a 500/450 setup. What do you guys think?
As well, what Koni's should I be picking up? George Knighton said that he thinks if you go higher than 500 that you should get revalved Koni's. Can you buy already revalved Koni's to the specs that you want? And what are the Koni race shocks?
Sorry about all the questions again!
With the maintenance for the GC coilovers, its not like i'm not gonna clean them and make sure they are clean after winter use.
I've been really debating with the difference between a GC/Koni combo and going with a full out coilover.
It seems like going with the GC/Koni combo would be better for me.
Now, any suggestions on what spring rates I should pick up? I noticed alot of people going with the 400/500 setup. But i've adjusted my driving style and with my other suspension mods, I already get a little oversteer. So I was thinking about going with a 500/400 or a 500/450 setup. What do you guys think?
As well, what Koni's should I be picking up? George Knighton said that he thinks if you go higher than 500 that you should get revalved Koni's. Can you buy already revalved Koni's to the specs that you want? And what are the Koni race shocks?
Sorry about all the questions again!
Re: Ground-control/Koni setup help (Integra_B18B)
I ran my old GC coilovers for several years. Once I bought Koni's, I ordered a set of the Koni specific coils. Upon swaping out the old kit for the new, I washed off the dirty old ones. They looked just as good as new, and my wife couldn't tell the difference. Granted I live in Las Vegas, and we don't have much rain or snow...
As for the koni's, you can't beat a life time warranty...
As for the koni's, you can't beat a life time warranty...
Joined: Dec 2001
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From: HP, NC, USA
Re: Ground-control/Koni setup help (Integra_B18B)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Integra_B18B »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">So I was thinking about going with a 500/400 or a 500/450 setup.
George Knighton said that he thinks if you go higher than 500 that you should get revalved Koni's. Can you buy already revalved Koni's to the specs that you want?
</TD></TR></TABLE>
If you buy 400/500 it is a pretty universal set up that many on this board have had good results with. Or, you can swap them 500/400 to suit your style.
Yes, geneally speaking, anything over 550 - 600 on an off-the-shelf Koni requires a re-valve. Koni will will do custom re-valves for a fee, $100 - 150 per shock, I think?
George Knighton said that he thinks if you go higher than 500 that you should get revalved Koni's. Can you buy already revalved Koni's to the specs that you want?
</TD></TR></TABLE>
If you buy 400/500 it is a pretty universal set up that many on this board have had good results with. Or, you can swap them 500/400 to suit your style.
Yes, geneally speaking, anything over 550 - 600 on an off-the-shelf Koni requires a re-valve. Koni will will do custom re-valves for a fee, $100 - 150 per shock, I think?
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From: VanCity, BC, Canada
Re: Ground-control/Koni setup help (Track rat)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Track rat »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
If you buy 400/500 it is a pretty universal set up that many on this board have had good results with. Or, you can swap them 500/400 to suit your style.
Yes, geneally speaking, anything over 550 - 600 on an off-the-shelf Koni requires a re-valve. Koni will will do custom re-valves for a fee, $100 - 150 per shock, I think?
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Yah, i've noticed that most ppl on the board run the 400/500 setup. I'm curious though, what would it be like if i ran equal rates f&r. For example, running 400/400 or 500/500.
Hmmmmm, maybe I should get them revalved and run higher spring rates? Decisions decisions..........
Thanks again for your input!
If you buy 400/500 it is a pretty universal set up that many on this board have had good results with. Or, you can swap them 500/400 to suit your style.
Yes, geneally speaking, anything over 550 - 600 on an off-the-shelf Koni requires a re-valve. Koni will will do custom re-valves for a fee, $100 - 150 per shock, I think?
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Yah, i've noticed that most ppl on the board run the 400/500 setup. I'm curious though, what would it be like if i ran equal rates f&r. For example, running 400/400 or 500/500.
Hmmmmm, maybe I should get them revalved and run higher spring rates? Decisions decisions..........
Thanks again for your input!
Joined: Dec 2001
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From: HP, NC, USA
Re: Ground-control/Koni setup help (Integra_B18B)
The higher rear rates promote a little oversteer (loose) which helps deal with the front wheel drive (FWD) tendency to understeer (push). The 400/500 set up, with proper driver input, will not be an overly tail-happy car. It still pushes, but less than stock. Equal front/rear rates might work well with auto-x but would likely promote too much understeer to be effective on a road course.
If you plan on running a street/track setup for a couple of years, It's hard to beat Koni/GC 400/500. If you want to go hard core track-only later on, you can revalve and go up on the rates. If you go higher than 400/500 now, you may get tired of street driving a car with truck springs!
If you plan on running a street/track setup for a couple of years, It's hard to beat Koni/GC 400/500. If you want to go hard core track-only later on, you can revalve and go up on the rates. If you go higher than 400/500 now, you may get tired of street driving a car with truck springs!
