Hey guys i just got back from the dyno and i have some issue i need help fixing, but first here is the setup.

JDM b16
Blox Intake Manifold
65mm TB
GSR Cams
AEBS Head Studs

GSR Tranny
ACT Clutch
Type R LSD

Inline Pro t3/t4 stainless manifold
GT28RS with ATP T3 housing .82 a/r
38mm wastegate 10psi spring no boost controller
3.0 Down pipe, 3.0 exhaust resonator, vibrant muffler
JRC 8in intercooler 2.5inlet/out
2.5 charge pipes greddy S BOV
1.5 dump tube under oil pan
780cc injectors
chrome pro 18.75 total timing at 10psi and low 11's in A/F


Now my problem is i'm not getting full boost till about 5k witch is way to late for this turbo. I built a pressure tester for my charge pipes and they all tested good, intercooler is good as well. My exhaust manifold to turbo, and DP, also the wastegate all sealed good with no carbon leaking anywhere. If anybody has any idea please let me know as i'm open to anything

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LehHR-rLvqE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YEwUvqaxMck

From the dyno i can see my vtec is set to low at 4800 and i will raise that up. Anybody have a good number?? 5400? 5500?

Any help is great guys


Modified by KevronsEG at 4:58 PM 7/3/2008


Modified by KevronsEG at 8:54 AM 7/4/2008

 

Dont be afraid of high 11's (or even low 12's if you're constantly monitoring) on the A/F ratio..

IMO

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 2point2 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Dont be afraid of high 11's (or even low 12's if you're constantly monitoring) on the A/F ratio..

IMO </TD></TR></TABLE>

 

You've got a 1.6L and a .82 hot side. Your spool is about where I'd expect.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SovXietday &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">You've got a 1.6L and a .82 hot side. Your spool is about where I'd expect.</TD></TR></TABLE>

was going to say the exact same thing...


might try 5200 for vtec....crazy ive got my Vtec set at 4500 in my gsr

 

any boost leak? You should be making more power at 10psi with this combo...

 

i made my own pressure tester and tested all my pipes and intercooler, they are all good. My down pipe, wastegate, and manifold to turbo are all sealed good with no carbon on them.

 

Please comment on why you tuned the car to low 11's..

To put it bluntly: there's really no need to scratch your head about your power levels when the car is not even tuned properly. If your engine is anything like mine it will wake right up the closer you get to low 12's.

Edit: Any of the tuning gurus want to confirm that low 11's could kill power? I feel like my comments are too bold for my limited experience.

 

low 11's WONT Kill power at all...maybe 1-5 HP from what buddies of ours have seen on the dyno. with a B-vtec, timing seems to kill power way quicker. i run my car in the high 10's on pump gas, just for giggles/safety, and always have, with my last several setups. my old D16a6 made amazing numbers for its stock head/cam (300.08/254), and i was in the high-mid 10s...

with the larger T3 housing, and a lil' b16, i think your kinda right-on here kevron... thats a decent sized turbo for a b16.. and the power seems pretty good for 10 psi, on that turbo... its not a crazy big number, but not low either.... good luck buddy!

 

The A/F is fine where it is, check this link out he had t3/t4 and then swapped in the gt28rs and had bad spool and he found boost leaka nd fixed made great power and spool. evans has almost same setup here and made better numbers and spool time(yes he did tune it but i should not be at the point i am)

http://forums.evans-tuning.com...t28rs

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 2point2 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Please comment on why you tuned the car to low 11's..

To put it bluntly: there's really no need to scratch your head about your power levels when the car is not even tuned properly. If your engine is anything like mine it will wake right up the closer you get to low 12's.

Edit: Any of the tuning gurus want to confirm that low 11's could kill power? I feel like my comments are too bold for my limited experience. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Yeah, like others have said you may lose a couple horses but it's really not that big of a deal. Once you start going low 10s the engine will start to lose more power though, I personally run my car low 11s high 10s at 17psi or so. Just a nice safety net.

Your torque graph looks a little strange though. Just seems to peak really late and your horsepower graph looks more like a supercharger graph. What I'm saying is, kind of looks like your getting some boost creep.

 

its no creep i had a 10psi spring in my wastegate. I had this same setup with a gsr block last year and it rocked my *** to to moon now with the 1.6 its all messed up. i woudl get 10psi by 4388 last year now its 5k. something is wrong. Jeff Evans said to check my flex section to see if its collapsed but i checked today and its all good so thats not it.

 

You decreased your displacement and you lost 600rpms of spool, that is normal, if you want the early spool back go to a .63AR.

Or you can do another boost leak check because you probably missed something small.

 

are you sure you have the right housing for the wheel you have in your turbo? if there is too big of a housing ,and too small of an exhaust wheel, it'll fit, it'll make boost, but it'll be WAY laggy... (too big of a gap around the wheel)

-suggestion from my brother


we ran into a situation kinda like this on splitimes setup, with his GT 2871R

 

Everything in the kit is good, cause its all the same as last year.I just changed the block out I DID check for leaks like i said before, i built a tester and checked them all day before the dyno. Could a faulty wastegate cause this? Mine is old and the diaphragm has a little kink on one side. Thanks for all the help guys i hope to find it soon.

kevin

 

you have to go to a .63 hot side for a quicker spool i had .82 hot on my h22 non bb and hit full boost @5200 and your motor is alot smaller. or get a good ebc or switch to hondata s300 you will pick up alittle more on spool. but you are getting a better top end with the .82 but good luck

 

kev, post up the d16 and b16 overlay with that turbo so they can see how it used to spool. Something is definitely not right, the question is what.

 

This is a over lay of my delsol dyno and my civic dyno. you can see how this turbo should spool, the lines match up great.

 

your spool times look about like waht mine did with the .82 on a stock block b16...

i really dont think low 11's has much to do with why the power output is kinda low...

get it up to about 11.5-11.8 and call it a day, no reason to wander into the 12's with a stock high comp block...

 

usually cross over on b16 are 5200 rpm. tRy 5000

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by pbomers &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">kev, post up the d16 and b16 overlay with that turbo so they can see how it used to spool. Something is definitely not right, the question is what.</TD></TR></TABLE>

same turbo, but a different housing, correct?

 

yes and no yes it had t25 flange and mine has t3 flange but the wheels and all that are the same its just so it bolts to the manifold and down pipe the wheels and trims are all the same.

check this out

had t3/t4 with .63 then went to .82 with better spool, low end power and peak power. i dont need a .63


Modified by KevronsEG at 10:06 AM 7/5/2008

 

If its not an exhaust leak (they'll be there even if you dont see carbon; it takes a while for that stuff to build up and even the smallest leak makes a big difference) then your ignition timing may be set a little low.
If you have the maps retarded under transition then it'll increase spool times pretty significantly; i can make the 42/48 t3 on my d16 spool like a big sc61 if i want

 

the T3 housing is not going to spool the same as a t25 housing... the t3 flows much better (more peak power, less spool)

the wheel being the same isnt the only thing that effects spool

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by redzcstandardhatch &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">the T3 housing is not going to spool the same as a t25 housing... the t3 flows much better (more peak power, less spool)

the wheel being the same isnt the only thing that effects spool</TD></TR></TABLE>

This is correct. Because the volute of the T3 turbine housing is a bit larger than the T25 flange-based turbo, there is a bit more volume of exhaust energy, but will slow down response time on the turbo itself. An EBC can be used in order to help with the response of the turbo by way of allowing the wastegate to open at the last second (by the gain). For a B16 engine w/ this size turbo, your numbers and powerband are about right.