I am curious if anyone is successfully running a B20VTEC in H1. Thoughts? Opinions?

Victor Penner

I am thinking that the perfect 'rod to stroke ratio' would be one that stroked at least until the end of whatever length rod you have.

 

Maybe. Depends what you mean by succesful.

Thoughts? Opinions? Don't have any. Many.

Scott, who subscribes to the short rod theory...er, I own one anyway...VICTOR!!!! Joo gonna break something!

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Victor Penner &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I am curious if anyone is successfully running a B20VTEC in H1. Thoughts? Opinions?

Victor Penner

I am thinking that the perfect 'rod to stroke ratio' would be one that stroked at least until the end of whatever length rod you have. </TD></TR></TABLE>

JDM #66 Kiwi

 

Pick up the recent issue of Honda Tuning and read the article about the Buckeye Battle.

There is a guy running a B20 and he talks about his experiences with different B series bottom ends and blocks. He went from a B16, to a B18, and upward.
It is good information, I forgot his name and I don't have the issue in front of me right now, but it is worth looking into. He has a blue Civic Si in the magazine.

If you contact him personally, I am sure he can shed some light on your questions.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Roadracejunkie &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Pick up the recent issue of Honda Tuning and read the article about the Buckeye Battle.

There is a guy running a B20 and he talks about his experiences with different B series bottom ends and blocks. He went from a B16, to a B18, and upward.
It is good information, I forgot his name and I don't have the issue in front of me right now, but it is worth looking into. He has a blue Civic Si in the magazine.

If you contact him personally, I am sure he can shed some light on your questions.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
chad=b20vtec *****

 

I wouldn't if I were you for reliability reasons of course. Unless you can limit yourself to a stockish redline, in which case it isn't gonna be all that fast

If H1 wasn't limited OEM internals I'd definitely see making a case for the B20VTEC.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Mike C &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Unless you can limit yourself to a stockish redline, in which case it isn't gonna be all that fast </TD></TR></TABLE>

You sure?

https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=965320

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by .RJ &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

You sure?

https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=965320</TD></TR></TABLE>

is that track/race proven?

 

the b20s seem to blow up frequently, if used hard.

cracked blocks can happen; i think helms has had at least one, maybe two cracked blocks. chad has been thru alot of motors (maybe blown up 7 or so?). sam at raceworks runs a b20, but i think he respects the 8k limit, plus i think they are proactive on the checkups and refreshes with that motor. curpiers have been thru quite a few engines, too, and i think they run ls-vtecs. i think evans runs an ls-vtec, and i think he blew at mid-o.

my ls lasted, but my shiftpoints were generally lower than 7800, and i wasn't making 200 whp.

the most reliable seem to be the factory vtec equipped cars (guess those honda engineers knew a thing or two?); b18c-anything seems good; b16 is reliable but not enough torque/horses.

the above is not conjecture, but what i have witnessed on the east coast.

if you go for an h1 b20, keep the revs reasonable (&lt;8k) and be prepared for routine inspection teardowns and rebuilds (bottom end bearings, rods, bolts).

good luck!

todd

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Todd Reid &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
the most reliable seem to be the factory vtec equipped cars (guess those honda engineers knew a thing or two?); b18c-anything seems good; b16 is reliable but not enough torque/horses.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

I have been coming to the same conclusion. I think that an H1 prepped B18C5 would be the better choice for the long run, ie; cost and reliability. But the seduction of all these FrankenB20bomberLSstrokejobTekkers is a great way to play "what if" on a rainy afternoon.

Victor Penner

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Victor Penner &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I have been coming to the same conclusion. I think that an H1 prepped B18C5 would be the better choice for the long run, ie; cost and reliability.</TD></TR></TABLE>

 

Yes Victor,
I have run the B20 V-Tec and made great power 253WHP but unfortunately the B20 Cylinder liners are so thin that they won't stand much of a pounding. We are currently using a B18 C BLock and they definitely last much longer. My current B Engine has not been pulled apart since the beginning of the season and it is still making about 230 at the wheels. in a 2450lb car. However,...
With the new Honda Cup rules you can sleeve the block and use decent Rods and Pistons... so we will probably do more experimenting for next season with the B20 Again.
Yes we will spend a little more money but we'll gain a lot more reliability.
Our engine builder is confident that he can get close to 300HP With reliability from the B20? I have no doubt that the 'B' will still be very competitive against the K-Series for a little while yet.
Watch for a detailed engine build up for our new 'Buddy Club' Sponsored 'Honda Cup' Si Civic in Honda Tuning magazine in the near future.

Kiwi

 

i like b20vtecs yo....im me if you want info.....


kiwi.....300 on an engine dyno....not on a chasis dyno!!!!

 

I thought you guys were just running the K series, my mistake. I have been doing a lot of reading and it does seem that a sleeved block could make a powerful, reliable engine.

I will look out for the mag! Keep me updated.

Victor Penner

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Victor Penner &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I have been doing a lot of reading and it does seem that a sleeved block could make a powerful, reliable engine.

I will look out for the mag! Keep me updated.

Victor Penner </TD></TR></TABLE>

Victor, you are 100% correct that a sleeved block would be more powerful/reliable race engine. However, under the current rule set for HC we are unable to sleeve our blocks.

-v/r,
LL

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by chad &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i like b20vtecs yo....im me if you want info.....

kiwi.....300 on an engine dyno....not on a chasis dyno!!!!</TD></TR></TABLE>


No Chad... AT THE WHEELS!!! just kidding...

