What is the average price of a new NSX, what can you talk one down to now a days?

 

85 if you're paying cash, pretty much cuts off the tax

 

Ehhh, don't know about that. I've seen new NSX's for as low as 77k.

 

Dealer cost is about $80K, before deducting the holdback or the current $5K dealer incentive. If you can get one for $77K, that means that the dealer is only making $2K plus the holdback on the sale - that's a really great price. $78-80K is probably more realistic.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by nsxtasy &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Dealer cost is about $80K, before deducting the holdback or the current $5K dealer incentive. If you can get one for $77K, that means that the dealer is only making $2K plus the holdback on the sale - that's a really great price. $78-80K is probably more realistic.
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So, you're saying they are only making $3k$-5k proft on an $80,000 car? If that was the case, they wouldn't be making them.
Dealers make a bigger profit on the Z06.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Gunblade99 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">So, you're saying they are only making $3k$-5k proft on an $80,000 car?</TD></TR></TABLE>

No. Apparently you didn't read my post. I didn't say that ALL cars sell for that amount. I'm saying that that would be a good deal, and SOME cars sell for that amount. I'm sure there are other bozos who walk into the dealership and pay $85-90K, so the dealers make over $10K on some people, and as little as $3-5K on others. Occasionally even less (for all kinds of reasons).

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Gunblade99 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">If that was the case, they wouldn't be making them.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Funny, people also say that if they weren't making money on them, they wouldn't be making them.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Gunblade99 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Dealers make a bigger profit on the Z06. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Sure they do - because the Z06 was discontinued, and dealers generally make a bigger profit selling used cars than they do selling new cars.

 

The acura dealer here in Modesto is selling theirs for $96k.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by viatech &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The acura dealer here in Modesto is selling theirs for $96k.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I think what you mean is that they are asking $96K. At that price, they won't be selling it at all.

 

There is black on black one here at the Acura dealership I used to work at for $90,000. It's a 2004 with 36 miles.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by MAD ITR 55 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">There is black on black one here at the Acura dealership I used to work at for $90,000. It's a 2004 with 36 miles.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Okay, when you guys say that that's what the price is - how do you know this?

The reason I ask is, a lot of our dealers around here will put a car on the showroom floor, and they'll put a sticker in the window showing MSRP or sometimes even higher (due to add-ons or markup). But when you actually negotiate with them, it turns out they are willing to sell it for significantly less than the price on the window sticker - sometimes much, much, MUCH less. So even if the window sticker (or even an ad) says $90K, that doesn't mean they won't take less than that.

I doubt that any dealer - ANY dealer - with a new NSX in the showroom would turn down a legitimate offer of $85K for it. And some will take as much as $5-7K less than that (as noted above).

I can list my 1991 NSX on Autotrader with an asking price of $100K. That doesn't mean someone is actually going to buy it for that - or that I wouldn't accept a lower offer if I were actually serious about selling it...

 

Well,yes I'm talking about the sticker price. Not a cash offer or anything.

 

The price of the NSX shown on the Monroney sticker - that's the window sticker that's required by the federal government for all new cars - shows an MSRP of $89,765 for all 2004-2005 NSXs sold in the United States. That's why they call it the "sticker price".

Since the MSRP is only a recommended price, the dealer can then add a second sticker showing additional equipment, additional charges, and premiums or discounts from the MSRP to reach their own asking price. And, of course, they can then sell it for less than the price shown on their own sticker.

 

Well i work at an Acura Dealership and we have a Red with black interior brand new on the floor and sticker is 89,765 and its hard to talk the prices down on them but if you lease you might be able to get a good price....call if you really want one feel free to call me if interested im sure i can help you out better talking on the phone while i at work....it is in Texas though...call Vandergriff Acura in Arlington,Texas and ask for Matt Stuart

 

Very true. The problem, as stated by TopGear, is that most people aren't willing to pay these prices for a Honda. Most people with tons of money are looking to buy a name and need a "Pininfarina" badge. I personally feel that the car is worth it over those for the convenience that changing the oil is just as much $ as a normal Honda.

 

as much as I love the NSX, I would never pay $80k for it.

