http://www.d-series.org/forums/engin...aight-arp.html

 

you torque the nut NOT the stud lol.

 

It says right in that post torque in 2-3 steps.

 

yeah i know. but i think on another forum their was some argument about this ill try to find it.

 

argument solved 2 steps and breakage (ummhmm)

3 steps and pure sex

 

Ive gone to 85 in 2 steps. NEVER had an issue 40 and 85. No break (H series)... SOMETHING isnt being disclosed

 

no pics ??

 

Maybe they were overtorqued at some point in their past...

 

torquing in steps is merely to get consistent torque across the head, if you notice if you had a little further you can go, by torqueing them in steps you might see one or two of the studs actually turn a little bit more then you could hand tighten. Regardless of that, you are only supposed to hand tighten the studs in, thats the reason they have an allen key in the top, EVEN STILL....if you did torque the studs to 80 ft lbs rather then the nut on the stud....those studs are ridiculously hard to break.....

 

I stretched one.. ARP sent me one but it didn't fix the block it messed up. Stretch occurred on the 2nd torque step.

 

wow, this is quite a surprise

 

and how many times tq cycles has that one gone through

 

X2, i didnt think you'd be able to stretch one of there studs to that extent.

 

where the heck is the OP? this thread is two pages long and he hasnt even come back to give more info...

 

sorry guys ive been doing CRAZY **** lately....just closed on my first house yesterday and have had to put the project to the side for a few....ill get some pictures up tonight most likely...

 

it will be ok. all you need to do is go back and start over. double check your torque wrench for accuracy. then find a new stud.

 

It's not crazy if you know how friction works. You are more likely to over-torque a fastener in multiple small increments.

 

the ARP recommended torque sequence is 3 step, this is no OTHER method of doing it that is safer

 

Yes there is; two steps.

I'm pretty sure there was an older thread where the same thing happened and someone contacted an ARP representative regarding increments. IIRC, the response was that 3 steps are recommended because most of the time a person cannot achieve the sweep it takes to do it in two steps due to tight spaces, etc. but that two step would be better.

Look at the OEM. Most TTY stuff is done in two steps; a torque value and then a degree value. Why do the OEM's, with their huge budgets and extensive R&D, suggest two steps if three is safer?

 

these are not OEM "bolts", these are ARP aftermarket studs, and there is a reason that they recommend 3 steps, and i wouldnt recommend deviating from what ARP's paperwork says when it comes with the kit.

 

The threads don't know what brand they are. The principles of physics still apply. It's a matter of accuracy and precision in respect to friction.

Like I explained above. Sweep. Some applications make it so you need to do it in three steps, but if you can do it in two, even better.

Let's say the paperwork did say to do it in two steps, and you were working on something like a late model Camaro where the engine is halfway under the windshield. There is no way you are torqing the studs over cylinder #8 in two steps, but someone such as yourself would probably kill yourself trying and likely break a stud or two in the process.

I hate to say this but if you really know what you are doing, and you have the tools to measure what you need to measure, there are instances when you can deviate from what the instructions on the paperwork say. Fastening the cylinder head is an area I've seen this to be especially true when you can measure the clamp load different torque values put on the head gasket and the cylinder bore...

If you have a good logical explanation with at least some technical information as to why 3 steps are better than 2, I think we're all ears. If you're argument is because the paperwork says so, then I'll tell you right now we'll just have to agree to disagree.

 

your not supposed to torque the studs, your supposed to hand tighten the studs, anyone who "really" knows what they are doing, knows to follow the instructions that ARP gives them.

My good logical explanation is that ARP states to do it that way for a reason, they designed the bolts, and that is what they instruct that you do, do it improperly because you think your the man and you know "principles of physics", dont complain when **** breaks. lol

 

I did mine via the helms way, which is 3 steps, and just made the final torque to ARP specs.

25-50-70 iirc

 

I thought tty stuff was different than a normal fastener. its as if the manuf. is trying to ballpark fastener stretch with a degree measurement. I was told, not first hand that if you didnt yield the fastener's stretch it would be ok to use again. but I have always replaced tty fasteners as a one time only use. but have reused arp fasteners as long as I haven't stretched them past the designated torque specs they have given. Albeit no degree spec after a torque number, if that makes sense.

 

That is for stretch bolts which are designed to be used only once, unlike the arp studs.

Op - congrats on the house man, this is quite possibly the best time ever to buy with the low rates etc.