i have a 96 ex coupe (f22B1) and i wanted to improve the street performance (such as 30-70, "seat of the pants feeling") just a way to make the car feel faster on the street without sacrificing drive-ability. yes, i have an intake and exhaust (no point in a header, the Ex header is a pretty good design) and i was looking into a camshaft from Gude performance. in addition to that, i want to have the compression bumped up from the stock 8.8:1 to something around 9.5-10.5:1. can this be achieved by decking the block or do pistons have to be purchased? i suppose a fuel controller and some dyno tuning would be a good idea as well (apex-i v-afcII). what do you guys think? anyone used that camshaft? and if so, what are your thoughts on it? by the way, i have an auto tranny and i really wanna stick with it, so i think there can be a little performance gained from a better torque converter? (converter and performance auto tranny kits available from level10 performance) thanks a lot guys
Mark

 

Why not look into turbo-ing it? For the power gains your looking for you can run about 6-8 pounds of boost to the motor as is. Talk to a local tuner or run a search. There are several members here with boosted F22's.

My auto F22 dynoed at 127whp with I/H/E, AEM rail and regulator, and VAFC. (It was 93 before the VAFC was tuned).

So in your case I'd say go ahead and get the VAFC.

 

yeah, it would be good, like a "disco Potato" (garrett gt28rs) would be a great turbo, but theres a lot of parts involved in a turbo kit:

manifold
turbo
downpipe
IC piping
intercooler
upgrade fuel pump
fuel pressure regulator
boost controller
fuel controller
upgraded radiator (i live in texas and it gets a little toasty)
oil lines
MAP bypass
Bypass valve (BOV)
finally....someone to do all that work for me (i'm only 17 and that's a little too advanced for me)

the cheapest kit ive seen is 1800 bucks, and it doesnt use an intercooler (only 5 PSI), and the more reasonable DRAG turbo kit ive seen for about 3K and up (for stage 1)

what i was thinking was to buy the complete head package from gude, which is $1550, it claims 50-60 HP at the wheels (which could have more squeezed out with the VAFC) and it includes all mentioned in the website, but i'll write it anyway:

Ported & Polished high compression cylinder head with parabolic three-angle valve job.
Big Bore Throttle Body
High Performance Cam Shaft
Bored out Intake Manifold

http://www.accordperformance.com/complete-head-package.html

so here's the comparison of the extra parts involved(extra meaning it wouldnt replace the stock part):
turbo:12 Gude Package: 4 (injectors fuel pump, fpr, VAFC)

What do you guys think?
Mark

 

You have great ideas but not enough research. Gude is a terrible company. They have bad rep here, just do a search on Gude on the site. 1 out of 10 people are happy. For the money that you'd spend, you can build your own setup. Find a REPUTABLE (read:i got fucked in the ***) tuning shop to help put it together for you and you can spend less than 2 grand if youre lucky. And it will be custom, so you can gank parts off of h-t members and mix and match to YOUR specs.

 

you do have a point with that....i'll look into it more, i guess i got a little too excited

 

you need to set a horsepower goal and stick with it...the f's can hold a good 7 ~ 10psi safely on stock internals (granted they are in good condition). when you get into the higher horsepower and psi ranges you will need to look into new rods/pistons/cylinder sleeves, etc... this is going to run you a good bit of money as well, and if you are not going to install it expect a lot more to be spent on the installation. fuel management is the most important thing....DO NOT scimp on this crucial factor. do a LOT of research in this area of turbo...it will pay off in the end i wish you the best of luck (as im doing the samething)

 

i really want to stay NA though, and i've seen comparisons of cars on the same power level running 30-70 and all those part-full throttle accelerations. none of the turbo motors were faster, and its just my belief that the powerband can be tuned very well for street driving

(ex. if my compression was increased to about 9.7:1, if the timing was advanced at low RPM, the torque curve is lifted and flattened. that was in SCC mag on a K series though, but i believe the same principle applies) the reason i thought the idea for that head package was better is that the parts used all work in unison with each other, like they're better matched.

with turbo, you still have the lame stock camshaft profiles and the stock rather restrictive (as opposed to modified) cylinder head and intake mani. increasing boost pressure obviously won't help this, because the rest of the parts dont work efficiently enough with the turbo.