 

I sincerely doubt that people aren't buying the NSX b/c it's a "Honda." The more likely issue is that barely anyone is willing to buy a car that is not competitive with comparable halo sports cars. Now, if Honda exported the NSX-R the situation may be different.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Ponyboy &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The more likely issue is that barely anyone is willing to buy a car that is not competitive with comparable halo sports cars. .</TD></TR></TABLE>

Thats been my beef with them for ever. There beautifull, but just not a good value. Hell, I'm sure with just some basic boltons I could hang with &lt;an older&gt; one (and I would love to be blessed with that opportunity someday )

I'm too much of a cheap skate to own an NSX....I would be much more inclined to by an Elise.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by nsxtasy &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

No. Apparently you didn't read my post. I didn't say that ALL cars sell for that amount. I'm saying that that would be a good deal, and SOME cars sell for that amount. I'm sure there are other bozos who walk into the dealership and pay $85-90K, so the dealers make over $10K on some people, and as little as $3-5K on others. Occasionally even less (for all kinds of reasons).</TD></TR></TABLE>
I read it. I just think if the dealers sold them for $70,000, they'd still make a $10,000 profit.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by nsxtasy &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Funny, people also say that if they weren't making money on them, they wouldn't be making them. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Funny, you didn't get my point. If they were only making $5k per car, they WOULDN'T be making them. The price of parts and labor cost around $65k at most. That's how they make there profit.(even though the nsx will soon be killed off due to low sales caused by their bang for the buck(or lack thereof)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by nsxtasy &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Sure they do - because the Z06 was discontinued, and dealers generally make a bigger profit selling used cars than they do selling new cars.
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They weren't considered new. They bought them for the same price they would of bought them if they were staying in production. They would actually LOSE money if they sold it for less. Hell, the new C6 goes for $45,000 here. They Make less of a profit on that then they do on the NSX.

One thing I learned in business is that car manufacturers either mass produce major amounts of cars for a cheap price and less of a profit(average honda) or expensive high end cars for a higher price and more profit due to demand.

You said dealers make only a profit of $5k-$6k, which is the profit made on the average Accords. If honda was making just as much a profit on the accord as the NSX but in greater numbers, they wouldn't be stupid enough to continue selling the NSX. The way you make it out, you're saying Honda is willing to take a beating in sales by makeing a small profit just to make their costomers happy? Some of the higher end Porsche($190,000) are produced for $75,000. Don't tell me it would cost as much to make a NSX as it would a Porsche 911 Carrera GT? If that is the case, I feel bad for the future of Honda.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Gunblade99 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
You said dealers make only a profit of $5k-$6k, which is the profit made on the average Accords. If honda was making just as much a profit on the accord as the NSX but in greater numbers, they wouldn't be stupid enough to continue selling the NSX. The way you make it out, you're saying Honda is willing to take a beating in sales by makeing a small profit just to make their costomers happy? Some of the higher end Porsche($190,000) are produced for $75,000. Don't tell me it would cost as much to make a NSX as it would a Porsche 911 Carrera GT? If that is the case, I feel bad for the future of Honda.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I understand what your trying to say. But you have no idea of what your talking about. No honda dealership is making $5-6k off an Accord. None. Off any random Accord, the dealership would be lucky to make $400 profit after commissions are paid. Dealerships, generally, make very little(if any at all) money on selling new cars. That's mainly because any idiot can go on-line and pull up the invoices to use as a bargaining tool. But, they don't have to make a killing on a new car sales. They use that sale to get you in the door and to get you to come back. Because, they make there real money on service, parts and sales of used cars. It's that simple.

 

Actually, dealers do make a good profit on new car sales, even better in used car sales, and the best profit in financing. 5k profit on a new car is not unheard of and is entirely more likely on a used car.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Ponyboy &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Actually, dealers do make a good profit on new car sales, even better in used car sales, and the best profit in financing. 5k profit on a new car is not unheard of and is entirely more likely on a used car.</TD></TR></TABLE>

5K is not unheard of. But it is when your talking about a 20k Accord. Invoice for a 2dr LX is 19k and msrp is 20,500. So if sold for msrp, plus the dealer holdback of 600, were only talking $2100(unfortunately no one is paying msrp for an
Accord). That $2100 is not all profit. You still have to take into account the salesman's commissions, PDI and fixing any scratches and/or dents. Also, the longer a car is sitting on your lot, the less money you are going to make on it and the harder sell it will be. So maybe my estimate of $400 profit for the dealership is a little low, it does not exceed $1000. I know these are the numbers for Accords and not the NSX. However, the NSX is a tougher sale then the Accord. So expect the profit% to be equal to or less then that of the Accord.

This is just an example from my experiences. Just so everyone knows, the Accord I was using as an example was a new '04 4-cylinder 4-door lx. And it actually sold for $18,800.

 

Okay... if a dealer buys a car from the manufacturer for $80K, or if the manufacturer is running dealer incentives of $5-10K so that the dealer actually pays $70-75K to the manufacturer for it, and the dealer then sells the car for $70K, please explain how the dealer makes a $10K profit. Show your calculations, please.

Are you talking about the profit (gross profit, also called markup) that the dealer makes - the difference between what the dealer pays the manufacturer, and what they sell it to the customer for? Because that's what we've been talking about up to now.

Or are you instead changing the subject, and talking about the profit that the manufacturer makes? Because only the manufacturer pays for parts and labor. And if you're talking about the manufacturer, please explain exactly how you know how much Honda pays for the cost of parts and labor to produce the NSX. We're all waiting.

