i'm settin up for sts for next year. i'm tryin to figure out what rates to run. i got a suggestion of 400f/400r as apposed to my 400f 550r. any input?
tis goin into a '91 civic hatch

You realize that high of a spring rate is going to be ROUGH especially on a Civic hatchback. I recommend 350/400 or 375/425 and lastly 400/450. Just make sure you get some good shocks for those. At that high of a rate you are going to blow most shocks.

i know i need to get shox. as for the rates, i have no idea what to run since i've only had the car for a year and have been hunting in HS trim all year. i don't mind a super stiff car. i have another car i could daily drive if its too stiff for street usage. but i want to know whats gonna handle well
-spencer who is realizing that sts is gonna be hell o set up for

Is this a daily driver or autox only car? If daily driver, get rates something like 300/350 (ft/rear). If just autox car, then go for something like 375/450. If that still isn't enough, go for 400/500.

On street tires, you shouldn't need any rates over 500lbs on that car since it is pretty light.

its an autocross only car with its street driving being to and from events. i may drive it to work or school, but thats only 15 min. i think i will go with sub 400 rates so i can run off the shlf koni ir maybe illumina.

I have 400/450 on my Si. Wouldnt go any lower than that,,,esp for an autoX only car.

His 91 hatch is quite a bit lighter than your 00 Si, so he can get by with a little lighter rates if need be.

Spenser,

I'm running 400F 300R and car is quite drivable and the Koni's stifen up the rear quite nicely when needed...

I'd be more than happy to give you a ride at the Sept 1 NNJR event so you can see if you like it..

Jeff
[edit: event date]


[Modified by jasyatz, 10:16 PM 8/1/2002]

cool cool. i will definately take u up on that ride. are u runnin a rear bar?

jasyatz-what are you running as far as camber adjustment??
-spencer

give me vehicle weight. both overall vehicle weight and the weight the front tires are going to carry. also give me motion ratio and i can tell you the "highest" (loose term) spring rate street tires will handle. i ran the 400/300 setup on my car (2250 lbs) and felt it was under-sprung. but then, i'm sick in the head and run road race springs on the street.

nate

91 civic hatch.
total weight is 200-2100
don't know wher f/r split
will be on azenis
thinkin of somethin like 400f/r or 350-380f 400r

not enough spring. 550fr/450rr.

Whatever rate you end up running, shoot for a 2f/3r ratio between rates. For example: 300f/450r, 400f/600r, etc. Any less spring in the rear and you will be hunting for steady state oversteer. BTW, 300f/450r is decently streetable, and you don't have to get your adjustable struts re-valved.

Spencer,

Jeff and I are running the same setup, 400F/300R on Koni Sports. The rear bars are 22mm in diameter... Mine being a TypeR and his being an adjustable ST unit.

As for camber adjustment, that's based on ride height with the GC units we have. I personally don't like any of the plates available... Based on conversations I've had with people, the set screws that hold the adjustment always seem to work themselves loose. And since the bolts themselves aren't that "beefy" you can't really torque them down all that much either. A proper lowering will yield -1.2 ~ -1.5 degrees of negative camber. The Azenis' like that from a performance/wear standpoint!

Anthony "Mario" Crea

A stiff hatch in the rear will definately cause the rear to hop on street tires. There's just not enough weight back there...

Seen a CRX run on streets (Uncle Ray) in CSP and the car was undrivable. The only time his 600lb rear spring rates really worked well was on fresh 13" Hoosiers. But at $700 a set, his were always "spent". If you plan on running an entire season in STS and want the car to handle when cold and wet (i.e spring and fall), I would run a softer rear spring and the adjustable bar. You can tune the car with tire pressure, shock settings, toe settings and rear bar adjustment and still have a decent street ride. Otherwise go as stiff as you can stand it, but beware of sudden snap oversteer. We've tried a bunch of stuff, and found this to be the best setup for my style.

Camber should be between 1.2 and 1.5 negative and this will yield a 2" drop or so.. Just remember to set the Koni's to their highest perch setting and the Coil over lower spring perch somewhere in the middle. Preserves the threads and will keep the collars from cracking.

Besides, with the 2 pins in my back, any stiffer makes my legs go numb..

Jeff

imho, overly stiff rear bias=snap oversteer. every civic and crx i've seen with a high rear bias has fought with snap oversteer. of course, so have cars that were lowered to much with not enough spring.

anthony, when did you switch to gc's??? weren't you running some sort of off the shelf lowering spring last rear when you came up this way??

nate

excellant. thank you guys so much for all the info.
-spencer

670lb front/580lbs rear here. with 26mm rear bar. no problems with oversteer, in fact i usually run smaller tires in the back. but, then again, i have a killer lsd...

Nate,

I switched at the end of last summer, so I was on GC's in Rome. I'm curious as to how your car weighs 2250 and mine weighs 2190... 60 lbs. between a DX Coupe and your EX Coupe seem too close.

frankly, i'd like to know why too. theoretically, my car was supposed to weigh about 2400-2500lbs. i think my car came through as some sort of freak.

yea, i thinkl i'm gonna go with 400f/300r w/ the rear bar and koni's (if i van affoaer them) and see how it works out. unfortunately, i will be daily driving the car since my daily driver gave up the ghost and i just couldn't put any more money into it. so i will have to run a spring rate thats softer in the rear. now, what to do about more power............70hp isn't quite gonna do it


[Modified by SOLOef, 8:09 PM 8/4/2002]

Considering that the question is regarding the STS class, I would say that anything above 450# is overwhelming for street tires (even Azenis... ). It appears that some suggestions apply to R-compound tire equipped cars.

I am thinking about changing to 375/400 or 350/400 when the time comes.

with a front motion ratio of about 46%, 450lb springs work out to a wheel rate of about 200lbs/in. from experience, i know the azenis and most other high performance street tires will hold more then that.

nate
trying to figure out just how bad my 800lb fr/675lb rr (revalved koni's) dsp setup is going to drive on the street.