We purchased a 2002 Honda Civic for our teenage daughter about 9 months ago. It recently started occasionally running rough for about 10-30 seconds after a cold start--usually first thing in the morning. Took it into the local Honda dealership for diagnosis. They found that the head gasket was just starting to fail. They described that it was allowing coolant to seep into one of the cylinders when it sets overnight. Once that coolant gets blown out after you startup in the morning, then it runs fine the rest of the day.

OK fine. Replace the head gasket, mill the head, do a valve job, and while your at it replace the timing belt and water pump since they are coming due soon. For less than $2k all is good.

However, after pulling the head gasket they said you need a new engine (at a cost of nearly $4k). They said that at some point in the past the engine was overheated and the sleeves have become loose and rotated inside the cylinder. This had to have happened before we bought the car as it has not overheated or experienced any issues since we bought it, except for the recent issue with hesitation after a could start. They also said that the radiator looks to be less than 2 years old--possibly replaced by the previous owner after the same event that caused the overheating.

I asked to look at the engine and took the attached pictures. Supposedly the black line between the sleeve and the cylinder indicates that it has moved??? I ran my fingernail over the line and it felt completely smooth. Does this sound right?




Anyway, our options are:

1. Install new head gasket, button everything back up, hope for the best and run it till it dies--knowing that max we'll get another 20k miles on this engine due to the old timing belt. Cost of $750.

2. Go with the original plan of installing the head gasket, milling the head, doing the valve job, replacing the timing belt and water pump, etc. Basically doing a complete job but ignoring the condition of the cylinder sleeves. Might get another 100k out of it, or it might fail next week IF the sleeve slips and damages the new head gasket. Cost of ~$1800.

3. Replace the engine with a used 90,000 mile engine (warrantied for 6 months). Cost of ~$3800

What do you all think? What are the chances that a new head gasket on this engine will last? Do these little lines mean that the sleeve has rotated and/or will continue to rotate?

 

More Pictures:

 

Trace mark on gasket supposedly showing where coolant has seeped into the cylinder.

 

The sleeves look normal to me. I would slap a gasket on there and not look back. I think they are trying to hose you.

 

I've never heard of sleeves rotating before. Not in 10+ years I've been playing with Hondas.
I'd ask them to clean the block deck as best they can and go with option 2.
Option 3 Ehhh...
Option 1 only if you wanna sell it and get a different car.

 

Ask the technician to explain to you how the sleeve rotates when their is no force really being applied in that direction (circumferentially?)

How many miles On your engine again?
I'd like to add option 4. K swap! ��

 

Take the motor out, deck it if it's warped and do new rings and new bearings.

Parts are less than $400-$500.

Those prices sound OUTRAGES to me. I can do my own head gasket for about $80 with oem parts.

 

Yeah bro these motors are easy to work on. I would get the machine work done, turn some wrenches, and save some serious cash.

 

How can it rotate when it is connected to the other 3 sleeves next to it? Wouldnt they all "rotate" together then? Dealerships will do everything to hose you if they think you're a sucker and dont know the difference. It is seriously sickening and why I do my own work now...

 

I have never ever seen that problem ever. I cut these blocks and others everyday an I can absolutly say put a gasket on it and drive it.

 

That sounds like a serious hose job. Piston rings don't rotate and is why you index the gaps. If the rings don't rotate how in the hell would a sleeve rotate? There is no spinning forces... It's all up and down and a smidgen of one side to side (piston rock) motion.

Your dealership is up to something in my opinion.

Is the sleeve lower than the aluminum jacket?

That could be an issue.