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From: chicago, il, usa
Re: Ground-control/Koni setup help (Integra_B18B)
when i spoke with crx lee he said the ots yellows can handle near 1000lbs without needing to be revalved (dunno how long they'll last though)...maybe i'm remembering it wrong but i'm sure he can chime in
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From: Playing in the sandbox
Re: Ground-control/Koni setup help (azian21485)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by azian21485 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">when i spoke with crx lee he said the ots yellows can handle near 1000lbs without needing to be revalved (dunno how long they'll last though)...maybe i'm remembering it wrong but i'm sure he can chime in</TD></TR></TABLE>
OTS Koni's can handle any spring rate you throw at them... as long as the car is never driven
Christian, who thinks his Koni's are nearing the upper limit of damping with 500# springs...
OTS Koni's can handle any spring rate you throw at them... as long as the car is never driven
Christian, who thinks his Koni's are nearing the upper limit of damping with 500# springs...
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From: RIP Craig Jones
Re: Ground-control/Koni setup help (azian21485)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by azian21485 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">when i spoke with crx lee he said the ots yellows can handle near 1000lbs without needing to be revalved (dunno how long they'll last though)...maybe i'm remembering it wrong but i'm sure he can chime in</TD></TR></TABLE>
I think you're mistaken. I had 600# springs on the rear of my 91 integra, and it really was borderline too much spring for the shock (475# front). They were too soft, at the time I really wanted to revalve and go 600/900, but I didnt have the $$.
I think you're mistaken. I had 600# springs on the rear of my 91 integra, and it really was borderline too much spring for the shock (475# front). They were too soft, at the time I really wanted to revalve and go 600/900, but I didnt have the $$.
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From: Charleston, SC, USA
Re: Ground-control/Koni setup help (azian21485)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by azian21485 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">when i spoke with crx lee he said the ots yellows can handle near 1000lbs without needing to be revalved (dunno how long they'll last though)...maybe i'm remembering it wrong but i'm sure he can chime in</TD></TR></TABLE>
he said the same thing to me, but tempered it with the reminder that they will not be in their proper range and will wear out much faster..
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Track Rat »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The higher rear rates promote a little oversteer (loose) which helps deal with the front wheel drive (FWD) tendency to understeer (push). The 400/500 set up, with proper driver input, will not be an overly tail-happy car. It still pushes, but less than stock. Equal front/rear rates might work well with auto-x but would likely promote too much understeer to be effective on a road course. </TD></TR></TABLE>
he does have the bigger JDM rear bar though.. putting on a smaller front bar would allow him to easily run even rates if not front heavy..
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Integra_B18B »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I'm sorry for all the questions, just wanted some last minute input before I make my purchase and buy my suspension setup.</TD></TR></TABLE>
it's ok, we've all gone through this great debate.. hell, I just did.. I too was considering the GC/Koni route, but ended up with something different for now.. I bought a set of Omnipower coilovers in the 12k/10k setup for my track only ITR.. I can't comment on how they'll hold up in the salted roads of Chicago in the winter though.. if I was going the Koni/GC route and streeting the car, I wouldn't go over 500#(front heavy or rear heavy) and use OTS Koni Yellows.. then, once the car was going to be caged and track only, I'd rethink that setup and either swap springs and do a revalve on the koni's, or sell it all and purchase full coilovers.. Just my opinion, but I hope it helps..
he said the same thing to me, but tempered it with the reminder that they will not be in their proper range and will wear out much faster..
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Track Rat »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The higher rear rates promote a little oversteer (loose) which helps deal with the front wheel drive (FWD) tendency to understeer (push). The 400/500 set up, with proper driver input, will not be an overly tail-happy car. It still pushes, but less than stock. Equal front/rear rates might work well with auto-x but would likely promote too much understeer to be effective on a road course. </TD></TR></TABLE>
he does have the bigger JDM rear bar though.. putting on a smaller front bar would allow him to easily run even rates if not front heavy..
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Integra_B18B »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I'm sorry for all the questions, just wanted some last minute input before I make my purchase and buy my suspension setup.</TD></TR></TABLE>
it's ok, we've all gone through this great debate.. hell, I just did.. I too was considering the GC/Koni route, but ended up with something different for now.. I bought a set of Omnipower coilovers in the 12k/10k setup for my track only ITR.. I can't comment on how they'll hold up in the salted roads of Chicago in the winter though.. if I was going the Koni/GC route and streeting the car, I wouldn't go over 500#(front heavy or rear heavy) and use OTS Koni Yellows.. then, once the car was going to be caged and track only, I'd rethink that setup and either swap springs and do a revalve on the koni's, or sell it all and purchase full coilovers.. Just my opinion, but I hope it helps..