In my mind, the NA way for me (17 year old high school junior) just makes more sense. i think the idea of a turbo scares my dad too, even though he's not real informed, i could talk till im blue in the face about how turbochagers work and are a more efficient power-adder than superchargers (depending on your application of course) and how they can be safe.

Oh well, its just kind of depressing you see that kind of package and find out the company sometimes "refuses to pay back core charges" or installs parts incorrectly. anyone out there with a recommendation for a similar package?

Mark

 

You can build a junkyard turbo for roughly $600.... Talk to VRdrvr, he just finished his. And by the way, you know Allen is not the true ATX!!!

 

NA is going to kill the bank depending on what you do, of course. you're basically screwed on the cams...you can only get a regrind. Delta Cam has floated around a few threads. have you thought about swaping in the h22 and using that as a base? sure its 2k and some more to install, but you'll have a good base to begin with, and its DOHC which would greatly help. just dont expect to extract a lot of NA power out of your f22 unless you plan on putting down some major cash (in which case you could probably afford to bullet proof your bottom end and make a niccccce custom turbo kit with all the assorted goodies). good luck though

 

600 dollar turbo kit would be nice, what kinda turbo does it use? is it usually used parts?

 

doesnt VR have an f22a though? only way i see him doing a $600 kit is with the DSM manifold...wont fit on the f22bs damnit

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ATX96coupe &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> is it usually used parts?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Hence the name "Junkyard Turbo". Just PM VRDrvr, he'll give you all the details and a list of what you need

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by madd &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">doesnt VR have an f22a though? </TD></TR></TABLE>

You know what, I think your right Scratch that, but you could still use all the parts he used minus teh mani but it will prob cost you another $300+ (once you factor out the cost of the DSM mani and add the new mani)

 

wait wait, are you guys suggesting turbo kits? i've heard turbo kits just don't work very well with auto trannies at all. Maybe something like 5 psi or lower might work, but still, i've heard the auto just hates boost.

 

yeah, you could be right if you're talking about damage to the transmission. that's why i planned on buying a performance torque converter and a performance transmission kit (similar to your normal 'shift improver kit') from level10. im sure that might provide a little insurance for that. if ya'll disagree, let me know what you think, and an auto to manual is just outta the question for me, sorry. haha

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by WishILivedInJapan &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">wait wait, are you guys suggesting turbo kits? i've heard turbo kits just don't work very well with auto trannies at all. Maybe something like 5 psi or lower might work, but still, i've heard the auto just hates boost.</TD></TR></TABLE>

well that all depends on how your drive too. the honda autos suck...and transmission cooler *may* help prolong the agony. anything forced induction, or anything that makes more horsepower is going to be rough on the tranny. turbo kits are a waste of money seeing as you will most likely upgrade most of the stuff in it unless you just want to run low boost (in this case the junk yard kit is the best option if you have an f22). level 10 is good, but by the time you bullet proof your auto you could have a nice manual setup. you also have to send your tranny off to level 10 so if you're worried about down time then the level 10 deal is out of the question (2wk turn around i think). you have 5th gen like me which means that our generation has both the mounts for the manual and auto tranmissions. its simply unbolting it....put the new one on, and do your shift linkage stuff (of course there more, but youll have to do a search for the exact article). in the end, the manual swap is the best option, in my opinion. BUT, if your tranny is in good shape, buy a transmission cooler and only boost a low 5psi and dont try to redline it at every stoplight...you should be good

damnit i wish i had an F22 (Edit: F22A not B )


Modified by madd at 8:37 PM 10/2/2004

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by WishILivedInJapan &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">wait wait, are you guys suggesting turbo kits? i've heard turbo kits just don't work very well with auto trannies at all. Maybe something like 5 psi or lower might work, but still, i've heard the auto just hates boost.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Will you stop?

Honda auto trannies=the suck. Look at pro racers. A lot of them use auto trannies. Why? It doesnt lose boost like a manual does. They can keep the pressure going because they dont drop the gears when theyre shifting and momentarily lose rpms, thus boost.

Autos are GOOD for boost. Honda autos cant take more than 5-7psi. With a tranny cooler youll be able to run 5 psi for a year or two without any problems if you dont beat on it too hard.

 

pull your spare tire, and jack. pull out your rear seat, because they are almost useless to our coupes . and take off your centercaps, you might feel something doing that lol

 

I had a bigger boost swapping my header out for a 4-1 and installing a straight pipe than i did with an intake and exhaust.

 

get a ***** for a shift ***