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B16/B18 hybrid a.k.a. Poor Man's Type-R engine
Anyone on here done one of these builds? I recently acquired a complete B16 swap for a very good price, only downside is the engine has knock. Previous owner thinks it's the rod bearing(s) but I haven't had the chance to open it up yet and inspect. Either way the bottom end will need to be replaced/rebuilt.
Doing some research, it seems like it's possible to bolt up Vtec block from GSR, with different pistons (to increase compression), ITR cams (or BC stage 2 cams), dual valve springs, and a mild port and polish to the B16 head (to match ITR setup) - which would net similar power levels to the ITR b18. Using the online compression calculator it looks like compression ratio of 10.8:1 should be fairly safe (running B18c block and crank, B16 head, USDM ITR pistons (P73), B18 connecting rod, and OEM head gasket). For comparison USDM ITR runs 10.6. It would be tuned with Hondata on 93oct. So, couple of questions: 1. Would stock USDM B16 ECU be able to run this setup for about 50-100 miles under normal driving conditions (i.e. no hard pulls and taking it to redline)? My state requires emissions testing and it wouldn't pass with Hondata. The idea is to swap in stock ECU, O2 sensors, and cat, drive around to set readiness, pass emissions, then put Hondata back. Does that seem realistic? 2. Could I run a slightly higher compression ratio, something like 11.2 safely on 93 octane without any knock? Reliability and longevity of the engine is the main priority as this car will be used for track and very likely time trials, so I'm not after getting every bit of power out of it. 3. Is 190-200whp a realistic expectation? Sorry for the long post and thanks in advance. |
Re: B16/B18 hybrid a.k.a. Poor Man's Type-R engine
Originally Posted by SonicC
(Post 51690556)
Anyone on here done one of these builds? I recently acquired a complete B16 swap for a very good price, only downside is the engine has knock. Previous owner thinks it's the rod bearing(s) but I haven't had the chance to open it up yet and inspect. Either way the bottom end will need to be replaced/rebuilt.
Doing some research, it seems like it's possible to bolt up Vtec block from GSR, with different pistons (to increase compression), ITR cams (or BC stage 2 cams), dual valve springs, and a mild port and polish to the B16 head (to match ITR setup) - which would net similar power levels to the ITR b18. Using the online compression calculator it looks like compression ratio of 10.8:1 should be fairly safe (running B18c block and crank, B16 head, USDM ITR pistons (P73), B18 connecting rod (You MUST use a GSR/ITR connecting rod, as in B18C1/5), and OEM head gasket). For comparison USDM ITR runs 10.6. It would be tuned with Hondata on 93oct. So, couple of questions: 1. Would stock USDM B16 ECU be able to run this setup for about 50-100 miles under normal driving conditions (i.e. no hard pulls and taking it to redline)? My state requires emissions testing and it wouldn't pass with Hondata. The idea is to swap in stock ECU, O2 sensors, and cat, drive around to set readiness, pass emissions, then put Hondata back. Does that seem realistic? It likely wouldn't pass emissions with the B16A ECU... you would probably be better off trying to use an ITR (P73) ECU to get the car tested. 2. Could I run a slightly higher compression ratio, something like 11.2 safely on 93 octane without any knock? Reliability and longevity of the engine is the main priority as this car will be used for track and very likely time trials, so I'm not after getting every bit of power out of it. A good tuner can make that happen. 3. Is 190-200whp a realistic expectation? Depending on the dyno... yes, realistic. Sorry for the long post and thanks in advance. |
Re: B16/B18 hybrid a.k.a. Poor Man's Type-R engine
This is the same setup I am running currently, except with GSR cams instead of ITR.
I agree with JR, it probably will need a basemap/ecu from a GSR or ITR to run decently. |
Re: B16/B18 hybrid a.k.a. Poor Man's Type-R engine
JRCivic1
I did mean to write B18c connecting rod, I figured non-vtec b18 rod wouldn't work anyway. Didn't even think of running ITR ECU...I'll have to see if it's even possible to hunt down one of those. Per post below, maybe GSR ECU would work as well? Thanks for the info!
Originally Posted by 2x0
(Post 51691360)
This is the same setup I am running currently, except with GSR cams instead of ITR.
I agree with JR, it probably will need a basemap/ecu from a GSR or ITR to run decently. |
Re: B16/B18 hybrid a.k.a. Poor Man's Type-R engine
Originally Posted by SonicC
(Post 51691415)
How do you like your setup and how is it with GSR cams? What ECU/tune are you running?
I'm running Hondata S300 v3 on a P28. |
Re: B16/B18 hybrid a.k.a. Poor Man's Type-R engine
Thanks for the info, man. I tried to find some people locally who may have done similar builds, but it seems all the hybrid builds are LS/Vtec
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Re: B16/B18 hybrid a.k.a. Poor Man's Type-R engine
It's 2018. This swap has been done 10 million times since the early 2000s.
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Re: B16/B18 hybrid a.k.a. Poor Man's Type-R engine
Originally Posted by NVturbo
(Post 51692342)
It's 2018. This swap has been done 10 million times since the early 2000s.
And technically you were supposed to use type R internals to call it a true "poor man's type R" but whatevs :shrug: |
Re: B16/B18 hybrid a.k.a. Poor Man's Type-R engine
Originally Posted by NVturbo
(Post 51692342)
It's 2018. This swap has been done 10 million times since the early 2000s.
Have you done it?
Originally Posted by 2x0
(Post 51692370)
And technically you were supposed to use type R internals to call it a true "poor man's type R" but whatevs :shrug:
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