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From: Union, KY, USA
Re: Ground-control/Koni setup help (azian21485)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by azian21485 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">when i spoke with crx lee he said the ots yellows can handle near 1000lbs without needing to be revalved (dunno how long they'll last though)...maybe i'm remembering it wrong but i'm sure he can chime in</TD></TR></TABLE>
I think there has been some misunderstanding. For a Honda family car, you probably won't have much problem up into the 500-600 range with an OTS Koni Sport but it is a matter of use and taste. Some people are happy running much higher rates with the OTS valving, some will revalve for specifically desired more aggressive performance at lower spring rates than this. I would say by the time you got in the 700+ range, the OTS Honda valvings would have fully gone by the wayside. If the car is going to be primarily used on the street and the spring rate selection was going to be in the safe to borderline area, I normally suggest that you try the OTS valving for yourself first and see if it takes care of your needs. If it does, then fine and you go on having saved time and money and your normal warranty is intact. If you decide that the OTS valving is not enough whether now or years down the road, the cost of revalving does not change and you can have it done having proven that your usage and preferences require it.
The new Koni RACE dampers that we will have soon that are already pre-shortened and race valved, those you should have no issues whatsoever going to spring rates in the 1000 lb range or more within some reason. I am guessing that is where the misunderstanding would have come from as those 8041-XXXX RACE units will soon be available on the shelf.
I think there has been some misunderstanding. For a Honda family car, you probably won't have much problem up into the 500-600 range with an OTS Koni Sport but it is a matter of use and taste. Some people are happy running much higher rates with the OTS valving, some will revalve for specifically desired more aggressive performance at lower spring rates than this. I would say by the time you got in the 700+ range, the OTS Honda valvings would have fully gone by the wayside. If the car is going to be primarily used on the street and the spring rate selection was going to be in the safe to borderline area, I normally suggest that you try the OTS valving for yourself first and see if it takes care of your needs. If it does, then fine and you go on having saved time and money and your normal warranty is intact. If you decide that the OTS valving is not enough whether now or years down the road, the cost of revalving does not change and you can have it done having proven that your usage and preferences require it.
The new Koni RACE dampers that we will have soon that are already pre-shortened and race valved, those you should have no issues whatsoever going to spring rates in the 1000 lb range or more within some reason. I am guessing that is where the misunderstanding would have come from as those 8041-XXXX RACE units will soon be available on the shelf.
Thread Starter
New User
Joined: Sep 2001
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From: VanCity, BC, Canada
Re: Ground-control/Koni setup help (mstewar)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by mstewar »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
he said the same thing to me, but tempered it with the reminder that they will not be in their proper range and will wear out much faster..
he does have the bigger JDM rear bar though.. putting on a smaller front bar would allow him to easily run even rates if not front heavy..
it's ok, we've all gone through this great debate.. hell, I just did.. I too was considering the GC/Koni route, but ended up with something different for now.. I bought a set of Omnipower coilovers in the 12k/10k setup for my track only ITR.. I can't comment on how they'll hold up in the salted roads of Chicago in the winter though.. if I was going the Koni/GC route and streeting the car, I wouldn't go over 500#(front heavy or rear heavy) and use OTS Koni Yellows.. then, once the car was going to be caged and track only, I'd rethink that setup and either swap springs and do a revalve on the koni's, or sell it all and purchase full coilovers.. Just my opinion, but I hope it helps..</TD></TR></TABLE>
Yah, I was thinking about the Omnipower setup as well but didn't like the fact that they aren't adjustable dampening wise.
Thanks for your input, I forgot to mention that I have an ITR LSD as well.........
he said the same thing to me, but tempered it with the reminder that they will not be in their proper range and will wear out much faster..
he does have the bigger JDM rear bar though.. putting on a smaller front bar would allow him to easily run even rates if not front heavy..
it's ok, we've all gone through this great debate.. hell, I just did.. I too was considering the GC/Koni route, but ended up with something different for now.. I bought a set of Omnipower coilovers in the 12k/10k setup for my track only ITR.. I can't comment on how they'll hold up in the salted roads of Chicago in the winter though.. if I was going the Koni/GC route and streeting the car, I wouldn't go over 500#(front heavy or rear heavy) and use OTS Koni Yellows.. then, once the car was going to be caged and track only, I'd rethink that setup and either swap springs and do a revalve on the koni's, or sell it all and purchase full coilovers.. Just my opinion, but I hope it helps..</TD></TR></TABLE>
Yah, I was thinking about the Omnipower setup as well but didn't like the fact that they aren't adjustable dampening wise.
Thanks for your input, I forgot to mention that I have an ITR LSD as well.........
