i was reading the sts rules. apparently it is legal to swap things from other years/trim levels as long as the cars are on the same SP line. with that said, it should be legal to put the si engine from the 88-91 civic/crx into the std civic. they are both on the same sp line (csp). am i reading these rules correctly?
-spencer

 

The answer is a resounding "maybe". This language makes my head hurt:
"including those items required by emissions regulations for a particular configuration. Example: the Neon throttle body used on automatic transmission cars cannot be used on a manual transmission car. Component parts of these units may not be interchanged."

I still haven't figured out why that Neon TB wouldn't be legal. Maybe that language is to enforce engine swaps as a complete unit (including TB, intake, etc)? I dunno.

 

Should be but you have to do the whole engine, i.e. not jsut the intake or cams.. the whole thing.

 

oh, i know. if it were legal, i would definately do it
-spenc

 

ok then what about brake swaps

 

If it is on the same line then you can do it. For instance my del sol is listed as one line in DSP classifictaion, Since the Del Sol S comes with Drum brakes I coudl take My Si with disc's and put those drums on the car.. or they could put the rear disc's on there car.

 

Also, say you have a 1993 Prelude S withe F series engine, small brakes, thinner wheels, etc. Can you swap in a 1993 H22, bigger VTEC brakes and wider wheels? Also, what if you ran in S trim one year, then swapped, would you still be in the same class (considering you were in STS). I think people would be upset that you have gotten signifacantly faster with the same car.

 

IF they are on the same line yes.. i.e.

DSP
93-97 Del Sol
94-2001 Integra (non type-r)

The Del Sol and the Integra are on the same line.. howver the you cannot not put Integra Parts on a Del Sol they are on two diffrent lines. And just cause it is the same type of car does not mean it is on the same line.

 

according to the rule book, its all legal. people are always doing the drum to disc swap in sts. i think this is a part of the rule that people haven't looked into yet. it has possibilities.
-spencer

 

Actually I though about going the other disc, to drums in the rear, the rear drum setup is supposidly 10to 20 pounds lighter than disc brakes.

 

I thought it included the trans with the engine. You can update the engine/throttle body on the neon, you just need to bring over the automatic trans *** well. If I remember correctly.

Spencer,
I pretty sure (might check with howard duncan) that if you do the whole engine and tranny you should be ok (according to SP rules).

 

See, it gets weird because the Civic Si is on a listing by itself and the CRX Si is illegal for STS.

Before you do the swap, be for certain that the update/backdate is a legal one.

Start with an email to Howard Duncan at the Scca and see what he has to say. Detail everything you are going to do (class, car, swap, etc).

 

matt-this is what i'm figuring. i have the 1.5 4 speed. the si has 1.6 with about 38 more hp and the 5 speed has better gearing. i was thinking of just doing the trans, but since this looks promissing, i will do the whole engine and trans swap. this way when i get beat in sts, i will have no excuse .
-spencer

 

FWIW, the automatic Neon throttle body is substantially larger than the one used on the manual. It's apparently a pretty good power-adder for the manual-equipped cars, but not legal since TBs aren't open for upgrades in STS.

 

First of all... I hope this goes through for you... the STS 89 SI I drove this weekend rocked!!! the car was incredible. It almost made me look good (not good enough for first but still pretty damn good).

I checked moutons http://www.moutons.org/sccasolo/Lists/2002/stprepc.html they actually have the two listed seperately (the SI and NON-SI)... so I decided to whip out the rules PDF (I'm a geek). There it is in plain black and white
"Civic '89-'91" with no distinction between models.

I got this for you too... Howard Duncan's e-mail address, what he says pretty much goes so just ask him.
Hduncan@scca.com

 

Gee, sounds like what I just said three posts ago

Also, there was an update in a Fastrack a few months ago about the 88-91 Civic listing. You may want to check back issues of that.

 

You don't know me well enough to realize that I'm the master of restating the obvious!
I actually repeated myself as well from the post right before yours!

NOTE : Anyone trying to get useful info out of this thread please disregard this post...(I should have put this note at begining of the message maybe...)

 

It's legal...Just do the motor and trans as a unit...

Make sure you swap out the DP ignition for the MPFI setup and make DOUBLE sure, you use the SI cam...


Spencer, The rear disc swap is definately NOT legal..Disc brakes were not offered on a Civic Si or EX for that matter until 92/93...

Matt...heard you drove quite a car over the weekend...Sorry I missed it...

Jeff
[edit: clarify disc swap rule]


[Modified by jasyatz, 9:35 PM 8/19/2002]

 

Jeff -
I have nothing but good things to say about that car, except the following. We were still trying to figure out tire pressures. The camber was a off from the left to right side (I'd say a .5 degree difference left to right in the back). It needs an alignment. Brakes REALLY needed to be bled. other then that the car was a dream.... it will be VERY quick when done. whew! It also reminded me on how much I miss my car...

Spencer -
If you need a hand dialing in the car after the swap and suspension go on... just let me know!

 

oh for sure. i'm all about whoring out my car i don't know if the engine will get sone by next year, but the suspension will be in for sure. seeing the times you guys ran in that civic made me realise i have alot of work to do both with the car and with my driving.
-spencer......going back out to try to get my half shaft in

 

I *URGE* you to triple-check to make darn sure that swap is legal. Some guy local to me put a 92-95 Si motor in his DX and called it an STS car. Everyone he talked to said it was ok. However, it certainly is not for that car/motor if you read the SP update/backdate closely.

 

But, it should be a legal update/backdate, as all Neons are listed together in the appendix. The only thing making the TB swap illegal is the screwball language in the STS update/backdate rule (ie, the TB isn't emmissions legal, whatver the fuq that means).

 

yup...i know..i got a 92-95 dx..i have been trying to see what it is i can take from the ex/si and u know what..NOTHING...the si/ex/lx are on the same line.

the dx, cx, vx are all "92-95 NOC" on the same line..great..i can trade parts with a cx and vx..woopdedoo. mommy all i wanted was rear disc.

 

well, i e-mailed howard duncan and he said its legal.
-spenc

 

Oh-Yeah!!!!! now things start getting REAL interesting! Good luck, Spencer! you're about to enter a whole new realm with that car.