I thought that I'd said Engine Dyno?

I'm looking for (reliable) Horse Power!!!


Kiwi

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by KIWI &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
I'm looking for (reliable) Horse Power!!!
</TD></TR></TABLE>

Joo sure you lookin in the right place?

Scott, who is lucky he's trapped in an ITR and a couple of stock motors...beyond that it looks pretty confusing and expensive...

 

Just to give props to the Honda engineers....the K series is maxed out the day it is sold off the showroom floor, with little room for rod stretching.

I think I'd pursue the same car the engineers at Honda are using in Ohio, the TL, it is 240hp in stock trim....granted a heavy car, but it can prove to be a formidable car and reliable.....At mid ohio, shanfeld and lucas got the car into 5th on sat and sun, with very little test time and still pretty much a stock car....look for this car at Thunderhill at the 25hr race. With a proper weight adjustment (rules), the car could prove to be reliable, fast, and fun, not to mention a great grocery getter off the track..lol

Anyone need experienced crew for the 25 hr? How about a driver for use in the 18th or 19th hour?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Roadracejunkie &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">....look for this car at Thunderhill at the 25hr race. With a proper weight adjustment (rules), the car could prove to be reliable, fast, and fun, not to mention a great grocery getter off the track..lol

Anyone need experienced crew for the 25 hr? How about a driver for use in the 18th or 19th hour?

</TD></TR></TABLE>

can't wait to see the car run, ill be there crewing for team RNR

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by chad &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i like b20vtecs yo....im me if you want info.....


kiwi.....300 on an engine dyno....not on a chasis dyno!!!!</TD></TR></TABLE>

hey Chad, didn't that one B20VTEC put down something like 246 whp.....or was it less......I cannot rmember

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by slammed_93_hatch &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">can't wait to see the car run, ill be there crewing for team RNR</TD></TR></TABLE>

Me too. It got painted last night and is getting an engine on Sunday if everything goes according to plan.

RNR was our team mates last year at the 25. Good guys all around.

 

It's a good combo but it needs a lot of TLC.

Considering the relatively low compression ratio it gave us it made good power (205hp & 148 ft-lb at the wheels, max power at 8,000). I typcially don't run wild cam profiles (we're using Stage 1's right now), and I spent a bunch on a header.

The problem with the B20 is, as others have said, weak cylinders. The B20 was used from the August Road Atlatna race on, and it's by far the torquiest engine I've run outside of an H series. It does require a lot of work to keep living if you leave the bottom end totally stock. We checked rod bearings after every weekend and usually ended up replacing one or two each time. It looks like the cylinders rock slightly under heavy load.

Resleeving and/or a block guard would probably fix this problem, but I'd still keep the revs low.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by RR98ITR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Joo sure you lookin in the right place?

Scott, who is lucky he's trapped in an ITR and a couple of stock motors...beyond that it looks pretty confusing and expensive...</TD></TR></TABLE>


Actuall Scott I'm looking in both places...
I know we can get it now from the 'B' Series... And we are still working on the K-Series... Time will tell on that.
Yet another 'K' bit the dust at the Time Attack last Tuesday... I'm really sorry to hear that, but not surprised!
I made a fairly bold prediction last night at a meeting.... Which can be varified if it comes to pass. I'll let you know what it was after this weekend... As I don't want to put a Hex on anyone before an event.

Kiwi

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by KIWI &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Actuall Scott I'm looking in both places...
I know we can get it now from the 'B' Series... And we are still working on the K-Series... Time will tell on that.
Yet another 'K' bit the dust at the Time Attack last Tuesday... I'm really sorry to hear that, but not surprised!
I made a fairly bold prediction last night at a meeting.... Which can be varified if it comes to pass. I'll let you know what it was after this weekend... As I don't want to put a Hex on anyone before an event.

Kiwi</TD></TR></TABLE>

Do let us know - not enough sharing around here.

I'd LOVE to have a RELIABLE 240-300whp...but since when I say Reliable I mean run for years with little attention, I doubt I'll ever have it out of a 4-cylinder Honda motor...and besides, I'd probably have to run a 245 or 265 front tire to make it work.

Doood! You don't put Hex's on your competitors before a race? Joo gotta get more serious. Joo wanna win don't you?

Scott, who says "Joo gotta get on the right side of Raceaflais....and don't **** him off by modifying ****"...

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by RR98ITR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Do let us know - not enough sharing around here.

I'd LOVE to have a RELIABLE 240-300whp...but since when I say Reliable I mean run for years with little attention, I doubt I'll ever have it out of a 4-cylinder Honda motor...and besides, I'd probably have to run a 245 or 265 front tire to make it work.</TD></TR></TABLE>

300hp eh Scott? (NA I'm assuming since joo is a rac0rz)? Then you'd have to worry about axles, traction, some 285 tyres, LSDs, and the fact that with that much power you might as well have ... ... RWD? :runs and hides: Although seeing the SVWC cars on RA-1 - sure, who wouldn't want that much reliable power?

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Doood! You don't put Hex's on your competitors before a race? Joo gotta get more serious. Joo wanna win don't you? </TD></TR></TABLE>

It's all coming together now. Scott = Voodoo Priest = the world makes sense again.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Scott, who says "Joo gotta get on the right side of Raceaflais....and don't **** him off by modifying ****"...</TD></TR></TABLE>

Raceaflais....race-a.... blah. I'm going back to work. That one hurt my head....