Thread Starter
New User
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 151
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From: VanCity, BC, Canada
Re: Ground-control/Koni setup help (CRX Lee)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by CRX Lee »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
I think there has been some misunderstanding. For a Honda family car, you probably won't have much problem up into the 500-600 range with an OTS Koni Sport but it is a matter of use and taste. Some people are happy running much higher rates with the OTS valving, some will revalve for specifically desired more aggressive performance at lower spring rates than this. I would say by the time you got in the 700+ range, the OTS Honda valvings would have fully gone by the wayside. If the car is going to be primarily used on teh street and the spring rate selection was going to be in teh safe to borderline area, I normally suggest that you try the OTS valving for yourself first and see if it takes care of your needs. If it does, then fine and you go on having saved time and money and your normal warranty is intact. If you decide that the OTS valving is not enough whether now or years down the road, the cost of revalving does not change and you can have it done having proven that your usage and preferences require it.
The new Koni RACE dampers that we will have soon that are already pre-shortened and race valved, those you should have no issues whatsoever going to spring rates in the 1000 lb range or more within some reason. I am guessing that is where the misunderstanding would have come from as those 8041-XXXX RACE units will soon be available on the shelf.</TD></TR></TABLE>
When will these new Koni RACE dampers be available on the market? Is there a timeline.........
I think there has been some misunderstanding. For a Honda family car, you probably won't have much problem up into the 500-600 range with an OTS Koni Sport but it is a matter of use and taste. Some people are happy running much higher rates with the OTS valving, some will revalve for specifically desired more aggressive performance at lower spring rates than this. I would say by the time you got in the 700+ range, the OTS Honda valvings would have fully gone by the wayside. If the car is going to be primarily used on teh street and the spring rate selection was going to be in teh safe to borderline area, I normally suggest that you try the OTS valving for yourself first and see if it takes care of your needs. If it does, then fine and you go on having saved time and money and your normal warranty is intact. If you decide that the OTS valving is not enough whether now or years down the road, the cost of revalving does not change and you can have it done having proven that your usage and preferences require it.
The new Koni RACE dampers that we will have soon that are already pre-shortened and race valved, those you should have no issues whatsoever going to spring rates in the 1000 lb range or more within some reason. I am guessing that is where the misunderstanding would have come from as those 8041-XXXX RACE units will soon be available on the shelf.</TD></TR></TABLE>
When will these new Koni RACE dampers be available on the market? Is there a timeline.........
Senior Member
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 30,826
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From: RIP Craig Jones
Re: Ground-control/Koni setup help (Integra_B18B)
I assume the 'Koni Race' dampers will be a revalved yellow, or equivalent to?
Will there ever be an 'OTS' 3011 offered? Are those even streetable (i.e. street = driving to the track and back).
Will there ever be an 'OTS' 3011 offered?
Are those even streetable (i.e. street = driving to the track and back).
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,144
Likes: 3
From: Union, KY, USA
Re: Ground-control/Koni setup help (Integra_B18B)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Integra_B18B »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
When will these new Koni RACE dampers be available on the market? Is there a timeline......... </TD></TR></TABLE>
They are all currently scheduled to be finished from production in the last two weeks of January 2005 in Koni Holland. Normal sea freight transit time will put them in the US in about the last week of February.
If we get many backorders booked by that time, we might be able to air freight some (very expensive) which can knock 2+ weeks off the freight time if US Customs is being cooperative.
When will these new Koni RACE dampers be available on the market? Is there a timeline.........
</TD></TR></TABLE>They are all currently scheduled to be finished from production in the last two weeks of January 2005 in Koni Holland. Normal sea freight transit time will put them in the US in about the last week of February.
If we get many backorders booked by that time, we might be able to air freight some (very expensive) which can knock 2+ weeks off the freight time if US Customs is being cooperative.
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 6,630
Likes: 1
From: Charleston, SC, USA
Re: Ground-control/Koni setup help (Integra_B18B)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Integra_B18B »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Yah, I was thinking about the Omnipower setup as well but didn't like the fact that they aren't adjustable dampening wise.
Thanks for your input, I forgot to mention that I have an ITR LSD as well.........
</TD></TR></TABLE>
the more i thought about it, the more i figured it was just another variable for me to potentially screw up.. and the price Robear had them for couldn't be beaten..
Aren't you going to get put in some crazy AutoX class with all these mods?
Yah, I was thinking about the Omnipower setup as well but didn't like the fact that they aren't adjustable dampening wise.
Thanks for your input, I forgot to mention that I have an ITR LSD as well.........
</TD></TR></TABLE>the more i thought about it, the more i figured it was just another variable for me to potentially screw up.. and the price Robear had them for couldn't be beaten..
Aren't you going to get put in some crazy AutoX class with all these mods?