I think you ought to get a refund for your "business education" because you sure do get a lot of things wrong...

Sometimes true, sometimes not true. Sometimes a car manufacturer will sell an expensive high end car for less profit - occasionally (but not often) even at a loss - because they think it will bring more people into the showroom to look at the high end car and buy the mass produced cars. There's even a name for these high end cars that are developed and sold for this purpose: "halo cars".

I think you have a problem with math. But TrboInteg already corrected you on this.

Umm... do you understand the difference between the profit that a dealer makes on selling the car (what we were talking about until your post) and the profit that the manufacturer makes on manufacturing the car? Because you keep switching back and forth, from one to the other, totally mis-stating the actual numbers and confusing one with the other.

Oh, and incidentally, another thing they apparently left out of your "business education" is the development costs that the manufacturer incurs. You talk about parts and labor as though those are the only costs involved in producing the car. The development cost - the cost for all the designers and engineers to develop the car's styling and technology and manufacturing processes - is a fixed cost (that's a cost that isn't affected by the number they produce). On many cars, the development cost can be well over $500 million. They have to recoup this fixed cost by selling cars to dealers at a gross profit (markup) so that they charge a lot more than the parts and labor, just to pay for the development cost. Some cars don't do as well as expected in the marketplace, and never recoup their development costs, even though the manufacturer receives more from the dealer for the car than they actually pay for the parts and labor that go into the car.

Well... not exactly, and not typically. Yes, dealers make some profits on new car sales, but they are not where the real money is. TrboInteg got it exactly right - the biggest profits are earned in service and parts, and to a lesser extent, in used car sales. There are always exceptions, of course, but that's the typical pattern at most dealerships.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by nsxtasy &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Well... not exactly, and not typically. Yes, dealers make some profits on new car sales, but they are not where the real money is. TrboInteg got it exactly right - the biggest profits are earned in service and parts, and to a lesser extent, in used car sales. There are always exceptions, of course, but that's the typical pattern at most dealerships.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I don't agree. Dealerships make money a variety of ways. The purchase price of the new car, the likely trade-in, finance and insurance, service contracts (i.e. rustproofing), and parts and service. The amount of profit varies from each profit center because of negotiation, type of car (as TrboInteg pointed out), blah blah blah, etc. If you don't want to think dealers don't make good profit on the sale of a new car then that's up to you. But as I said before, "5K is not out unheard of." For instance, the TSX, TL, and RL all have good profit margin, close to 3K, that's even further augmented by whatever the buyer is trading in. In addition, there's profit built into any destination charges you have to pay (though not much). Finance has the profit margins b/c virtually all of that particular service/department/center is profit (sans compliance costs). And 99% of the time, and the remaining 1% is b/c those dealerships aren't being run right, the finance dept is the largest profit center at dealerships. So "not exactly" and "not typically" isn't altogether accurate.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Ponyboy &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">For instance, the TSX, TL, and RL all have good profit margin, close to 3K</TD></TR></TABLE>

If they're sold at MSRP. Which they usually aren't.

And $3K isn't $5K.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Ponyboy &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">that's even further augmented by whatever the buyer is trading in.</TD></TR></TABLE>

The trade-in contributes to the profit from used car sales.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Ponyboy &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">there's profit built into any destination charges you have to pay (though not much).</TD></TR></TABLE>

Not true. 100 percent of the destination charge shown on the Monroney sticker is billed to the dealership as part of the invoice cost.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Ponyboy &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">And 99% of the time, and the remaining 1% is b/c those dealerships aren't being run right, the finance dept is the largest profit center at dealerships.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Not true. 99 percent of the time, the service department is the largest profit center at dealerships, and used cars are second. Ask the GM at your local dealer (or dealers, if you know more than one) and tell us what he says.

 

Ok, out of everything you Acura's you listed, the only one that is going to get MSRP is the RL because it's a complete new redesign for '05. So you can get your full asking price for that. But If you have any '04 RL on your lot - chances are you will lose money or just break even on those after all is said and done. When ever a new model or complete redesign comes out, your can hold $3K gross. Where doing that on the new '05 Odysseys now. That will be short lived however, because vehicle sales slow down this time of the year and when they pick back up in the spring the novelty will have worn somewhat off. It's the nature of the beast!

Service contracts give the dealer a chance to make some extra money, however they are not automatic income. There are times where we sell those at cost just to make a customer happy. And if a customer ever cancels those, it also cost's us money.

I don't know who informed you that finance is the money maker of a dealership. But they are sadly mistaken. Finance does make money, but ours and ever other finance person gets paid very well to do what they do.

Dealerships spend a lot of money. Selling NEW cars is just how they get you in the door. They want your return visits for all your parts and service needs. @ $105 an hour that we charge for service, that is where dealerships make there money.